2006-03-28
Madam Speaker Aagaard took the Chair at 10 am.
Madam SPEAKER: Honourable members, I have received from His Honour the Administrator Message No 8 notifying assent to bills passed in the February 2006 sittings of the Assembly.
Madam SPEAKER: Honourable members, I have received a Commonwealth Day Message 2006 from Her Majesty the Queen, dated 13 March 2006
Mr HENDERSON (Leader of Government Business): Madam Speaker, on behalf of the Chief Minister, I nominate Thursday, 30 March 2006, as the next day on which precedence will be given to General Business pursuant to Standing Order 93.
Motion agreed to.
Mr HENDERSON (Leader of Government Business): Madam Speaker, I move that leave of absence be granted to the member for Millner, Mr Bonson, for the remainder of this sittings week, and advise the House that Matthew has become a father overnight. I am sure all members would join with me in wishing Matthew and Mona - and I am not sure of the name of the new baby boy - all our best and congratulations.
Motion agreed to.
Mr HENDERSON (Leader of Government Business): Madam Speaker, I advise that the member for Daly will be performing the duties of the Whip for this sitting week.
Ms CARNEY (Opposition Leader): Madam Speaker, I move that leave of absence be granted to the member for Katherine, Mrs Miller, for these sittings due to ill health arising from a motor vehicle accident earlier this month.
Motion agreed to.
OPPOSITION OFFICE HOLDERS
Ms CARNEY (Opposition Leader)(by leave): Madam Speaker, I advise members of a change in office holders and additional shadow ministerial responsibility of opposition members. The new arrangements, which were put into effect on 15 March 2006, are as follows:
Madam SPEAKER: Honourable members, I have given the Leader of the Opposition leave to speak.
Ms CARNEY (Opposition Leader)(by leave): Madam Speaker, I provide an update to the House on Mrs Miller’s condition.
Mrs Miller underwent surgery a week or so ago. I am happy to say that she has now left the Spinal Injuries Unit at the Royal Adelaide Hospital. She is being cared for by family in Adelaide, and is receiving daily care from health professionals.
It is expected that her recovery and further treatment will take many weeks. However, she has already shown herself to be extremely determined having surprised doctors so far with her progress. She needs to remain in Adelaide for some time. This is, in part, a cautionary measure in case of unforeseen complications. In any event, it is not possible for her to travel at this stage.
The member for Katherine, has been - as we have - overwhelmed by the level of support and best wishes from Territorians. I am sure that his has aided her recovery to date. She would like me to express her thanks to all Territorians, on both sides of politics, who have provided their support and best wishes, in addition to the emergency services personnel who helped her at the scene of the accident, as well as the staff at the Alice Springs Hospital.
Together with Mrs Miller, I take this opportunity to thank members of the Assembly for their concern. We were very grateful for some early assistance provided by a couple of members in particular.
Madam Speaker, I thank you, the Clerk, and the staff for your assistance as well. It has been greatly appreciated by Mrs Miller and her family, as well as her colleagues. I am sure members will join with me in saying that we all look forward to Mrs Miller getting back to work. I thank you for the opportunity to update the House.
Madam SPEAKER: Honourable members, I draw your attention to the presence in the Speaker’s Gallery of Mr Les Penhall and Mrs Helen Lines, friends of the late Mr Reg Harris AM. On behalf of honourable members, I extend you a very warm welcome.
Members: Hear, hear!
Madam SPEAKER: Honourable members, it is with deep regret that I advise the House of the death on 21 February 2006 of Mr Reg Harris AM, a prominent member of the Alice Springs community.
I ask honourable members, on completion of debate, to stand in silence for one minute as a mark of respect.
Ms MARTIN (Chief Minister)(by leave): Madam Speaker, I move that this Assembly express its deep regret at the death of Mr Reg Harris AM, a prominent member of the Alice Springs community, and place on record the Assembly’s appreciation of his long and meritorious service to the people of the Northern Territory, and tender its profound sympathy to his family.
The first thing that immediately strikes you about the life of Reg Harris is how he managed to achieve so much over such a long period of time for his community. It is true to say that Alice Springs would not be the place it is today without him.
Reg was born in South Australia in 1924, and came to Alice Springs in 1947, on the day the Centralian Advocate was published for the first time. He was sent to the town to do the electrical installation at the new Hotel Alice Springs and, in another great bit of Territory trivia, was responsible for installing our very first lift at the hotel.
Reg loved Alice Springs and decided to make the town his home. He started his own electrical engineering business in 1948, and married Marge Hobbs the following year - a partnership that would last a lifetime.
It did not take Reg long to make his mark and gain the respect of the Alice Springs community. By 1955, Reg had introduced the first evaporative airconditioners to Alice Springs, meaning families could now cool their entire homes rather than just a single room. He was to make his mark in many other ways over the next half a century.
Both Reg and Marge were very passionate about sport. They introduced basketball to Alice Springs and built courts at their own expense. They were the coaches and, more often than not, the referees. Marge also brought hockey to the town, and Reg was a talented footballer who captained Alice Springs in what many believe to be the Territory’s first interstate match. He was also very involved in cycling and was President of the Alice Springs Amateur Cycling Club. Their involvement in the sporting arena was, in essence, an act of community building which had a big impact on the town. As Reg said:
The Minister for Sport and Recreation - and other speakers today – will no doubt talk more about the contribution Reg and Marge made to sport in the Northern Territory.
However, sport was not Reg’s only passion - far from it. He also wanted to do something about getting a commercial radio station up and running in Alice Springs. Reg was relentless, and it was largely due to his perseverance and passion, and that of Ren Kelly, that 8HA was established in 1971. Of course, it is still going strong today and the family link is still there - Reg’s son, Roger, is now the manager of the station.
Reg was also an astute businessman who could see the big role tourism would play in Alice Springs’ future. He built the Midland Motel in the mid-1960s, and was chairman of the Alice Springs Tourist Promotion Association for 12 years. His expertise was widely sought. He chaired the NT Tourist Board for five years, was a member of the NT Reserves Board and the NT Conservation Commission, and was a life member of the Central Australian Tourism Association.
In 1970, he published This Fortnight in Alice to promote the town. It went through a number of name changes, eventually becoming Welcome to Central Australia. His work in the tourism sector was rightly acknowledged in 1991 when he won the major Brolga Award for Excellence.
Many Territorians, especially those who lived in the Top End in 1975, will remember Reg for his incredible work in responding to the Cyclone Tracy disaster. He chaired the Alice Springs Combined Services Club Tracy Appeal Committee, and stunned many by raising $153 000 in less than a week. By the way, it should be remembered that the population of Alice in those days was only around 14 000.
Reg Harris made a real difference to his community and the people around him. His achievements are widely recognised - the Queen’s Silver Jubilee Medal and his Member of the Order of Australia, bear testament to that.
Reg is also one of the 200 remarkable Territorians honoured in Bicentenary Park in Darwin, and the word ‘remarkable’ really does sum up his life.
Our profound sympathies go to Reg’s wife, Marge, and their two sons, Roger and Scott. I wish them all the very best for the future. This Territory will certainly always remember Reg Harris.
Ms CARNEY (Opposition Leader): Madam Speaker, I join with the Chief Minister and all members of the Assembly in this condolence motion. I thank the government for moving this condolence motion. It is very important that someone like Reg Harris, who has made such an outstanding and significant contribution to the Northern Territory, and Alice Springs in particular, be acknowledged in such a formal and solemn way. It is true to say that Reg Harris was one of the founding fathers of Alice Springs, and it is fitting that tribute is paid to him.
Sadly, Reg passed away on 21 February, aged 81 years, in Adelaide when he accidentally fell outside his home on the way to a routine check-up at the hospital. Reg is survived by his wife, Marge, sons, Roger and Scott, along with seven grandchildren and two great-grandchildren.
Reg’s son, in an article in the Centralian Advocate, described his father as:
I, together with the Chief Minister, would like to touch on just a little of the life of Reg Harris.
He was born in South Australia’s Riverland in 1924 and Reg is said to have not started life with any advantages. His father was a market gardener and river fisherman. At school he was part of the single class of 45 students spread over seven grades. When he reached Grade 7, the teacher got him to teach the lower grades in the morning, then teach himself in the afternoon. That was not a problem for Reg Harris. In a competitive exam at the end of Grade 7, Reg came near the top of the state and won a coveted scholarship which would have paid secondary school fees. However, there was no secondary school near Reg’s home and he would have had to go to boarding school in Adelaide, which was out of the question in 1936. So he went back to school to repeat Grade 7 until he reached minimum school leaving age of 13 in 1937.
Reg then commenced working for his father, gardening and fishing. Other jobs Reg did in the district led him to electrical work, which then saw him approach one of the biggest electrical contractors in Adelaide who gave him an apprenticeship. It was from his ability to take charge of large jobs, even while still an apprentice, that his employers then sent him to Alice Springs and into an enduring place in the history of the Northern Territory.
Reg first came to Alice Springs in 1947 to install the first lift in the Territory at the Alice Springs Hotel. He fitted in straightaway. In week two of his job, it turned into a 60-year love affair with the Alice Springs town and community which, of course, at that stage was very small. He was a man who took to Alice Springs very quickly and, over a long period of time, his legacy is recorded and will be recorded, I am sure, by not only the people in Alice Springs but around the Territory. However, I will come to more of that later.
Reg Harris not only liked Alice Springs and saw its huge potential, but he also fell in love with Marge Hobbs who had arrived in Alice Springs in July 1947. Marge and Reg married in November 1949.
During Reg’s long and fruitful life, he worked in a variety of industries. He owned sheet metal, gas, retail and tourism firms throughout his years in Alice Springs. Reg selflessly gave his time to many community organisations and boards, some of which were touched upon by the Chief Minister.
In 1965, he was elected to the Alice Springs Town Council Management Board, a precursor to the town council. In 1970, he began publication of the booklet This Fortnight in Alice. Our annual and popular Henley-on-Todd Regatta is another Alice story which owes much of its success to Reg Harris. With a group of local businessmen, he established the town’s first radio station, 8HA, in 1971. The station is now managed by Reg’s son, Roger, proudly one of the few remaining locally-owned radio stations in Australia. Reg was part-owner of the Ayers Rock Hotel and chairman of the NT Tourist Board from 1974, until the board was replaced by the Tourist Commission in 1979.
The Harris contribution to Territory sport is immense. Marge introduced women’s basketball, netball and hockey to the Centre, while Reg played in the first peacetime Aussie Rules match. He also captained an Alice Springs team in what is widely regarded as the Territory’s first interstate match. Reg and Marge did not just play sport: they built courts and ovals and they put in the hard yards to create and administer sporting organisations.
Reg will, undoubtedly, always be remembered for heading the town’s relief effort to assist Darwin after the devastation of Cyclone Tracy in 1974. Reg was appointed chairman of the Alice Springs Combined Services Club appeal and relief effort. Alice Springs people donated more than $150 000 in a few days and sent tonnes of desperately needed materials to Darwin.
Reg Harris was a man who was very passionate about Alice Springs. Even some years ago when the possibility of merging South Australia and the Northern Territory as a super state was broadly discussed, it quickly brought comments from Reg to say that he was happy for the Territory to remain independent. He was quoted in the Centralian Advocate as saying:
Reg Harris was a renowned historian. He supplied many historical details and photographs of early Alice Springs. Many of these photographs are still proudly displayed today around the town.
In addition, somewhat gratuitously, towards the end of last year, radio announcer Matt Conlan at 8HA in Alice Springs invited Reg Harris, who did not spend much time around 8HA in his later years, into the studio. As a result, we have for the benefit of everyone in future years an oral history provided by Reg Harris which was recorded at 8HA. Of course, no one knew then the significance of what Reg Harris had to say, but I am delighted as a person who lives in and feels very passionately about Alice Springs that we now have that history recorded forever and a day by his radio station 8HA in Alice Springs.
Reg Harris was remembered fondly by other well-known Territory historians, in particular Peter and Sheila Forrest. Shortly after Reg’s death, Peter told the Centralian Advocate:
He went on to say:
Those of us who live in Alice Springs understand the sentiments expressed by Mr Forrest.
A reunion of the old and new Alice Springs community occurred at the funeral of Reg Harris and I was very honoured to have been there. Many people turned up from all around the Centre and, indeed beyond, to pay their respects to Reg at a service in the Flynn Church and the wake thereafter at the Federal Sports Club. Many well-known Territorians attended and swapped their tales about their old mate.
Reg’s legacy will live on and there are all sorts of reasons why. One, in particular, is the fact that Reg Harris Lane exists in Alice Springs and is very well-known. Most of us walk through Reg Harris Lane a couple of times a week. He will surely be remembered by future generations when kids or teenagers walk up Reg Harris Lane. We would like to think that they will ask who Reg Harris was. Thanks to the recording of this condolence motion, the recording by historians, and the recording at 8HA, those people will be able to find out who Reg Harris was. As a person from Alice Springs, I will certainly commend to young people, in particular, that they find out who Reg Harris was.
As I said at the outset, it is fitting that we pay tribute to Reg Harris in this way. He struck me as the sort of person who would have made a great politician. I suppose in a local community he was a politician; he went in to bat for people. He was very passionate about the community in which he lived and its future. We politicians regard ourselves as having those attributes or, at least if we do not have them, we should strive for them. Reg Harris, in my view, would have done well to have been a member of this Assembly. However, the Territory is no poorer for him not having been a member of the Assembly because his contribution is enormously significant and felt by old and new people of Alice Springs. I still count myself among the new people of Alice Springs but, when the older people in Alice Springs turn up to honour a man like this, you know that he was, indeed, a great man to be remembered for ever and ever.
With those comments, Madam Speaker, I will conclude. I take this opportunity to place on the Parliamentary Record that my thoughts and those of my colleagues and my party are with Marge, Roger and Scott and their families.
Dr TOYNE (Central Australia): Madam Speaker, Reg Harris was a good builder and a good talker as well. He was a passionate advocate for his community and the interests of the people around him. He was involved in building many of the physical assets in Alice Springs such as the Anzac Oval where we had the great NRL match just recently. Reg had a big role in constructing many of the buildings that were in use that day. Traeger Park and the Anzac Hill Youth Centre are all parts of his legacy of building in the town. Of course, Reg Harris Lane is the area that the Leader of the Opposition is referring to.
With his wife, Marge, he was involved in building many aspects of the social fabric of Alice Springs from the early days. Without people like Reg and Marge, who gave so freely of their time and energy, Alice Springs would not be the town it is today.
I would like to make a pledge to Reg: there are a couple of legacies I will certainly honour. One is being very vigilant about the Berrimah Line. In many conversations I had with Reg, his opinions of decision makers north, south, east or west - his Berrimah Line seemed to go a lot further than most people’s – was that they were, basically, impaired by being congenitally idiotic.
Reg had a very strong sense of where he belonged in the community, and the need for that community to be self-reliant. That is something we have always prided ourselves on in Central Australia: that we are self-reliant, we innovate and find our own solutions to things. I would hate to see that ever threatened by a too dependent attitude about not being able to do anything, and other people have to help us with this, that and everything else. Alice Springs has never been like that and should never turn that way. Reg is part of the pioneering tradition that built that self-reliance and absolute independent spirit that many people still display in the town and the region.
Reg was also involved in a huge number of sporting organisations throughout town. You could see him anywhere on a busy weekend. When you add to that all the community organisations he was involved in, I do not know when he used to sleep, perhaps they had meetings at 2 am to fit them all in!
Reg was a member of the Rotary Club of Alice Springs for more than 21 years and served as club president. He was also one of those responsible for the formation of the Rotary Club of Stuart formed in Alice Springs in 1970. He was a Rotary Paul Harris Fellow, and gave his time to the Churchill Fellowship as a member of the selection committee. He was also a member of the NT Town Planning Board and the Alice Springs Town Management Board. Reg’s many achievements and voluntary work were deservedly recognised later in his career. He received the Queen’s Silver Jubilee Medal in 1977 and became a Member of the Order of Australia in 1982. It is a very impressive list of achievements.
However, it does not give the real picture of the type of bloke Reg was. He was the type of man who really valued mateship and the qualities I was talking about earlier. Reg was a doer; he epitomized the spirit of just getting on with it and getting things done - stop whingeing about what is wrong with the world; get out, get it done and help your community, and stand back and admire what you have achieved. That is something I will always remember of the spirit of he and other people such as Bernie Kilgariff, another one who springs to mind of that same ilk, and Andy McNeill. They are people who really set the spirit of self-reliance in Alice Springs.
It is fair to say that in a phone call - or indeed any conversation - with Reg Harris, you had to allow a fairly extended time if you were going to do it at all. During the height of a particular flap going on about the quality of services in the Alice Springs Hospital a couple of years ago, I was sitting in my office saying: ‘We have all these issues to deal with’. The phone rang and it was Reg on the other end. He said: ‘How many doctors do you have in the Alice Springs Hospital?’ I said: ‘Just a bit over 100’. He said: ‘What are they all doing? When we had 2000 people in Alice Springs there were two doctors; that is one doctor for every 1000 people. On my figures, if there are 100 in the hospital that means that there is about one doctor to 250 people here. What are they all doing? There are four times as many doctors as we used to have and we all survived. So what is the story here?’ I tried to explain to him about medical specialities and modern medicine, but he was not going to have a bar of that. He decided that the doctors should all go out, treat their 250 people each and get the job done. That was Reg’s contribution. I was very pleased to get that phone call. It put the world back into perspective a bit.
Reg was a doer and right to the day he died he never sat back and left something undone. He was not a man who lived in the past. He had a keen interest in the future, especially the future of his beloved Alice Springs. I just hope that we can all march to the tune that Reg, and others like him, set for Central Australia, and not let that go for any circumstances - we have to do our own things down there. We have to find our own solutions and innovate, so when that happens in the future, that is one for Reg.
Ms LAWRIE (Sport and Recreation): Madam Speaker, this morning I offer my condolences to the family and friends of Reg Harris. As we have heard from contributions this morning, Reg Harris was a magnificent contributor to the growth and development of sport in Alice Springs. He absolutely loved his sport and was a driving force behind much of the development of sporting infrastructure in Alice Springs. He was truly passionate about his sport. In his younger days, he loved to play a variety of sports and, in later years, he was closely involved in the administration of sports.
He and his wife, Marge, were a dynamic team when it came to sports such as basketball. As the Chief Minister pointed out, the Harris’s were responsible for introducing basketball to Alice Springs in 1948. Apparently, there was a sporting gap during the summer months so Reg and Marge thought that there was a chance to shoot a few hoops. They paid for the building of the first courts. Reg was the coach of the men’s teams while Marge coached the women’s. Their roles were reversed during games when Reg umpired the women’s games and Marge blew the whistle for the men. I am told they often joked about the other being too tough in their umpiring decisions.
Aussie Rules was another of Reg’s sporting passions, and he played in the first organised game in Alice Springs in 1947. He was captain/coach of the Federals Football Club for 10 years. He coached Pioneers. He was captain/coach of the first Alice representative team and he was a life member of the Federal Sports Club. Apparently, he was pretty well known as a forequarter ruckman who never gave up and was a fierce competitor on the field. He was recognised as a major contributor to Federals Football Club winning six premierships in the 1950s. His other footy achievements include being the first player to be made a Central Australian Football League life member. He chaired the CAFL tribunal for three years and was also patron of the league.
In the 1940s and 1950s, footy was played on Anzac Oval and Reg was appointed to the Anzac Sports Oval Board of Trustees. Under his and the other trustees’ management, the oval was turfed, boundary fenced and dressing rooms were built. Anzac Oval continues to be an outstanding sporting asset in Alice Springs, enjoyed by the community at the recent ARL game there.
Later, Traeger Park became the headquarters of football and other sports in the Alice. Reg, who assisted with the original design and building of the park, was appointed chair of the Traeger Park Board. He held this position for more than 10 years. I am told he was very happy to see this government invest $5.5m in improvements at Traeger Park.
Reg Harris was a supporter of many other sporting clubs and organisations in Alice Springs, and was generous with his time, support and advice to new groups getting off the ground. He was a supporter of cycling, and was president and race organiser of the Alice Springs Amateur Cycling Club. He also helped the Alice Springs Aero Club purchase its first trainer aircraft. Reg maintained his interest in sport, and his radio station, 8HA, continues to play an important role in the promotion of local sports in Alice Springs.
Reg Harris was a driving force in Alice Springs, both on and off the sporting field. It is due in no small part to his efforts that the town enjoys such a high standard in its sporting facilities and has such a big reputation in the world of sports.
My sympathies go to Marge and the family and their friends. They can be proud that Reg got the runs on the board for the Alice Springs community and left an indelible mark on the community.
As the minister for Sport, I am eternally grateful for his contribution to sport and participation of sport in Alice Springs.
Madam SPEAKER: I thank honourable members for their contributions and extend my condolences to the family and friends of Mr Harris.
Motion agreed to.
Members stood in silence for one minute as a mark of respect.
The CLERK: Madam Speaker, pursuant to Standing Order 100A, I inform honourable members that responses to Petitions Nos 6, 8, 10, 13 and 14 have been received and circulated to honourable members.
and Kilgariff Crescent. Monitoring was completed in October and a report, including recommendations to solve
the noise issue, is expected next month. Power and Water will assess the report and recommendations, and
implement the necessary engineering solutions.
A survey to monitor soot levels in the Golf Course Estate commenced in early November. Samples from a
number of properties, including swimming pools, were collected and are being tested in an independent laboratory
that will provide Power and Water with a report on the results.
Ms MARTIN (Chief Minister): Madam Speaker, this morning I report on progress on the Asia Pacific Economic Cooperation Ad Hoc Energy Ministers’ Meeting to be held in Darwin from 27 to 31 May next year. This is the first time Australia will host the APEC forum and it is expected that there will be around 100 days of APEC meetings across the country covering issues such as trade, health, counter-terrorism, and energy and mining. These meetings will culminate in the APEC economic leaders’ meeting in Sydney towards the end of next year.
APEC is a key regional institution in promoting regional cooperation as well as a sense of community in the Asia-Pacific region. The 21-member participating economies include the United States, China, Japan, Russia, and the major states of ASEAN. The economies represent about 50% of the world’s trade and include some of Australia’s top export markets.
The Territory has been given the opportunity to contribute to this important event. I am pleased the Australian government has agreed that we would be an ideal location to host the Asia Pacific Economic Cooperation Ad Hoc Energy Ministers’ Meeting. The meeting will create opportunities for Darwin and Territory business. This will include the provision of services required for the event, and an immediate boost for our tourism and hospitality industries. There will also be opportunities for bilateral meetings and, importantly, a priceless opportunity to showcase the Territory to an international audience through the large media contingent which will cover the meeting.
There is no doubt that a successful energy ministers’ meeting will give the international profile of the Territory a major boost. While the Australian APEC 2007 Task Force will be responsible for managing the organisation and logistical arrangements for the leaders’ meeting and other APEC events, the Territory will assist the task force in coordinating and preparing for the Darwin meeting. There are opportunities for the Territory to be directly involved in certain programs in the events scheduled such as hosting functions for participating economies. These opportunities will be negotiated with the Australian task force.
My department has worked closely with the Australian APEC Task Force and other Territory government agencies on various aspects of coordination, planning and venue appraisal. This cooperation will strengthen with a Territory Government Coordination Group which is currently being established to assist the Australian government task force in preparing for the Darwin meeting. The Australian task force has already made several visits here, and I am pleased to say that they have been most impressed with what we have to offer.
The size and complexity of the events means that security is a big issue. The APEC 2007 Security Branch has been integrated into the Australian APEC Task Force to oversee security. They will work closely will relevant agencies, in particular our police who will be responsible for operational security of the meeting, and Fire and Emergency Services. I am pleased to advise that my department has signed a memorandum of understanding with the Australian government to identify the organisational and administrative arrangements on the coordination of APEC events and specifically for the ad hoc energy ministerial meeting. The memorandum of understanding will also cover aspects of intellectual property and clarifies at a high level each government’s responsibilities in the organisation of the event here in Darwin.
I am very proud, as I am sure everyone in this House is, that Darwin has been selected as the venue for this event. I can assure honourable members that the Territory government, in collaboration with the Australian APEC Task Force, is committed to ensuring that the Ad Hoc Energy Ministers’ meeting will be a success in 2007.
Ms CARNEY (Opposition Leader): Madam Speaker, I thank the Chief Minister for her statement. It is both timely and important. We are grateful that the Australian government saw fit to hold this important meeting in Darwin. Frankly, it was very pleasing to hear the efforts being made by the Chief Minister and her department because, as the Chief Minister said, this is a wonderful opportunity. Clearly, there will be a large media contingent. It is important that we in the Territory use just about every device we possibly can to promote ourselves, not only to our fellow Australians but to others around the world and, in particular, those in this region.
I genuinely thank the Chief Minister for her statement. I look forward to hearing of the outcome of the meeting. Obviously, the Australian government will be providing details. I am hopeful that after the meeting the Chief Minister will think it appropriate to provide the House with the end result of the meeting. However, we wish you well, Chief Minister, and thank you for bringing this timely and important statement to the House today.
Mr McADAM (Local Government): Madam Speaker, I present a ministerial report on the progress of work undertaken by the Alice Springs Town Camps Task Force.
As reported to the House at the last sittings, I have established a task force to examine and report on social conditions and government’s arrangements relating to town camps in Alice Springs. The task force, in undertaking its work, has consulted widely with a diverse range of stakeholders and sought public submissions. These consultations confirm the complexities and challenging nature of many of the key issues. There is a general consensus across the whole community regarding the pressures from an increased number of visitors to Alice Springs and problems associated with antisocial behaviour, litter and alcohol abuse.
Whilst these are legitimate and well-founded concerns, unfortunately much of the discourse has become an ‘us and them’ mentality. This has contributed to a number of widely held misconceptions, misunderstandings and resentment about the causes and potential solutions that might be found.
It has also led to outrageous assertions by people like the member for Greatorex that the government is forcing, in his words, ‘5000 to 7000 people into Alice Springs’. There is no evidence to support such an absurd allegation. The member for Greatorex should be ashamed of himself for peddling such untruths.
These misconceptions will need to be re-examined if we are to find consensus on how to respond to the challenging issues facing Alice Springs now and into the future. There are widely shared views and anecdotes about town camps and visitors: from sniffers moving into town because of the expanded roll-out of Opal fuel to people moving from South Australia because of the alcohol restrictions in Port Augusta. Investigations by the task force reveal a paucity of evidence to support these conclusions. For example, inquiries by the task force were confirmed that there had been a group of sniffers in town but they had returned to their home communities towards the end of last year. Similarly, the reported influx of people from South Australia has not been possible to substantiate. The task force has been informed by a range of service providers that there have been some visitors from South Australia. However, the numbers are small and certainly not in the hundreds as has been reported.
These examples highlight the paucity of available data on mobility patterns, the length the visitors stay, reasons for visitation and the need for services while people are in town. In order to develop an informed understanding of emerging trends and current and future needs it is important to examine the broader socioeconomic context for the region and demography, and to re-examine both perceptions and potential solutions. Alice Springs, after all, is the regional service centre for pastoralists, tourist and miners. It is important to note that there are some 260 surrounding remote indigenous communities. Approximately 30% of the region’s population lives in outlying communities and the Aboriginal population in the region is growing rapidly, all of which highlights the challenges of providing housing infrastructure and services, both in Alice Springs and, of course, in the bush.
Consultations and submissions reveal the principal issue of concern to all stakeholders is that of alcohol abuse. Current health data shows an increased level of harm associated with alcohol as well. Ongoing problems associated with alcohol misuse will require a carefully considered response. A survey of town camps conducted by Tangentyere during 2004-05 confirmed high visitor numbers and an acute shortage of accommodation for short- and long-term visitors. A key priority for action will be to improve existing housing and infrastructure in town camps through the Connecting Neighbours program in partnership with the Australian government. With this in mind, the Chief Minister, the federal Minister for Families, Community Services and Indigenous Affairs, Hon Mal Brough, and I have agreed that Alice Springs should be an area of priority attention for both our governments.
The work currently being undertaken by the task force - comprising representatives of both governments, local community organisations and the town council - has begun to identify some short- and long-term proposals for addressing a number of issues impacting on the whole town. The task force has consulted widely across the Alice Springs community and there will be a further opportunity when a community briefing is held at the Alice Springs Town Council offices at 5.30 pm on Thursday, 6 April. The report of the task force will provide our governments with a useful basis for developing a collaborative approach. Madam Speaker, the task force will provide this report by the end of April 2006.
Dr LIM (Greatorex): Madam Speaker, I welcome the work that the Alice Springs Town Camps Task Force is doing in Alice Springs. It is much needed to understand what is happening in town. However, let me say that there are many things happening in Alice Springs which cause much concern amongst our citizens. Fact: there is an urban drift into Alice Springs. Fact: there is more antisocial behaviour. Fact: there is more litter. Fact: there is more violence. Fact: there are more people gambling in public areas. Fact: there are large numbers of people living in Territory public housing in the suburbs. There are significant issues in this town that this government must address. However, they do not; that is the problem.
People do not particularly care who moves into Alice Springs. That is every Australian’s right. However, this government makes a racist argument. People in Alice Springs are saying: ‘We welcome anybody who comes to our community, but respect our community’. What is happening right now is people who are coming into Alice Springs do not show any respect. That is what erodes the goodwill that Alice Springs people have for anybody who comes to visit our community. It is nothing short of this government being racist, to say that anybody who criticises any antisocial behaviour in this town is racist - and that is a lot of rubbish.
What is important for this government to understand is every community deserves respect. If you visit any community, you need to show respect. I am glad the Arrernte people, through Lhere Artepe, have stood up and said: ‘Respect our country or do not come here’. This Chief Minister should have been there on Harmony Day, standing side by side with the Lhere Artepe people, to show her commitment to ensure that there is law and order in our town. That she did not; she sent a backbencher with platitudes. That is not what this town needs; this town needs action from this government. This government is failing Alice Springs.
Mrs BRAHAM (Braitling): Madam Speaker, I welcome the task force; it is long overdue. The town camps’ living environment has degenerated for a long time now. We all know the consequences of what has happened because the services have not been provided by Tangentyere or the town council in Alice Springs. I hope this task force addresses that and makes the town camps a better place to live. I was appalled when I went into some of them. There are aged people who are not being looked after properly; the children have no play area; there is nothing to keep them there; the rubbish and litter which has been passed to Tangentyere should be the town council’s responsibility; and there is a dog problem. We continually get complaints about the noise, the fiasco, and the hardship that is occurring in town camps. I know the member for Stuart gets complaints.
Let us hope this task force comes up with some good hard decisions: (1) make sure Tangentyere gets back to the core business of looking after town camps; and (2) make the town council responsible; it is in their municipality. Let us ensure that we get the kids to school, that we make life for the town campers’ better; that we say to visitors: ‘You cannot camp here because we cannot have that many people staying in a house’. The number of visitors lobbing into town camps in unreasonable. Let us ensure that we provide alternative camping areas for them if they want to come into town. Let us come up with solutions. It is easy to knock it, and it is easy to say they are a problem, but we know that. I am hoping something comes out of this task force. I realise the report is not available yet, and I look forward to it. I know this minister has a heart, and that he is concerned about what happens to his people on town camps. I hope he guides this task force to a good result for everyone.
Mr McADAM (Local Government): Madam Speaker, I thank both speakers opposite for their contribution. As the member for Braitling has indicated, we are very sincere, as a government, about trying to find mature solutions to what is occurring in Alice Springs. There is no doubt there are a lot of issues impacting. However, unlike the whingeing, the whining and the unconstructive and immature approach of the member for Greatorex, we are in there working with the organisations, the local council and the community - as opposed to getting out and spreading all these fallacies around the place. You used the word ‘respect’, member for Greatorex. I say to you, respectfully: you get in there and do your bit. You roll up your sleeves. You provide some constructive input. Do not whinge from the side.
Dr BURNS (Public Employment): Madam Speaker, I provide details of the role of the Northern Territory government in supporting skills development in the emerging public sector in our newest neighbour, East Timor.
From its tumultuous recent history, Timor-Leste has risen as a brave new nation. When East Timor was part of Indonesia, few of the current citizens of Timor-Leste held senior positions in government and there was little opportunity for locals to participate in the processes of government. It is estimated that about 7000 Indonesian officials fled the region following 1999, and this left a vacuum in the senior ranks of the public service.
It is also important that a developing nation such as Timor-Leste be supported by an efficient and effective public sector. It is vital to such a new nation’s development that the public sector is free from nepotism and corruption. It is for these reasons that AusAID provides support for the East Timor government in developing sustainable and contemporary human resources and public sector governance.
The resulting development of partnerships between the Northern Territory government and the Democratic Republic of Timor-Leste intends that a transfer of skills be facilitated. This partnership focuses on concepts such as performance management, recruitment, career development, ethics and values, leadership training, values, success in planning, organisational change, communication, capability planning, knowledge management and work force management.
One of the means by which this transfer of skills can take place is by an arrangement known as ‘twinning’. Most recently, we have received two delegations of senior officials from Timor-Leste in the weeks of 6 March 2006 and 13 March 2006. These individuals are senior officials from various East Timorese ministries. As part of the twinning program, these officials were placed in a range of Northern Territory government departments and central agencies. I thank the following Northern Territory government agencies for their cooperation: Department of Corporate and Information Services, Department of Employment, Education and Training, Department of Health and Community Services, Office of the Commissioner for Public Employment, Treasury, NT Police, Fire and Emergency Services and Department of Primary Industry, Fisheries and Mines.
The East Timorese visitors had varying levels of English and, in this regard, we were greatly assisted by Ms Dulcie Munn, a finance officer with the Department of Primary Industry, Fisheries and Mines. Ms Munn was able to expertly translate questions and answers to and from Tetum, Portuguese and English. I was most impressed with the insightful questions asked by the visitors. In particular, they were interested in recruitment and retention, indigenous and multicultural employment, the employment of women in senior positions, the number of portfolios held by ministers in the Northern Territory government, the separation of powers between ministers, the chief executive and the departments, and also the future of capacity building for the government of Timor-Leste.
I hope that I was able to contribute to the visitors’ understanding of our government. I have no doubt that the placement of these senior people from Timor-Leste in various Northern Territory government agencies will substantially increase the capacity of these already astute senior officials from East Timor.
I am proud of the role that OCPE has played in the development of the public sector of our newest neighbour. I look forward to further developing strong ties for Timor-Leste. I am able to place on the record today this government’s support for the future progress of a strong and efficient government for East Timor. We are committed to continue to work with Timor-Leste to ensure that this program is not a one-off and that there is suitable follow-up.
Madam Speaker, in closing, the visitors presented me with this beautiful scarf which takes pride of place in my office. It was a pleasure to meet with them. They were very intelligent, interesting people and asked a number of very pointed and profound questions.
Mr MILLS (Blain): Madam Speaker, this is certainly good news. It is a role that we must play being so close to a country and people with greater needs than our own. I would like the minister in his reply to indicate what amount of money has come from AusAID. It is good to hear that we are getting more reports of AusAID dollars being acquitted through the Territory. It has been a long-held position of the CLP that the quantum of money that flows into our region, particularly in the eastern provinces and East Timor, is huge but the Northern Territory, as yet, has been unable to acquit a significant amount of that. It is a very important revenue stream. I would like to know how much that AusAID contract was, and what amount was contributed by the Northern Territory government.
I am very pleased to hear about the obligation to follow-up so that we ensure that the relationship is not just a token effort but we actually see and acquit our responsibilities to ensure that there is long-lasting benefit to the people of East Timor.
Something came to mind as you were speaking, minister, regarding a Commonwealth Parliamentary Association meeting I attended in 2001. At the meeting, there was discussion of East Timor becoming a part of the CPA, albeit not a Commonwealth country, but there being some kind of formal relationship and acknowledgement from the CPA from the parliaments of Australia to East Timor. I wonder if that has been advanced. Secondly, in that meeting it was decided that the best parliament to do that would be that of the Northern Territory. On the strength of that, it would be good to have a report. However, if nothing has occurred that could be an area we could explore for parliament to strengthen our links between this parliament and the parliament of East Timor.
Dr BURNS (Public Employment): Madam Speaker, I thank the member for Blain for his reply. Starting with the last matter that he raised of Timor-Leste being admitted to the CPA, I am not sure of progress of that. I suppose all of us here, as members of this Legislative Assembly, are members of the CPA. It is possibly something we could take on board and, with your guidance, Madam Speaker, try to further that issue.
In relation to the exact amounts of money that have been spent through the AusAID program, I do not have those figures here with me at this moment, member for Blain. However, I will attempt to ascertain that and formally reply to you on that issue. I am aware that the program is coming to an end and there is another application before AusAID for a continuation of the program. I am sure that members of both sides of the House will support that application because it is a very important matter that we support our near neighbour, as you said.
Once again, it is a wonderful project and we all need to get behind it. I welcome the support of the opposition.
Dr TOYNE (Health): Madam Speaker, during the past few weeks there have been some disappointing and inaccurate public statements made about the state of our health system, particularly about the Royal Darwin Hospital. Today I put the record straight, and assure Territorians that their hospital is safe.
This government has a strong history of support for the Royal Darwin Hospital and the health professionals who work there. We opened the new emergency and critical care wing of the Royal Darwin Hospital in July 2003, with a $6.1m per year recurrent funding commitment for an extra 35 beds and 30 new staff. We have also put in place a number of initiatives to free up hospital beds and reduce bed block. Nevertheless, we know that on busy days the staff at the hospital are under pressure. The main reason for this is simple: more people are coming through the doors.
We have a way forward for addressing this increased demand. First, I have asked the hospital management and staff to work together to make sure that patient flow-through of available beds is optimal. Second, we will build our partnership with Darwin Private Hospital so that, where appropriate, insured and compensable patients can be treated there. Last, we have promised and will deliver more beds at the Royal Darwin Hospital, as well as a further expansion of the Hospital in the Home service.
In the meantime, claims by the AMA that overcrowding in the hospital is causing deaths of one to two patients a month are totally false. As a result of these claims, I asked my department to examine reports and reviews of deaths to determine if any of them identify bed block as a contributing factor. Only one such case was found. As this case had become a focus for public comment, it is important to set the record straight.
I was told verbally about the case when I visited the emergency department in April 2005. I immediately asked my department to look into the allegation. I was briefed about the circumstances of the case and was advised that a root cause analysis was being conducted. A root cause analysis is a confidential and expert investigation into any adverse event. Conducted by senior clinicians, it looks at the causative factors for the event, ensuring high-quality care for patients. During this month’s departmental examination of possible cases where bed block was implicated, it transpired that the root cause analysis of the individual case mentioned had not yet been completed. It was completed immediately. It identified bed block as one of the several contributing factors to the death. As soon as the department was aware of the results of the root cause analysis, they came forward and put it on the record.
Any death is deeply regrettable. However, to extrapolate from this one case to claims that there are one to two extra deaths per month in the RDH emergency department is false and misleading. I urge anyone with evidence of any such cases to report them to the medical administration of the hospital. The AMA president has now withdrawn his claim that there was another such death and admitted that he was mistaken in making such a claim.
I refer to the member for Greatorex and his calls for the Coroner to investigate this case. I would expect the member for Greatorex, as a medical practitioner who has had personal experience of the coronial process, to understand how the coronial system works. Let me remind the member for Greatorex that the Coroner’s Office is an independent judicial office, and no politician should seek to interfere with its operation, such as telling the Coroner which cases to investigate. For the information of the member for Greatorex, the case was referred to the Coroner. The Coroner, the CEO of the Health Department and I all received the same advice from the hospital at the time of the incident: that bed block was not implicated in the death. The Coroner is now reviewing his findings on the basis of the information contained in the newly completed root cause analysis.
Madam Speaker, our hospitals are safe. Unfortunately, the inaccurate public claims by the member for Greatorex and others do not assist in addressing issues of safety and quality of care. Instead, they undermine public confidence in our health services and in our hospital staff. I do not intend to stand by and allow the reputation of our hospital to be attacked in this misleading and false manner. Territorians can continue to have every confidence in our hospitals.
Dr LIM (Greatorex): Madam Speaker, I am pleased to hear the minister correct some of the so-called inaccurate statements made about the health system. I believe all professionals in the Territory have high regard for our health system and for the professionals within our hospitals and also in private practice. Nobody would dispute that our doctors, nurses and other allied staff work very hard. What is accurate is that this minister has been asleep at the wheel.
That is what is accurate. That is what the AMA said about this minister: that for years they have been trying to get this government to wake this minister up so that the health portfolio, the health system, can be properly managed. The public needs to know that the government has their health as the first thing on their minds. Every Territorian deserves good health, good education and good law and order. This government, through this minister who has been asleep at the wheel all this time, has failed. There is a litany of problems in our hospital system because of the poor management of this portfolio by this minister.
When there is a hue and cry, he hides behind a public servant. He puts the public servant right in front of the television cameras and says: ‘You respond to all the criticism about the issue’. He should have been there but, no, he hides behind the skirts of a public servant. That is terrible. This minister has been asleep for so long that he does not know what is happening. When is he going to wake up? If he is not, then it is time for the Chief Minister to shift him and put somebody who is a bit more awake in the job.
Madam Speaker, you were rolled for lesser crimes than this guy has committed, yet he is still sitting there as the Health minister. He should be ashamed that he has failed Territorians so severely that our waiting lists have just exploded out of control.
Dr TOYNE (Health): Madam Speaker, despite the member for Greatorex’s huffing and puffing, I will continue to focus on building the capacity of the Royal Darwin Hospital and other areas of our health system. I can assure him that his views are not held by the vast majority of health professionals with whom I meet on a very regular basis, including those at the Royal Darwin Hospital.
I believe that, on any fair assessment, there is absolutely no comparison in the capacity that has been brought into the areas of the hospitals and other delivery sites around the Territory in the safety and the quality of the services that are provided to Territorians now compared to five years ago. We are getting on with building the health system in a sustainable and safe way and we will continue to do so. If the member for Greatorex wants to huff and puff and score political points let him do it; it does not worry me in the least.
Reports noted.
Continued from 15 February 2006.
Ms CARNEY (Opposition Leader): Madam Speaker, the bill is supported.
Ms MARTIN (Chief Minister): Madam Speaker, I know this is a non-controversial bill but it does have aspects of how we actually determine remuneration and other important aspects of statutory bodies, and incorporates two pieces of legislation into one new piece; that is, the Remuneration Tribunal Act and the Remuneration (Statutory Bodies) Act. It includes how we, as members of parliament, get paid. Therefore, I was surprised to see such a quick response from the Leader of the Opposition.
There are some important aspects of this bill that affect the workings of this parliament and our statutory bodies which make an important contribution to the Territory. The bill, essentially, introduces some new aspects but also modernises the structure of tribunals and the way that they are classified and remunerated. It also updates the terminology of previous legislation, which is important.
Aspects we have dealt with in here include when tribunal determinations are made public. That is something that we have had dealings with over the last 12 months. This clarifies that. It also deals with tenures of members of the Remuneration Tribunal. Previously, it was just an ongoing appointment; now it is going to be a five-year appointment.
Another aspect that is part of the transparency that we are constantly determined to achieve in our legislation is that, previously, I had the ability to make a determination about entitlements that were not covered in the RTD. I could make that determination but I did not have to actually make it public.
What this piece of legislation does is to say that if I do make any additional determination outside the RTD then I have to table it in this House. It is really hard to think of anything that I might do. The only thing we could think of is if I make a specific determination for something like a member travelling with a first class air fare. I would have to state the reasons for that and table it in here. There used to be an entitlement for first class air travel. I do not believe that is warranted, and I do not think anyone in here agrees that that is warranted. If you are travelling overseas in business class, it is quite adequate. However, if I did make that determination for some particular reason, seeming to offer a special and secret advantage to a member, the reasons would have to be tabled in here.
This is an important piece of legislation. It might not be particularly controversial. However …
A member interjecting.
Ms MARTIN: Yes, that is all right, you can travel business class.
It is an important piece of legislation. I thank all those who have contributed. I especially record our thanks to Otto Alder for all the work he does in our Remuneration Tribunal. One point I would like to make is that we have now established tenure for members of that tribunal and we can have a one-member, two-member or three-member tribunal. We currently have a one-member tribunal. When I first met Otto Alder of the Remuneration Tribunal, I asked: ‘How can you have a tribunal that only has one member?’ He said: ‘It does not mean three, Chief Minister, it means you can have one, two or three’.
Because we are introducing a tenure component into this legislation, we have had some discussions, quite properly, with Otto Alder. Otto turns 70 next year, so age does creep up on us all. He has announced that he would like to continue, and we are very happy to have him continue as the tribunal until that date. He will be continuing until November next year when we will be looking to appoint a new tribunal member in his place. However, until that time, we look forward to more of his work and thank him for all the effort he has put in so far.
Madam Speaker, with those few words, I hope this amendment bill has the support of the House.
Motion agreed to; bill read a second time.
Ms MARTIN (Chief Minister)(by leave): Madam Speaker, I move that the bill be now read a third time.
Motion agreed to; bill read a third time.
Continued from 16 February 2006.
Mr MILLS (Blain): Madam Speaker, my speech will be shorter than my colleague in responding to the previous passage of legislation. This bill is supported. It is necessary, however, to make some comments and an inquiry - which is not necessarily sitting within the parameters or the mechanics of the legislation, but to reflect on whether progress has been made. If we talk about putting things together to produce an outcome, we want to see that there has been an improvement. I looked at a previous statement by the minister in May 2002, and it raised a couple of questions for me which I hope the minister can clarify by way of answer.
In recent times, we have had some concerns about health and safety, particularly most recently when reference was made in the last sittings of this parliament. In that case, we are talking about the appointment of an independent chair, a concept fully supported. However, I would like to quote from the minister’s own words from 2002:
Yes, it is a concern for all of us:
Therefore, following through from that, you would say they are going to do something about that. Further on in the statement one of the things that the minister said he would do was:
He went on to explain why that is such a good idea. Quoting the minister’s own statement, this council has not met for almost two years – and that was in 2002. I would like to know how many times the Work Health Ministerial Advisory Council has met since that statement was made in 2002? It is a very important question. I am happy to support bills that are presented by government, provided I can be sure that the intent and the desire to do the right thing is there and we have the accompanying grunt to make it happen and produce the outcome and address the needs which were once of great concern. I have a suspicion that the Work Health Ministerial Advisory Council has met infrequently. At the time of this statement, 2002, it had not met for two years. We have evidence of great concerns in work health in recent times, as already mentioned.
I ask the minister to assist me and the CLP in wholeheartedly supporting your bill by answering that question. How many times has the Work Health Ministerial Advisory Council met since you made that statement in 2002?
Mr STIRLING (Employment, Education and Training): Madam Speaker, I thank the shadow minister with responsibility for WorkSafe and the opposition for their support of the bill. It is a pretty simple mechanical change. It is a philosophical bet that we have, and we have done it with a number of advisory boards that we think ought to be chaired by someone independent from the community, rather than the permanent department head, if we are truly seeking independent advice.
That has been the case here, as I have sought to do with other advisory boards and mechanisms within the ministerial responsibilities that I have. The recommendation for this came out of the Lord report in about 2003. It has taken some time to get through, but the advisory council has been reconstituted with new membership. We will have to seek an independent chairperson now and have it up and running.
My advice is that it probably has not met in the last 12 months but was meeting before that. However, I will check that advice so that I am not misleading parliament. I will get back to the member in relation to that. I thank you for your support of this; it is a pretty straightforward mechanical change. I believe we will get a better result in work health.
We do keep the spotlight on it in regard to work and safety in the construction industry, and it still does cause concern from time to time. We have a number of areas of real concern, most notably around electrical accidents over the last couple of years. There is work going on between two departments - the department that currently holds electrical safety and WorkSafe – with a fairly major campaign along the lines of the asbestos awareness campaign. There is also consideration of some suggestions around devices that ought to be fitted to new buildings and the question of whether they ought to go to existing buildings in reducing the incidences of electrical accidents as far as possible. We know electrical accidents are often fatal. There is no second chance for the person who suffers an electrical accident at work.
Madam Speaker, there are still concerns and we monitor them closely. However, I will check my understanding of when it last met and I will advise the member accordingly.
Motion agreed to; bill read a second time.
Mr STIRLING (Employment, Education and Training)(by leave): Madam Speaker, I move that the bill be now read a third time.
Motion agreed to; bill read a third time.
Continued from 22 February 2006.
Ms CARNEY (Opposition Leader): Madam Speaker, I will be a little longer on this one. We take the view that if you can say something briefly and succinctly then that is what should be done. All politicians are accused of being oxygen thieves. Both sides throw it at each other on a not infrequent basis. If there is legislation that comes to us then we will be a responsible opposition. We will get stuck into legislation and have our say in relation to it where it is appropriate for us to do so. At the same time, if it is appropriate for us to support a piece of legislation then the words ‘the legislation is supported’ should be warmly embraced, I would have thought, by members of the government. In any case, I note with a …
Dr Toyne: I am prepared to accept them right now actually.
Ms CARNEY: Thanks, minister, but I just need to make a couple of observations for the purposes of Hansard in relation to this bill. Members on the government’s side should not be, with respect, surprised, or for that matter indignant, when we say we support legislation. If you want us to take up space we are happy to do it, but we have other priorities. That takes me to the current bill, the Partnership Amendment (Venture Capital Funds) Bill.
Minister, I can assure I you I really will not be long and the bill is supported. However, it is important to make a couple of observations and I am not sure that you will find it necessary to reply. It is really for the purposes of Hansard that I want to get my comments on the record.
You may recall in the election campaign in June 2005 that the CLP announced a policy in relation to venture capital because it was seen as incredibly important to the Territory’s future. It was announced, as I understand it, by my predecessor at a Chamber of Commerce luncheon that was held either just before or during the election campaign, and it was warmly received. It was warmly received for good reason. You will find that our support becomes abundantly clear because it is, in fact, a policy of my party. We are thrilled that you have taken it - perhaps not holus-bolus - but that you have got stuck into it.
I note that on 19 July 2005 in a written question, we asked the Minister for Business and Economic Development about this issue of venture capital - the number I have is 119 and I quote:
The answer delivered on 31 October 2005 was:
These changes of government are very broad and refer to a number of Commonwealth acts and are, by their very nature, more legislative from a mechanical point of view at this stage - which is why I think the Attorney-General has introduced the bill as opposed to the minister for Business. The fact is that both parties in the Northern Territory are at one when it comes to identifying and creating opportunities for future investment in the Northern Territory. Even the Attorney-General or the minister for Business will say: ‘The written question in July 2005 does not have much to do with this’. I believe it does.
We are delighted that government has finally seen its way clear to support and promote opportunities for Territory business, as the Attorney-General said in his second reading speech:
These changes go to the very issues that businesses were lobbying us about more than a year or so ago. Therefore, minister, I am sure you will appreciate why I found it necessary to put these comments on the Parliamentary Record. The long and short of it is that we are very supportive of these changes. We think, clearly, that they are timely. We welcome your comments made in your second reading speech about the importance of this legislation in conjunction with other legislation around the country that will go to supporting future investment in the Northern Territory. That is why we are all here. We play politics all of the time, but this is a good result and we are very pleased with it. Thank you. It is for those reasons, Madam Speaker, that the bill is supported
Mr HENDERSON (Business and Economic Development): Madam Speaker, as minister for Business I strongly support this bill in the House today. I will pick up, initially, comments from the Leader of the Opposition in regards to the CLP proposal in the election campaign to establish a capital innovation fund. I know where that proposal came from. I can say that, as minister for Business, we looked very closely, along with Treasury officers going back some years ago now, at a proposal that had various variations on the theme of establishing a discrete fund - whether it was a venture capital fund or a capital innovation fund - in the Northern Territory. There was a proposal floating around and there was much work done in assessing and evaluating the appropriateness of the Territory government, via the taxpayer, committing taxpayers’ money to such a fund.
It was considered. However, I say again to the Leader of the Opposition that no formal proposal ended up going to Cabinet. In a nutshell, the concerns that we had at the time - and we are always prepared to consider a further evolution of the theme - is that we have to be very careful committing taxpayers’ money to investing specifically and directly in commercial enterprises. Previous governments had, I suppose when you look at it, a pretty sorry history of trying to pick winners and contribute directly to the capital raising of a number of SMEs, start-up businesses and bright ideas around the place at the time. Regarding the research that was done in accessing investment capital, there is little evidence of specific market failure for proposals that are well thought through, or well structured and appropriately presented to various financial institutions.
The conclusion we came to on the issue of venture capital funding was not so much that there was discrete market failure. On the part of established venture capital funds that exist around Australia, there was very little knowledge, awareness or understanding regarding the structure of our economy or the capacity of local businesses of the Northern Territory. Work to be done in that area - and I know some work has been done - is to actually promote the Northern Territory to those funds as a place that they should look to in seeking to deploy some of the capital that they have available for investing in enterprises.
I know where that proposal came from which was considered. At the time, it was determined that to risk taxpayers’ money specifically into such a fund was not appropriate. However, to the people who contributed to that debate at the time, if they are reading this debate, I always have an open door to look at ways where we can further promote the venture capital industry in the Northern Territory. This bill is a good start. I commend the minister for Justice for bringing it to the House because we have to maintain our competitive environment in the Northern Territory on a legislative base.
The competition for the investment dollar is now global and we compete on a global basis for investment in the Northern Territory economy. Our legislation and our fiscal and taxation regimes have to keep pace with what is happening with the competition. It is a good time for this change to come about. The Northern Territory economy is moving ahead in leaps and bounds. As Access Economics has said: ‘The current economic climate in the Territory is turbocharged’. Access Economics is forecasting growth of around 4.5% in GSP rates for the next four to five years.
The type of competitive environment we are seeing at the moment is seeing unprecedented amounts of investment capital coming to the Northern Territory across a range of our economic sectors. That is one of the reasons why the government is proposing the Defence support hub, for example, trying to attract the Through Life Support for the Army for the Abrams tanks and the ASLAVs to the Territory. There would be significant investment capital if that initiative started, as well as ongoing investment and jobs in the Northern Territory.
With the development of the ConocoPhillips Darwin LNG plant - I am sure members are aware that, last year, ConocoPhillips made a decision to relocate their operations base from Perth to Darwin - I had a couple of people from the real estate industry saying to me that those people had started to arrive. We are talking about 40 positions - people with their families coming. Those people are not looking to rent or lease houses, but are looking to buy property in the Northern Territory. We have to maintain our competitive position and this type of legislation will assist us in doing that.
What underlines this legislation is now going to allow for a new type of business structure in the Northern Territory, an incorporated limited partnership. Currently, there is no provision in our existing legislation for a partnership where the liability of a partner for the debts of the partnership in its entirety can be limited. I suppose these are complex company legal structures. However, this issue has already been recognised by most other jurisdictions. They have moved to remove this impediment, and if we want to be competitive for this type of investment capital it is good to see the move happening here in the Northern Territory.
The legislation also ensures that such investors based or operating in the Northern Territory can access tax benefits under the current Commonwealth taxation regime. I am pleased, as minister for Business, to support this initiative. It is as, I have said, all about maintaining our competitive position amongst the rest of the states and internationally.
For the opposition, the issue of venture capital was considered but the request was, in part, for the Northern Territory government to expose the taxpayer to investing specifically and directly in individual businesses. That was not a position we could take at the time.
Madam Speaker, to people in the industry, I am committed to do whatever I can as minister for Business to encourage established funds that operate in the Northern Territory to look away from the east coast to the north and see the potential of them investing here in the Northern Territory.
Dr TOYNE (Justice and Attorney-General): Madam Speaker, I thank the opposition for their support and for the contributions to this debate. The purpose of this bill is fairly clear and it has been ably re-summarised by the Minister for Business and Economic Development. It is just an important underpinning of the current development of the Northern Territory economy where we want to attract venture capital to open up new areas of economic development, in particular to this part of Australia. With the current strength of our economic development this is a good time to give venture capitalists a good structure to invest into our economy.
I do not think I need deal with any other issue at this stage. The second reading speech is fairly self-explanatory, so we will move on.
Motion agreed to; bill read a second time.
Dr TOYNE (Justice and Attorney-General)(by leave): Madam Speaker, I move that the bill be now read a third time. I thank the departmental people who put this legislation together. Work started on this early last year. It is a very important step forward for our economic development.
Motion agreed to; bill read a third time.
Continued from 21 February 2006.
Mr MILLS (Blain): Madam Speaker, in making a few comments on the bill before us, I state at the outset that we do not have an issue with the intent of the bill. I understand that people who manage our soon-to-be-given-away parks want to do their best and try to protect the parks by having the process of prosecuting offences made easier for them. In the case of most of the offences outlined in the amendments, there is no problem.
However, I want to express my concern about section 67D and the amendments to make that a regulatory offence. Sadly, in recent times, it has become the fashion to create increasing numbers of offences that have been declared regulatory. This is convenient because it allows for easier prosecution. The problem is that there are now more offences than ever before that carry a prison sentence and have been declared regulatory.
I remind members that a regulatory offence is an offence that is minor and absolute in nature. It is absolute because it removes the defences that are normally available for people charged with committing offences. These offences are those such as speeding, failing to obey a road sign, etcetera. These are offences that carry little social stigma. If an offence is of a more serious nature the normal defences should apply.
In the proposed bill there is an attempt by the minister to make section 67D a regulatory offence. The reason given in a briefing to the staff of the Leader of the Opposition’s office the other day was because it will make prosecution easier because there will not be the need to put together a prosecution file; a simple on-the-spot fine could be issued. If an on-the-spot fine can be issued for a simple offence and all the defences available under the Criminal Code are still available for a person charged in such a fashion, the issue of such notices under the Summary Offences Act are a case in point.
I remind members of how the Criminal Code operates with regards with regulatory offences. Section 22 it states:
A quick check of the legislation reveals that the defences of immature age and ignorance of law caused by unpublished legislation apply. All of the other defences available such as unwilled act or accident, mistake of facts, sudden or extraordinary emergency, provocation and duress, are not available to a person who could end up serving time.
If a person is convicted of an offence for which they may go to gaol, then the CLP has reservations about the operation of the legislation. As much as we understand the need for an ability to effectively prosecute on the behalf of authorities, prosecutorial evidence should not be an excuse to remove a person’s right when they face the possibility of a prison sentence. The minister will offer two comments in relation to this, I suspect.
The first comment will be that there are already offences that are regulatory that carry prison offences. True, but two wrongs do not make a right. The second comment is most likely that a person will be given an on-the-spot fine and will never go to gaol for this. The problem is that when a person pays an on-the-spot fine, they have effectively pleaded guilty and the matter ends. The penalty for the fine has already been set; that is how a speeding ticket works. However, a person may want to fight the allegations made in an on-the-spot fine and so they do not pay the fine and a summons is issued. As an aside, it is worth noting that a prosecution for a person intending to plead not guilty for an on-the-spot fine is just as difficult as any other prosecution because the matter still has to go to court.
When a person who is accused of something and issued with an on-the-spot fine, and they are expecting that they can rely on defences under the Criminal Code because they want to explain to the court that they were acting in an environment of a sudden or extraordinary emergency when they breached section 67D, they will discover that the defence is not available because the government made it a regulatory offence. They will be convicted, as the defence has been removed by the parliament. Once a conviction is secure, the court will then turn to the act and see that the fine is $5500 or up to six months in the slammer. Very unlikely that the courts will send someone away for the offence, especially when there is strong negation. Thank goodness for the independence of the courts in spite of our attempts here today to limit their independence.
However, at some point when this person who was convicted of an offence that carries a term of imprisonment wants to apply for a job and that requires a criminal history check, then they will be horrified to discover that they may lose their opportunity to work in that area when the prospective employer discovers that their new possible employee once faced gaol for an offence. I said earlier that prosecutorial convenience is not a ground for limiting people’s rights. We do this far too casually and I know that this issue is neither new nor high in the minds of government because it is too hard. The problem will come when there really will be a miscarriage of justice caused by our attempts to make prosecution easier.
Madam Speaker, we do not support this bill because it has the capacity to be a bad law and to remove rights from people charged with offences that, in the most extreme cases, end up in gaol. We on this side of the House believe in due process for offences that put people in gaol. We hope that this government has the capacity to understand that due process sits in the heart of our civil system. To tamper with it is to invite peril.
Mr WARREN (Goyder): Madam Speaker, about a month ago, I was sitting at one of my shopping centre stalls and one of my constituents came up to me claiming that, during last year’s goose shooting season, there were two occasions when shooting occurred in the Fogg Dam Nature Reserve within my electorate. I was quite taken aback by what he claimed. I thought, surely, this could not have happened. However, since then I have spoken to several of my constituents who claim irresponsible people are giving scant regard to our wildlife and our parks. Moreover, there is a good chance that their illegal activities will not be able to be brought to prosecution.
After reading the background to these amendments to the act, I now understand why. At the moment, we rely on enforcement by prosecution only and to get a successful prosecution you have to prove intent. This takes much legal preparation. It is time-consuming and is quite often difficult to proceed through to prosecution. It is an administrative burden to our wildlife officers. Too often, these hoons get away, only to re-offend again. Unfortunately, it is our native wildlife which suffers. This was not what was intended and this is definitely not what any of us want.
Our parks and reserves and, most importantly, our native flora and fauna, must be preserved. If it means that we need to make appropriate amendments to our act, then so be it. By moving to a regulatory enforcement system, we are being consistent with other Australian jurisdictions. This is a system that is working well in other states, and gives real bite to law enforcement by our wildlife officers. These officers will now be able to better regulate the activities that occur in our parks and reserves. Infringement notices will be issued on the spot for appropriate offences, negating the need for cumbersome legal processes where there is a clear breach of the wildlife regulations. The issue of on-the-spot fines will streamline the enforcement process and allow for immediate punishment of offences in our parks and reserves. It will definitely send a clear message to would-be offenders and encourage future compliance.
It will also mean that minor breaches of the act will not need to proceed to prosecution through the existing rigid and cumbersome legal processes. They can, quite rightly, be dealt with by infringement notices. It will mean that, where a minor breach of the act has occurred, no longer will a prosecution automatically result in an offender being unable to gain a new permit for five years. A more equitable system, based on the severity of the offence, will apply. Permits will be issued which clearly and precisely inform the holders of what their obligations are and the conditions of the permit. This will further help with the regulatory compliance.
I am very pleased the condition of the waterfowl hunting permit will require hunters to submit a return advising how many waterfowl species were hunted. This will help ensure our waterfowl numbers are sustainable, particularly for protected species like the magpie geese. Part of these amendments will ensure that there is consistency in the retention period for forfeited or seized articles, which will be set at 60 days. Currently, it can vary from 30 to 60 days, depending on whether they were seized under the act or under the by-laws.
Despite what the member for Blain said, it is important to note that regulatory processes are operated effectively in other jurisdictions. It is not a case of two wrongs, or any wrongs; in fact, it is a matter of right following right, and I stand by that.
Our parks and reserves are too valuable to put at risk. Our current reliance on outdated and cumbersome legal processes for the full enforcement of the Territory Parks and Wildlife Conservation Act and its by-laws is clearly not serving the purpose. That purpose is to protect our native flora and fauna. These amendments will ensure our native fauna and flora are protected through streamlined and efficient regulatory enforcement. Not before time, because we have to get serious on this issue.
I can now confidently go back to my constituents and tell them that this government is listening to what they are reporting to us. I will tell them that this government is in touch with what is happening and what is needed in the Territory. Most importantly, I will tell them that this government is prepared to act decisively in the interests of Territorians and the Territory’s irreplaceable flora and fauna.
Madam Speaker, I commend this bill.
Debate suspended.
Madam SPEAKER: Honourable members, I draw your attention to the presence in the Speaker's Gallery of the Moderator of the Northern Synod of the Uniting Church in Australia, Rev Steve Orme, and Mrs Judith Orme. On behalf of all honourable members, I extend a warm welcome.
Members: Hear, hear!
Madam SPEAKER: Honourable members, I also draw your attention to visitors in the public galleries who are here as part of the parliamentary education tour. On behalf of all honourable members, I extend to you a warm welcome.
Members: Hear, hear!
Continued from earlier this day.
Mr WOOD (Nelson): Madam Speaker, I contribute to the debate on the Territory Parks and Wildlife Conservation Act. I understand why the government has introduced these changes; obviously, it is to make life easier for parks and wildlife rangers to enforce by-laws. For that, the government should be congratulated.
However, I also have concerns about section 67D, and am interested in the minister giving some clarification on this matter. If this clause becomes a regulatory offence and, if the penalty as prescribed under section 67D of 50 penalty units or imprisonment for six months is part of the regulatory offence, does that mean a person could go to gaol without trial and without the ability to argue a defence?
In relation to non-compliance of a permit, I raised the issue previously about filling out a survey form about the number of geese shot. Minister, your predecessor, Dr Burns, said in response to a question in relation to this matter:
On 5 July in the Estimates Committee, the minister said: ‘There are other ways of obtaining numbers and sustainability of geese’. Minister, in your second reading, you said that:
I agree with what the minister has said and that is why I raised this issue in parliament with the previous minister.
You also said in your second reading:
Madam Speaker, I therefore hope the minister can clarify the difference between what her predecessor said:
This is related to the issue of the surveys. The minister also said that there are other ways of obtaining numbers in the sustainability of geese. As I read it, that has not happened and people will be penalised for not filling out the permit survey form relating to the number of wild waterfowl they have shot. I certainly agree, if we are looking at sustainable use of our wildlife, that we need to have some idea of the numbers of animals that are being shot. I have asked why we cannot look at other ways of approaching these issues - instead of using the big stick - to have incentives to get people to fill in the forms. I imagine, if you get a percentage of people who filled in their forms, from those forms you can at least make a valued assessment of the total number of wildlife shot. You do not need everybody to fill in every form if you are really looking for a ballpark figure on how many animals have been shot.
The other issue I have besides that is, if section 67D has now become a regulatory offence - in that you can now be subject to imprisonment for six months - does that mean you have gone from a condition or a penalty of not being able to hold a shooting licence for five years to the possibility that you could go to gaol for up to six months for not filling in a survey form? That was the issue that we were originally debating in parliament, to try to remove what we thought was a heavy-handed approach to not filling in a survey form.
One might say that that might be reading too much into it, but section 67D certainly says compliance with a permit: ‘50 penalty units or imprisonment for six months’. If you are now changing that to a regulatory offence, and there is the possibility that someone could go to gaol for not filling out a survey form, does the government think that is a little over the top?
That is why I had some concerns about the amendments to this act. I do not disagree with what the government is trying to do overall; that is, make it easier for rangers to enforce some of their laws. However, I do have some concerns about the regulatory offences especially where a person can go to gaol. I certainly have concerns that the previous minister has said that he did not want to see hunters penalised, and that he would rather see incentives rather than the big stick approach. That does not appear to have happened.
I would like to know from the minister why she has not gone down the path of her predecessor, and what dangers she sees - or are there any dangers - in turning section 67D into a regulatory offence.
Mr KNIGHT (Daly): Madam Speaker, I add my support to the Territory Parks and Wildlife Conservation Amendment Bill. I congratulate the minister for her amendments. They are a measured and prudent step in the ongoing responsible management of the Northern Territory Parks estates, including conservation areas as well. These estates are for the enjoyment of all Territorians, Australians and visitors from overseas. They are a physical example of what makes the Northern Territory different from other parts of Australia and what we, as a government, must also protect and enhance.
I am fortunate to have a number of these parks in my electorate, including the Keep River National Park, Gregory National Park, Flora River Nature Park, Elsey, Litchfield, Nitmiluk, and conservation areas such as the Douglas Daly. I regularly travel throughout my electorate and visit these places. I speak to the park staff who work on the ground, and also see what infrastructure we have out there, what sort of road networks, and the size of these parks. We are fortunate to have these parks. However, they are becoming so popular they are bringing more and more visitors to them and that is bringing added responsibility. We have to protect the integrity of this land and also provide better visitor facilities.
The changes to this bill highlighted by the minister has resonance in these parks with the work of the staff employed in them. Parks and Wildlife staff have a challenging job and a huge workload because of the large distances they have to cover. Under the current arrangements, if park staff find someone who is committing an offence, they must charge this person and then go through quite a lengthy and complicated court process. Obviously, people have the due process of justice. However, for offences which are fairly straightforward and are of a minor nature, this exercise is cumbersome and a bit of overkill. Park staff are very diligent and must decide on what is the best course of action: to go through a lengthy legal process for a minor offence, or let it go so that they can continue to do their valuable work out in the parks.
The members for Blain and Nelson, in their remarks relating to section 67D, were questioning the ability of the park staff to use their judgment. I defend the staff. These measures are designed to help them to protect the parks. They will be fully trained, and they will be fully accredited as conservation officers to issue these permits. I hope people realise that these park staff are there to do the right thing. If they do the wrong thing by these amendments, it will be counterproductive for them and for the value that they try to do within these parks. Therefore, although the members for Blain and Nelson were highlighting the worst-case scenario, I hope they trust these parks officers to do the right thing. It is designed so that they can do a more effective job and the parks can be maintained in a better way.
The member for Goyder highlighted some of the areas where the permit system is issued. I understand that much consultation has been undertaken with various interest groups - those being the firearms group, the animal welfare area and the pet industry - so this has not come out of left field. There has been some consultation carried out; a report was done several years ago.
It is something that will be more effective for the park staff to implement. The effect of these changes to the rules and the restrictions is that we will have more effective management of the parks and the park staff will be able to get on with the core business of looking after the flora and fauna in those areas, rather than sitting in court or writing up lengthy reports on what has happened. In the end, visitors will be very conscious of adhering to the rules within the parks and to the permit system. Staff will be able to effectively enforce these offences and spend more time in their parks.
Madam Speaker, I congratulate the minister for tackling this issue. I understand she, obviously, has a number of parks in her electorate and feels very responsible for those. I commend the bill to the House.
Ms SCRYMGOUR (Parks and Wildlife): Madam Speaker, I thank all members for their contributions. I will get to some of the issues that the members for Nelson and Blain pointed out in section 67D.
I pick up first the issues of the member for Blain who could only see problems with this timely legislation which – as the members for Goyder and Daly have indicated - enjoys widespread support in the community. From the department’s point of view, there has been quite widespread consultation, as the member for Daly just said, with the firearms council, with the animal welfare lobby, and tour operators. There are a number of people who have been consulted and informed about this new regime and some of the areas that are changing with the by-laws and regulations.
The potentially problematic consequences of taking an infringement matter to court are not common and are well understood by the regulators and policy makers. It is not a consequence specific to this legislation, and is not an unforeseen consequence. Regulatory offences will continue to be relatively minor offences.
To answer some of the member for Blain’s concerns – and I know that the member for Nelson also had some concerns with this – about an infringement notice which is issued in error. The recipient - I need to make this really clear - if they infringe, has 28 days in which to appeal the notice. The Director of Parks and Wildlife still has the ability, which has not been withdrawn or changed, to withdraw a notice at his discretion. If someone feels aggrieved, and is able to justify that the infringement notice they received was unfair, they have 28 days in which to appeal to the director, and he has the ability to withdraw that notice.
I need to make clear to members on the other side – they gave the impression that you would just have rangers, willy-nilly, issuing on-the-spot fines, which is a totally ridiculous suggestion. Only accredited conservation officers will have the power to issue infringement notices. It will not be a power indiscriminately given to each and every ranger. Surely, people on the other side know that not all rangers are conservation officers, and training and accreditation is an important element of enforcement and compliance.
An article in the paper today suggests that fines up to $500 for jumping off rocks at Wangi are on the cards. Jumping off the rocks at Wangi is already an offence - of failure to comply with a directive - and it does not attract a penalty of $500. There will be a range of maximum penalties for the offences, as with most legislation.
The simple basis of the amendments is that our current capacity to enforce the Territory Parks and Wildlife Conservation Act is hindered by cumbersome procedures for enforcement and compliance. It is outdated and, compared with other jurisdictions, inflexible and not cost-effective. Non-compliance with minor offences under the act will be much better dealt with by means of infringement notices which can only assist in the protection of the Territory’s plants, animals and parks estate as, currently, many offences go un-prosecuted. The bill provides us with the mechanism to penalise offenders where necessary. It is not draconian as some members pointed out. Not all offences will be regulatory. I believe people selectively went through this bill, the regulations and by-laws, and just picked out certain areas and tried to make mischief with some of those areas.
It has wide support in the community ...
Mr Wood: That is our job.
Ms SCRYMGOUR: Section 67D, member for Nelson, depends on the level of infringement. We are talking about making sure that our flora and fauna get the best protection. This is about our parks estate and making sure that our officers have a system in place to be able to make sure that there is greater compliance. People have to be accountable. To make sure that that compliance is there, we are providing this mechanism to penalise offenders where necessary. As I said, it is not draconian. Not all offences will be regulatory, and we are not introducing any new offences. It is what is currently there; there are no new offences added.
I said earlier it has wide support in the community. The vast majority of our park users have absolutely nothing to fear from its introduction. This will bring about greater compliance. It is about the protection of our biodiversity. Available enforcement tools need to be proportionate to a breach.
Madam Speaker, I thank all members. The member for Blain contradicted himself, as there was a philosophical difference in his support. One minute he said, ‘yes’, he gave an in-principle approach in support, and then he said: ‘No, we are not supporting the bill’.
The member for Nelson, in supporting the bill, raised questions regarding section 67D. I acknowledge that, member for Nelson. In that regulatory offence and the amount in that penalty, that is dependent on the infringement and the level of that infringement. If someone does something really bad within those parks estates, Parks and Wildlife conservation officers - and as I said, the training and the accreditation will be there, so there will not be any young over-enthusiastic rangers running out there and just doing this willy-nilly - there is the protection. As I have said, the Director of Parks and Wildlife does have that discretion. If people feel aggrieved, they have 28 days in which to put that appeal through.
Motion agreed to; bill read a second time.
Ms SCRYMGOUR (Parks and Wildlife)(by leave): Madam Speaker, I move that the bill be now read a third time.
Motion agreed to; bill read a third time.
Mr STIRLING (Employment, Education and Training): Madam Speaker, I deliver a ministerial statement on middle years’ education in the Northern Territory.
In 2006, the average Northern Territory student receiving his or her Year 12 tertiary entrance result can expect that they will be around five points behind those of their equivalent counterpart in South Australia. They can also expect that they will lag significantly further behind fellow students across the rest of Australia. They can expect those results to, potentially, affect them for the rest of their lives. That is the reality today. This government is not prepared to accept that reality any longer, and nor should any person in this House, or any parent throughout the Northern Territory and, most of all, nor should any student.
The question this House must ask itself today is: what can we do to change this outcome; what can we do to fix this problem? Doing nothing is not an option, as doing nothing will perpetuate an education system that is not providing our children with the best opportunities it can. The government has put forward its solution.
Today is the time for the opposition and Independent members of parliament to put forward their plan. How would they change that reality? Sniping from the sidelines or picking at small parts of the model will not do, and it is not the time for that. That attitude will let down the students of the Northern Territory.
The government’s solution has been developed through extensive research, alongside extensive public consultation. At its very core, it is focused 100% on students and I make no apology for this. I recognise that there are times to focus on teachers and times to focus on administration. On this occasion, our core concern must be and is students, their results and their future. The government’s approach is underpinned by this concern and several key beliefs, such as:
to achieve better results in secondary schooling we must provide more focus on the middle years of a child’s education;
Instead of having up to eight teachers a day, they need to be taught by a core group of teachers, two or three, with the remaining subjects taught by specialist teachers.
To support students, we need to provide greater pastoral care with a focus on nurturing students through those difficult middle years. Parents will form an integral and welcome part of the school. Currently, parental involvement is encouraged at primary school, less successfully encouraged during the secondary years.
We will ensure that schools are not required to divert resources from their middle years to supplement teaching resources at the senior years. We will introduce throughout the education system innovative teaching practices - for example, team teaching - as a means of providing a new approach to students and to assist with discipline issues.
The government believes the best way to achieve these important changes, involves restructuring the current school system. That restructuring involves both the stages of schooling and the infrastructure of our schools. As a result, we have placed before Territorians models for structural change and asked for feedback. We are listening to that feedback. These models were not just made up. They have key criteria underpinning each one. The criteria are:
must allow the policy and principles of the middle years approach to be implemented. The model must be able
to achieve the goals of the middle years approach. That consideration also requires the model to provide improved
choice and pathways for senior secondary years;
access – the model must support the concept that families want to have primary education as local as possible;
will tolerate a smaller distance for middle years education and show a preparedness to accept more distance in
senior secondary;
capacity – the ability of the infrastructure to meet the needs of middle years; and
the best investment and use of resources.
The feedback received from extensive meetings, both public and internal, is currently being finalised and a report is to be provided to me very soon. This information will inform the Cabinet in its final decision making.
I believe it is important for the House to understand how the government arrived at this point today. The evidence of significant problems in the secondary education system was first made available to the government and Territorians in 2003. This was the conclusion of a comprehensive secondary education review undertaken by a professional team led by the highly respected Dr Gregor Ramsey. They listened and heard a strong sense of community disquiet over the secondary education system. That team, made up of experts from across the Northern Territory, received 113 submissions, visited 129 sites, including 40 remote communities, and spent from February to August of that year analysing the Territory situation. Visits to places of best practice interstate also occurred and public forums were held in each urban centre. The government initiated the review in 2002 because we had received numerous representations from various groups concerned about secondary education. We listened to what they said.
The review confirmed those concerns. It told us clearly about the difference between the Territory and other parts of Australia, and identified areas needing immediate work to change those results. The review made 52 recommendations across the full gamut of issues associated with secondary education. At its very core, the secondary review identified a need for greater focus and attention on what is called the middle years. It argued that while secondary schools, DEET and staff work with a high degree of commitment and expertise to meet the diverse and changing needs of young Territorians, particularly of those in middle years, much of what goes on in secondary schooling was still not meeting those needs.
The report proposed that young people in all parts of the Territory need greater support and understanding in their transition from primary school to secondary school, and from junior secondary to senior secondary. A regular comment expressed by parents and students themselves was that primary schools teach children and secondary schools teach subjects. The report pinpoints these transition issues as a key reason for the failure to achieve better results.
The government knew immediately that to turn around secondary education in the Territory this core issue had to be addressed. Despite the extensive public consultation undertaken by Dr Ramsey’s team, the government felt the proposals were of such breadth and dimension that further public engagement and listening was required. We contracted Socom to undertake that engagement. We were criticised for the second round of consultation. We were told to get on with the job.
Further public consultation occurred in 2004 from April to August with focus groups held in November of that year. A steering committee with members from the Australian Education Union, the Council of Government School Organisations, the business sector, schools, the Association of Northern Territory School Education Leaders (ANTSEL), and the DEET executive was appointed to guide and monitor the consultation and subsequent report.
Parents, educators, professional associations, youth workers, business and industry participated in workshops held in the Territory’s regional centres. Over 148 people representing 109 stakeholder groups participated in phase one, with 20 remote communities being represented. Public forums and meetings were held with over 100 people attending the Darwin information meeting, along with approximately 60 people attending the evening in Alice Springs. In addition, approximately 250 educators attended the remote schools conference in Alice Springs at the end of July at which they spent a significant proportion of time providing feedback on the secondary education report. The student forum was hosted by the then DEET Chief Executive, Peter Plummer. Consultation visits to a number of remote and indigenous communities were also conducted.
Members of the public were able to complete individual response sheets which formed part of the community’s feedback. All of this resulted in the report to Cabinet. The report showed the public’s concern regarding some of the recommendations, in particular, those relating to the implementation of school precincts, and the Northern Territory Open Education Centre. It showed overwhelming support for the introduction of a middle years approach. It also showed that there were regional differences regarding changes to the stages of schooling.
In Alice Springs and Tennant Creek, Year 7s have been in high school for a long time. In the rest of regional Territory, this also did not raise significant concern. However, some concern regarding the move of Year 7s was expressed in the Darwin area. Opposition by Casuarina Senior College to Year 10 entering the college was also expressed, but general support was expressed everywhere else.
Cabinet considered both the Ramsey report and the Socom report and announced our Building Better Schools package of initiatives in February 2005. That decision injected an additional $42m over four years into secondary education - the single largest investment made in secondary education in many years. At the time I said:
That was 7 February 2005. We heard the concerns; we opted for more discussion; that discussion has been extensively conducted throughout 2005-06.
The Building Better Schools package has been the subject of two ministerial statements to this House since its introduction in February 2005. In August 2005 the House discussed the indigenous education package. In February this year, I updated the House on the implementation of other more general aspects of the package.
The package was divided into four key areas:
students and learning - providing more subject choices, expanded vocational eduction options, qualified
counsellors and career advisers in each secondary school, and funds for the implementation of the
middle years approach;
the resources available to them, a new teaching and learning framework giving them more support, and a
new staffing formula;
opportunities for parents and schools to work together.
I said at the time that the introduction of the Building Better Schools package was to be accompanied by further extensive public consultation that began in early September 2005.
Once again, following a public tender, we contracted Socom to do two further phases of consultation. The first phase was to determine what people see as middle years. The second phase and the one that has just ended is to assist the government in determining what is the best structure suited to teaching and learning for those middle years. The first round of extensive community consultation, backed by advertising on television, radio and in the print media, occurred from early 7 September 2005 to 17 October 2005. That resulted in a report to Cabinet showing that the community overwhelmingly decided middle years were the ages of 11 to 14 or Years 7 to 9. Also, the overwhelming public view was that senior years are from Years 10 to 12.
In addition to identifying those years, Territorians also endorsed overwhelmingly, government proceeding with the implementation of a middle years policy. In December 2005, Cabinet did just that. Having begun in 2002 with the request by government to Dr Ramsey to investigate our secondary eduction system at the start of 2006, we are ready to talk implementation of a new system.
The second round of consultation began in January 2006, when educational leaders in the agency engaged in discussion around how implementation could occur. At that meeting, those leaders were advised that models best suited to delivering middle years would be released. However, those models were not to be the only ones considered and principals were invited to begin the discussion with their school communities about what middle years should look like in their own community.
In Katherine, educational leaders took up the call, as they have done since the first Ramsey forum was held in that community. Many of those speakers in their school community started to examine what needed to be done to improve student outcomes. At Katherine High School, composite Year 8 classes were put in place, team teaching was developed and students are being taught numerous subjects across key ideas. The school began to discuss how to implement a middle years approach that might include Year 7s in secondary education.
By the time the second round of consultation got under way in January this year, those schools were ready to seriously decide their future. Yes, there are still disagreements, but none of the issues are seen as irreconcilable or unachievable. They are waiting for us to push the green light.
In March 2006, Socom launched the now well-known models and extensive community discussion has ensued. Let me make it clear that the government is very happy with a public discussion on education. We agree that the education of children should be at the forefront of everyone’s mind. We do not run from that; we welcome it. It should also be understood that the consultation process undertaken over the last couple of months has not just been limited to the very public forums held in key centres. There have been school councils, meetings of principals and teachers, staff meetings, meetings with the Aboriginal Islander education workers, meetings with the Defence Community Organisation, the Bagot Community, and school visits from Building Better Schools representatives for parents, staff and student meetings.
Socom held a series of meetings in Darwin, Nhulunbuy, Katherine, Tennant Creek and Alice Springs. These meetings included: principals’ workshops, including remote schools for secondary provision – CECs; combined principal and middle years teacher workshop; open teacher forums; group school, area school and distance education workshops; interactive distance learning; session for School of the Air, and remote schools; and the teleconference with distance education receivers. A report is being prepared for Cabinet. That report will contain no-holds-barred feedback from all of these meetings.
That is the long path undertaken to get us to this point today. At every point, we have consulted and listened. To say the process has been rushed is simply not true. Since the Chief Minister and I decided to launch the secondary review in 2002 until today, 2006, almost four years have elapsed. That is not a rush. No final decisions have yet been made so I will not enter today into a discussion of one model over another. However, there are general points which I believe need to be aired.
I wish to say to the Year 10 students in our community that the government has rejected the view that they are not old enough to be considered in the senior secondary years. We believe they are mature enough to handle a senior years’ environment. That is why, for two days a week, the Year 10 students of ANZAC Hill High School already attend Centralian College. It is also why the South Australian government has adopted a report that recommends the compulsory teaching of Stage 1 preparatory subjects in Year 10. I also believe that overwhelming evidence now exists which supports the contention of Dr Ramsey and his team that Year 7 is old enough, mature enough, and intellectually ready for middle year schooling in a secondary context.
I also wish to put to rest the myth regarding professional development for teachers. This important work was commenced in 2001. Since that time, Curriculum Services Division within DEET has allocated resources to the middle years of schooling. Activities included ongoing professional development for individual teachers and whole schools; implementation of middle years teaching and learning programs and curriculum materials for teachers in schools; annual teacher forums in regional centres to provide an opportunity for schools to share, discuss, question, clarify and celebrate middle approaches to teaching and learning; and formation of a team of curriculum officers with extensive experience and expertise in using middle years approaches which includes three ET2s, one ET3 and one ET5. Total funding allocated for the period of 2001 to 2004 for middle years professional development has been $4.15m.
Since the adoption of the middle years policy in December 2005, the department has upped the ante on professional development further. There has been the commencement of four professional learning communities to build capacity of schools to be ready for commencement in 2007. Also, community forums have been held in Darwin and Alice Springs to enable teachers and school leaders to discuss, share and identify effective middle years’ approaches already being implemented in Territory schools. Total funding allocated to 2005 outside salaries was $849 000, with a similar amount this year.
During 2006, DEET is undertaking the following programs of professional development: support for individual schools to plan for commencement of middle years approaches for teaching and learning in 2007; training to help teachers to use the Northern Territory curriculum framework for effective teaching and learning in the middle years; grants to schools to enable them to work together to identify ways to improve teaching and learning in middle years; leadership training for school and classroom leaders; implementing middle years approaches to teaching and learning, resource allocation and school organisation; teachers’ and leaders’ forums; award study scholarships for individual teachers and school leaders wishing to enhance their skills and knowledge through research and postgraduate studies; and grants for teacher attendance at key national conferences regarding the middle years of schooling.
Infrastructure is another issue that has arisen. I have been listening hard to these concerns. I have said that infrastructure will be a factor in timing. For example, if the Palmerston model is accepted - and it has been widely accepted by Palmerston schools and parents - we will not have middle schools infrastructure in place by 2007. In that case, the middle years practices would commence in 2007 and the children would move in 2008. The department is working hard determining and resolving all possible infrastructure issues. When Cabinet makes its decision, it will do so with a full infrastructure picture before it.
I also wish to comment on some of the public statements made regarding indigenous students, particularly in Alice Springs. Government holds the same expectations for indigenous students as we hold for all students across the Territory. I will not accept a lower bar for these children. I believe all children must be stretched and challenged. I believe indigenous students are as capable as any other student of facing those challenges. I reject the comments coming from some quarters that middle schooling is inappropriate for these students, and questions regarding their ability to cope with senior years.
There are other issues of public debate and discussion which could be mentioned and, undoubtedly, will be during the course of this debate. I have highlighted a few, but I return in conclusion to my first point: doing nothing is not an option. Whatever is to be done must be done in the best interests of students. The government is determined to tackle those problems head-on, and a middle years educational focus is the best solution. We owe the students of the Northern Territory nothing less than our best and fullest efforts on their behalf. That is what I intend to do. Mr Deputy Speaker, I move that the Assembly take note of the statement.
Mr MILLS (Blain): Mr Deputy Speaker, to commence a response, it is important to separate two core elements to this issue. It has, unfortunately, had to be stated and restated: no one is happy with the levels of academic achievement across the Northern Territory on average. If you ask anyone within this country or this Territory whether there could be improved delivery to 11- and 14-year-olds, no one will disagree. There needs to be a focus on those years. Everyone agrees our structure of primary and secondary creates those ones in the middle who are undergoing significant change in their own development and need to have greater recognition. For those of us who have raised children, we know that when children are at that age they require a different approach. The systems we establish must be more responsive to the needs of those we are endeavouring to serve. No one disagrees with any of that. I suspect that this minister has taken all of that goodwill and translated it into a plan to make a colossal change in 2007.
That is what we need to raise, so that the minister can understand why there is concern and questions asked. He used the phrase ‘opportunistic’ about the opposition: ‘How dare they criticise this. They are just taking the opportunity to score a political point’. I resent that response and accusation. I resent it, not so much for myself, as a slight on me as a politician, or the CLP or Independent members, but on behalf of all those people within our community who have inquired, protested, or questioned. People who have served long in the profession have wanted to raise more weighty issues and have them properly addressed. They need the respect and the time to do so.
That is why I and the CLP cannot support the minister’s plan to implement middle years of schooling and create a new structure in 2007. Let me say again that there is a clear difference, a division in this argument. Yes, we support an approach for the middle years, but implementing it in 2007 by discussing where the kids will go to school and sort out the other stuff later, is inappropriate and risky. I do not understand why on earth the minister would be going down that path.
He will counsel himself and give himself some encouragement: ‘Do not be misled by these claims that there has been little work on professional development’. There has been professional development, and yes, there has been some work on the curriculum. However, you cannot help but ask, if the work on curriculum and the work on professional development is already in place, and that actually feeds the decision that was already made right at the beginning, then why the community consultation?
My primary concerns with the community consultation - and I will depart from this for a time to reflect on the words ‘community consultation’. It is a phrase used frequently by the Labor Party when they were in opposition, and now it is used extensively, passionately, sincerely apparently, whilst they are in government: to consult the community. I sat in on the community consultation. I believe it was the third phase of community consultation. As a politician, I felt it wiser not to contribute but to sit back and hear what the community had to say. The community had a lot to say and, if the minister had been there, he would have learnt that it was not just words that were being spoken - there was passion, feeling, anger, and concern. It was not about whether these years of schooling should receive special focus from the government - not at all. It is your plans to implement in 2007. Not because they were frightened of change - not at all. They want to do it in a respectful and timely manner, just like other states; just like other civilised communities that are able to implement and phase in change in a progressive and respectful way.
In order to get to a destination you need to be agreed with the principal stakeholders. This is not government business. This is government delivering for the community. This is not a political game. This is building something significant, something new; it must be done very carefully. If there is even a hint of an idea that you are going to have your name on a plaque as a great achievement then you should dismiss yourself immediately. It is not about the government, their agenda, or their timetable. It is about putting something in place for the generations to come. It is going to be very difficult to fix the rushed approach. The risk there is inherent in your approach, minister.
You will, of course, come back and say: ‘Ah yes, but we have not really made our decision yet’. If you had been to any of those community consultations you would have been left with no doubt that there was very real concern.
Going back to Palmerston, as I said, I wanted to hold my comments out of respect for the community that had turned up - and in significant numbers, I might say. Unlike the previous one, where the community had just about grown weary of being consulted over ‘Do you think we should do something special with the 11- and 14-year-olds?’ ‘Yes’, they all said. ‘Okay then, we are in a holding pattern until after the election because we do not want to actually make any strong decisions or anything that might ruffle the feathers of the community. Just that general proposition, do you think?’ ‘Yes, yes, yes’.
So we pay Sheila O’Sullivan significant amounts of money. I must say she is an outstanding and very clever operator. Twice there was community consultation; the second phase of it just before the election. There were not very many people there because they did not know what you were actually wanting. Yes, yes, yes, it is good that government is caring enough to think about the 11- to 14-year-olds. However, what people wanted, particularly those who are really interested in education: ‘Give us something substantial to talk about. Can we talk about the curriculum; does it have to be like this? Can we reorganise the curriculum so it delivers more appropriately to the needs of 11- to 14-year-olds or the 15-year-olds?’ Everyone knew it was the Year 7s. The consultation that Gregor Ramsey carried out did not bring up as strongly the concern about Year 10s. That seems an issue of tidiness.
There is discussion and debate. We need to have serious debates on that matter with people who have credibility in this issue - people with experience from the non-government sector who have been there a long time with the Department of Education right around the country. Look at other countries; what is the best way? We were not able to have that debate. What we had was: ‘Do you think we should have a special focus?’ ‘Yes’.
Then the election passed. Now the game was on. In came the political minders and said: ‘If you are going to make significant change, do it early’. ‘Okay, that is the tip. Do it early, imbed it, ride through the storm and then we will probably get into some good sailing weather just before the election, and we will be able to show that we have achieved something. Just sit in the chair and wait for the ride’. There is more to come.
That is an analysis of the approach. It is inherently risky and dishonest at its core because it does not have as its primary interest the improving of educational outcomes for the target group. It has been muddled, first by confusing strengthening delivery of service to 11- and 14-year-olds. You do not even have to change the structure to do that. It is already occurring, as you well know, in many schools. Alice Springs has led the way in many ways with this approach. Many schools through the northern suburbs and in Palmerston are focusing on a middle years approach. You can actually do what other places have done without changing the structure. Can we have that debate? Is that one of the models that we are asked to respond to?
‘Here are all the models you can respond to, members of the community. You can pick this one, this one, this one or this one’. Is there another model to have no change? ‘No, sorry, that is not a model; you have to change. Because we have decided to change, we are consulting you. Whatever you say, we will do it anyway’. That is offensive to those who have a genuine, deeper concern about issues of education.
I want to talk about the curriculum. I want to talk about the issues that have been raised again and again in parliamentary reports about delivery of education to boys. There are better ways we can do it, and there are other states showing different ways of doing it. Our senior secondary models can be different. We could go down a different path altogether; we do not have to stay within the safe confines. There are enough quality people out there who can come up with robust ideas that are Territory owned and driven, for the primary purpose of improving that which is our lot. We can do it; I am confident we can do it. But not with this slick approach which has not weighed the details, or cared enough to slow down and walk in step with the community to deliver a real, structural improvement we can all be satisfied with.
For the minister to suggest that we are, therefore, saying ‘do nothing’, could not be further from the truth. I am saying something of real substance. It is not about politics; it is about making structural change in a careful and considered way. One way to do it is to not employ someone from interstate. ‘Oh, no, you do not like people from interstate’. No, I do not mind people from interstate at all; I married one. In fact, I am one. What I am concerned about is, if you check on Sheila O’Sullivan you will find that she is a highly-regarded Labor Party member from Victoria. Speak to people around the country and discover she is the lady they wheel in when you want to sell something. She is an expert. You could not get a better gun for hire. I reckon if we had enough money - although I do not think we have $600 000 to throw around in the Leader of the Opposition’s office?
Ms Carney: No.
Mr MILLS: No, we do not. If you had $600 000 and you were able to employ Sheila, she could have run our case. I do not seem to have a problem doing that; just have to pay her. Gun for hire; she would run our case. However, government got there first. They have the money and they have awarded Socom $600 000 in contracts over the time of this Labor government. She is not a Liberal Party member – no, she is a highly regarded and influential Labor Party member from Victoria. People can smell it. Territorians know what is going on. They can spot con and spin.
However, going back to Palmerston, I said I would be quiet but, in the midst of it, my pulse went up. When the community was asked: ‘What do you think?’ Do you think all the Year 7s should turn up to Palmerston High School next year?’ The community looked back blankly and said: ‘Should they all turn up? The school is currently full, and we have been asked to advise you whether that would be sensible. No, you would have 350 kids standing out the front of Palmerston High School and no room’. ‘Well, if that is the case we honestly ask is there another way? Is there perhaps another way?’ We were being guided in this. I know what Sheila had in mind because I had information from the previous round of consultations earlier in the day: ‘There are some vacant buildings in Palmerston, perhaps - nudge, nudge - they could go there so that this government can put this new system in place’. People can spy manipulation. No, the bottom line was: ‘Do you mind, government? You have put us in this situation where you are asking us to solve a problem of your own creation’.
There were representatives from Bakewell Primary School which opened in 1999, and has had demountable upon demountable and, even to this day, still has students - maybe as soon as the next intake of Transition students - on the stage. They have had students being taught on the school stage probably for about four years on and off. The only way to accommodate that huge growth is to plonk another demountable at the back. I believe there are about 15 demountables there.
Woodroofe Primary School is also represented. They have no withdrawal space at all in any of their classrooms. They have even taken over some of the room the preschool operates from. The preschool is also at capacity. The high school is at capacity. There was a plan put before the Palmerston community that we were going to have a senior secondary facility, and a lot of good work went into that. Then, last year, it was turned off – a $10m commitment that had been committed again and again was thrown away. ‘Do not worry, we will buy you two schools and a couple of demountables’. Oh goody! The community there is thinking: ‘How offensive is this? You are asking us to solve your problem - the problem you have created, when you should have built a primary school in the first place in Palmerston four years ago, and continued with your commitment to the senior secondary facility in Palmerston’. Instead, you turn back on both of those and have the audacity to ask the community: ‘How do you think we should implement this plan in 2007?’
It was grossly unfair to put the community in that position. That is where the hostility comes from. They are not being respected. What happens between now and the time that Cabinet meets and announces their decision? There may be some change. I hope there is.
The CLP supports a focused approach on middle years of schooling. You know that to be the case, no matter what sort of argument you might want to run, or attack me personally - you find somewhere I have said this or that, then you attack the person. In principle, we agree with it. We have always said that. How could I not support it? As someone who implemented a middle schools program, how could I not support it? Anyone who thinks about these things would support it. However, it is the way in which it is implemented. I tell you, any school that has implemented a middle years program has done it this way. That is from the non-government sector. Have a listen. I know you have an ideological rankle with that which is independent, judging by your decisions. Your real decisions …
Mr Stirling: They got more support from me than they have had from you blokes.
Mr MILLS: The real reason behind your decision to make a move on Irrkerlantye is, I believe, your position on Catholic Education and your plans to move them from the bush. Anyway, I digress.
Going to how it is implemented, you can easily have community consultation to ask if the 11- to 14-year-olds should have a better approach. Yes, that has been done in a number of communities here in the Northern Territory. You can agree on that in a matter of two or three meetings. Now comes the serious business of implementing that, and phasing that period in. The next part of it is that you decide on what would be - and use the appropriate experts - the most appropriate curriculum to put in place to do that. You can think outside the square, but you create that appropriate curriculum. You do that over a period and present that. You then prepare teachers so that they have the capacity then to deliver that …
Mr Stirling: You have not prosecuted what is wrong with the curriculum framework we have now.
Mr MILLS: I will get to that.
Once you have established the capacity of teachers to work on that curriculum framework, then you move to the discussion of what kind of facilities you put in place. Once you have the plans committed to how you will then house the students and this new approach of education, then you phase it in. That is the process that any organisation that has implemented the middle years of schooling has done. They have done it that way. That is why the community is concerned. You say you walk down the street and everyone says: ‘Go for it, Sydney, go for it, you are on the right track’. You are on the right track in a very general sense but, when it comes down to the detail of implementation, maybe that bloke was not at the community consultation. You are probably getting all your feedback from all those who never went to the community consultation. They think it is a big general idea that you are …
A member: I went.
Mr MILLS: Good boy, good boy.
Obviously, the heat is on and you are a seasoned campaigner, minister. However, anyone knows that the best method of defence is to attack. You have let your guard down to attack too many times. You need to have the confidence of the community. To abuse students at Casuarina Senior College publicly is, to me, a sign of weakness and a demonstration of your defensiveness on this issue. To abuse teachers in Alice Springs on 8HA and to criticise them for their performance is a sign of weakness and of your own defensive position. You choose to attack, which is your nature. To then abuse callers on 8HA in Alice Springs and hang up …
Mr Stirling: That is a lie. I went back on air and corrected that.
Dr LIM: A point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker! I believe the minister should withdraw calling the member for Blain a liar.
Mr Stirling: I am just pointing out that it is a lie that is being repeated.
Dr Lim: Then withdraw it.
Mr DEPUTY SPEAKER: Minister, please withdraw.
Mr STIRLING: I withdraw in terms of sensitivity, Mr Deputy Speaker. I said the statement about hanging up on 8HA is an untruth. I said it is a lie. The member for Blain is repeating something that is untrue. I simply pointed that out. I withdraw the ‘lie’, but it is untrue.
Mr MILLS: All right. I listened to the broadcast and there was …
Dr Toyne: Very unfairly presented.
Mr MILLS: I have seen this member in operation. When the buttons were pressed for the third time, a third caller came in from Alice Springs High School and pressed the same buttons. There was a rise of temperature. I have seen the veins stick out on the side of your neck in this Chamber, and I could sense the heat coming across and then, all of a sudden, click, you were off the air. I may be wrong, but what I imagined then was, ‘I could not take any more’, and he is puffing and panting and kicking a few things. He might have kicked his little Essendon footy around the place. His minder came along and said: ‘I think you had better get back on the air. ‘Oh sorry, there was a poor connection there, and here I am again, sorry’. The veins had just gone down a bit after the colour had gone out of the face, as you are want to do. He had a very good minder there to assist. That is what I read into it.
To move to where I would like to see this debate go - though it is not really my position to talk about the sort of things that the CLP will do. There will be a time and place for that. However, I will indicate the direction the CLP would like to go and the reasons for that, but there will be a time and place to throw up a clear difference.
This time, you are in the spotlight and the issue is for you and your Cabinet colleagues to slow down and listen. One of the positive outcomes of this whole issue is that the community is now engaged in debate on education as a topical issue. People are talking about it, and that is good news. It is the time when we can start to talk about aspects of education that would result, hopefully, in improved outcomes. That has not happened for a while. Why you exempt yourself from leadership at this time mystifies me. It is a time when you could engage with the community and go to those forums and present to people what it is you passionately believe about education, rather than leave it to an expert of spin. However, you have not done that; instead you create the impression the decision has already been made.
Mr Stirling: A year ago you said leadership was taking action. Now we should be talking more. You cannot have it both ways.
Mr MILLS: I do not think you understand, and I am not going to go further down this track. You are deliberately misunderstanding - deliberately.
Mr Stirling: A year ago, you said show some leadership, and make a decision. Show leadership, go and make decisions. I am hearing different stories.
Mr MILLS: Leadership is having the courage of your convictions to stand before the community you are endeavouring to manipulate. Have the courage of your convictions to stand before the people on whose behalf you have made a decision - and you have the audacity to ask them to solve a problem of your own creation. If you really had the best interests of students at heart you would have been there and copped it, and led them. They would have been impressed with that courage. Instead, they were offended by throwing in someone who is a master of spin to sell something that you have already quietly decided on. I only hope the community maintains its rage and exerts pressure on this Cabinet to ensure they slow this process down so that it goes through the stages that have been detailed.
In terms of the curriculum, it would be a good thing if we could stop and talk about different curriculum approaches. I am not a supporter of the curriculum framework. I believe that the outcomes-based education approach over the past number of years in this country has shown much to be criticised for. We could do something different. In South Australia, they have carried out a review which decided the Year 10s should now be included in the SACE. We do not have to swallow that. I would like to hear what the minister has to say about his views on the recommendations that have been raised in the South Australian review. Are we just going to go along that line? Are we going to have a curriculum in place where no one ever fails, where there are no clear standards? It is vague, it is abstract and we have continuous movement through the education system with no sense of direction or purpose. Those are the sorts of directions coming out of the SACE review I would like the minister to comment on.
We need more rigour in the curriculum. We need clearer standards. We need a defined structure in education so kids know exactly how they are going and we know how to report on their performance. We need a defined body of knowledge so that kids will know exactly what it is they are expected to learn and can be reported on whether they are actually achieving that. We need to strengthen our approaches in curriculum. Much has happened around our country and internationally in curriculum development. It is time we opened up our eyes and had a look around to see what is happening if we really care about our kids or the structure of our education system, if it is just rhetoric that we are worried about boys leaving the education system and having no engagement with meaningful employment. Is there a different approach? Have a look at Victoria. They have a different approach. They have two levels of certificates. I reckon you, minister, should have a look at what they are doing down there. There is one level of certificate that is particularly attracting boys. It is more practical and technical in its focus, and it is for the senior secondary component. That is the sort of thing we need to do; get rigour there and make sure that we have the capacity to engage our students in a meaningful way, particularly boys.
There are many opportunities to come in regard to the outcomes-based approach and how we can improve our curriculum framework. Sadly, this government has not permitted this debate to be conducted within those realms. It is, basically, this: ‘We will now talk about where the kids will go to school next year, not so much about what they will do when they get there. Communities, tell us what you think’.
Once those thoughts have been analysed and dissected by Cabinet with their crowd of minders and political spin doctors around them to manipulate the position so that it is politically advantageous, we will probably have an announcement. I only hope that the will of Territorians who have voiced their concern will be listened to.
To go back to your interjection, minister, that I said speed up, and am now saying slow down. I am asking you to phase in, to put the structure in place properly and move to the new equation. You do not necessarily have to change the structure. You have not raised that as a model for the community to respond to. You have given them a clear set of guidelines with which to operate their decision-making process. You have not included the alternative of keeping the system as it is and just strengthening delivery to the middle years of schooling within our current structure. That is something I support.
Ms CARNEY: Madam Speaker, I move that the member for Blain be granted an extension of time pursuant to Standing Order 77.
Motion agreed to.
Mr MILLS: Thank you. With those working plans there is more to say on this issue. However, the fact is that we are being asked to focus on an issue that is the creation of this minister and this government, and their decision to implement in 2007 a proposition that I and the CLP wholeheartedly reject. I ask the minister to do this in a timely way, not for the sake of being cautious about making decisions, but doing it properly.
We are building a new structure, we are putting a new system in place and, as the minister has said on many occasions, nothing happens in education until it happens in the classroom to a student. If we take it from that perspective, I have not heard much of that. There has been a bit of rhetoric, but I have not heard of that being demonstrated in the consultation that has occurred, nor the care that has been taken in the managing of this process of change. Why is it that other states have taken up to seven years to phase in a change like this and this government has chosen to do it in just months?
It is beyond me; it is reckless in the extreme. I urge members of Cabinet to take great heed of what the community is saying. Do not dismiss them. Do not go out there and listen to the bloke in the street who says: ‘Yes, go for it’. Inquire if they really understand what is happening. Is there a separation between these two issues? Yes, fine, improve and strengthen the approach that is already occurring to change the system in nine months time - no, that is not the way to go. Coming ready or not is too risky.
Mr HENDERSON (Business and Economic Development): Madam Speaker, I am pleased to support the minister for Education in his statement. I will preface my comments by saying I contribute to this debate as an elected member of this parliament and a minister in this government. I contribute my own views and conclusions in regards to what is being proposed here as a father of three children, one of whom is currently in Year 7 at Nightcliff Primary School. He is going to be caught up in this, as is my 8-year-old and 5-year-old in whatever change takes place next year. I contribute to this debate considering my responsibilities as a member of parliament and also as a parent who is passionately involved in my children’s education.
When you initially read through everything the member for Blain, the shadow spokesperson for education, said in 30 minutes and boil it all down, I think this is where the debate is coming to: everyone agrees that better focus on Years 7 to 9 is something we should be doing. There is a debate about the time and the implementation of the change. I agree with the member for Blain that it is a good thing that we do have our community engaged in a debate about education. That is a very positive thing that is happening right now.
I say at the outset - and I am sure other people on the government side will comment in their contributions to the debate - the policy motivation for the government in going down this road is to get better outcomes for our students. First and foremost, that is the policy motivation of the government - to get better outcomes for our students through the education system. It is not about individual schools, individual teachers or groups of teachers; it is about a systemic change that is going to see better outcomes for our students in the Northern Territory. When we have seen the benchmarks as to how our secondary schools are performing compared to South Australia - and I take the Education minister’s comments that South Australia is under-performing in relation to the other states - then all the evidence we have seen is that our secondary schools do not even perform to the average of South Australia, and South Australia is beneath the average performance of the other states.
There is no doubt in my mind that we can and should do better. That is the motivation of the government in going down this path. The allegation was made that we are driven by some blind ideology to some unnamed structure imported from - heaven forbid - those terrible Australians who happen to live outside of the Northern Territory’s borders and what the heck would they know about anything because they do not live here in the Territory. There is no blind adherence to a particular model that we are seeking to import from elsewhere. What we are seeking to do is get better outcomes for our students in the Northern Territory.
We are talking about investing in our education system. Already, this is a government that has seen significant investment in our education system. It is - and I stand corrected - about a 28% increase in the DEET budget. We have spent tens of millions of dollars in capital to upgrade our schools across the Northern Territory. We met our election commitment from 2001 to employ an additional 100 teachers throughout the Northern Territory to get better outcomes. We have invested significantly in enterprise agreements to ensure that our teachers are amongst the best paid in Australia. In February 2005, the minister announced a $42m plan over four years to improve secondary education in the Territory. Therefore, this is not about blind ideology to some structure and process that is being imported from somewhere else with a motivation to close schools; this is about a government that is absolutely, seriously committed to investing in our secondary education system and seeing better outcomes from our students.
Of that $42m the government is committing to secondary education over the next four years, $15.37m is going to improving secondary students’ learning. All of these documents are on the web site: more funding for vocational education and training to expand career choices; providing assistance to schools to resource students’ learning needs so we get specific monitoring of students as they go through the system; and qualified counsellors and career advisors in all secondary schools that had been ripped out years ago, vital to support our students in determining the pathways they are going to take in their post-secondary schooling.
There is another $15.84m invested over four years in the bush to ensure indigenous people are better able to access a quality secondary education. The crocodile tears from the CLP, who put their hands on their hearts and say: ‘We are passionate about education’ – that was a government that had a policy agenda for many years not to provide secondary education to indigenous students who lived in the bush. You could have a primary education but if you wanted a secondary education you had to come to town.
Dr Lim: You just came out of the woodwork.
Mr HENDERSON: The legacy of that is going to hang around the Territory’s neck for many years, and it is an absolute shame. It will be interesting to hear the comments from the member for Greatorex if he is going to speak in this debate. Regarding educating the Territory’s population, why did the CLP have a policy position not to provide secondary education to indigenous students who lived in the bush? You say you are passionate about education. There is much history that tells how passionate you were about educating indigenous students in the bush.
There is an extra $15.8m over the next four years. There is an extra $5.4m to provide professional support to teachers. I have been around; I have spoken to all of my schools. I have met with a delegation from Casuarina Senior College and anybody who has wanted to speak with me about these issues. I am totally engaged with the schools in my electorate. I believe our teachers and our education system do a fabulous job; they deserve our support. There is additional funding to provide additional professional support to our teachers who are going to have to carry the change in whatever form it eventuates.
An extra $3.19m goes to get better links between schools and their communities. It is absolutely vital that, as we move forward, we do have better links between schools, communities and, very importantly, parents of children in our schools. There is an extra $1.87m into improving the Distance Education service. So, we are not on some blind ideological crusade here. We are actually seeking to significantly invest in our secondary education system to obtain better outcomes.
We also know that, whichever of the models is determined, there is going to be a significant capital component required, but it is hard to put your finger on that until you make a decision in regards to the model. That is the motivation for government. I have had representation. I have also sought out opinion from leaders in my electorate, and can say that there is a wide diversity of opinions out there. There are people who are opposed to structural change, who believe that the principles of middle schooling can be applied within the existing structures of keeping the Year 7s in primary schools, and Year 8 and 9s with Year 10, 11, 12s, essentially maintaining the status quo. Their argument is you provide better focus on those students. I can understand that, but I can also comprehend that if you bring those groups of students together with specific teaching programs and methodologies and really focus on those kids, it makes sense to me as a parent. There is no doubt there is a group of people out there with that view.
Similarly, there is another strong group of people out there who believe that those students in Years 7, 8 and 9 should be brought together in a group, either specifically on discrete campuses, or campuses within high school structures. Amongst the teaching community in my electorate - and I have primary schools and also Dripstone High, which I will not steal from the member for Casuarina; it is actually in his electorate - and, talking to teachers, there are people on both sides of the debate who are very committed to their point of view.
Within any debate on significant cultural and structural change within any organisation, I go back to my management theory training: there is 20% of any group within an organisation that is facing significant change - and particularly cultural change - who will champion that change and be change agents and leaders and very supportive. There are 20% of people in any organisation who are very resistant to change and look for any reason whatsoever to argue against change because they are comfortable with the status quo. That is not to say that their view is wrong. That is just how organisations work. There are about 60% of people in the middle who will go along with change, who are influenced by the debate, but are not passionately committed one way or the other.
People who are opposing this change are out there loud and strong. However, I see in my electorate and the people I talk to, there is also a large group of people who are very supportive of this change but have many questions about it. That is fine, as I have confidence in the minister that when decisions are made those issues will be sorted through.
The middle years approach - looking at teaching and learning, school leadership, relationships and community partnerships, organisational structures and resource allocation - is a complex web to work through. I am confident that our community is supportive in the plan to focus on these students.
I will take the indulgence in debate here tonight to look at it as a parent. Looking at my children and their performance in the system, I have absolutely no fear of my 11-year-old next year moving to a middle school structure. I believe, as a parent, in any systemic change that provides greater focus on a cohort of students in better supporting them and getting better outcomes from them as they progress through that stage of schooling. Any systemic change that looks to better support those students in a structural and professional teaching way, to me, as a parent, has to be a good thing. I do not see what the fear is in that. I certainly respect other people to hold another point of view but, as a parent, I can only see that this is going to be a good thing for my kids as they move through the public education system. Some people might say I am nave, but I have an entitlement to my point of view as a parent, and I have no fear of the change that is being proposed.
When you boil all this down, the opposition is seeing a political opportunity - and good luck to them - to get out there and say this all needs to be slowed down and we are rushing this change through. As the minister said, this debate started in 2002. We are four years into it now. If we do not start making change soon, how long are we going to wait? Another one, two, three years? That is another group of kids who come through who do not achieve to the extent that they should achieve and we owe our students better.
All of us here have recognised that change is required. If we keep this focus on those students then we have a responsibility as leaders and community to ensure that those kids achieve to the best of their ability. Delaying change for a significant period of time, when everybody in this debate recognises that the status quo is not providing for our students, is time wasted with further students who slip through the net not achieving to the extent that they could achieve.
No decisions have been made on those structures. I have every confidence in my colleague, the minister, to bring back the full range of sentiment that has come from our community. I thank each and every one of those Territorians who have taken the time to attend public meetings, make representation to their MLAs, or who have made submissions to the web site. We will be considering all of those issues that have been proposed. I also say to everybody who has taken the time to attend meetings and make submissions, whether it is through school councils or other profession groups, they will all be considered. I have given a commitment to the schools in my electorate that I will take their decisions and their resolutions into the Cabinet room and put them forcefully with the sentiments that are behind those resolutions.
Madam Speaker, at the end of the day, whatever the decision is, I can assure all Territorians who are looking to this debate and who might read what I am saying here in this parliament: the only motivation that we have as a government, passionately supported by the minister for Education, is to get better outcomes for our students. That is what is driving us in making these changes. I support the minister in his statement.
Ms CARNEY (Opposition Leader): Madam Speaker, picking up on something the member for Wanguri said about political opportunity. Yes, there is a political opportunity here and it is one that I would have thought the Labor Party would embrace wholeheartedly. The political opportunity is to be receptive to the electorate. The opportunity for the minister and his colleagues is to slow down.
We all know, as the member for Wanguri said, that there is a certain percentage of people in pretty much any group who are resistant to change. The question has to be asked: how do you work with that? What you do is you take people along with you. The minister has said on a number of occasions that the consultation has been going on for some time, either from 2002 or 2003. Indeed, some consultation has been going on from that time. The consultation has been in relation to middle schooling. It is disappointing to say the least that the minister is confusing middle schooling with the middle schools models. You can still have middle schooling without causing massive disruption to students, particularly in Darwin. You can still have middle schooling without doing that. You can still even have middle schooling and middle schools but only over or after a period of time, and only with the support of parents, teachers and students. I would have thought with all of the resources on the fifth floor of Parliament House that the government would have to be receptive to what the community is saying.
Yes, we all know that middle schooling has support. What does not have support is so many of the models. That is why other schools have come up with their own models. Also what does not have support is the way in which it is being rushed through. The minister for Education is on the public record when he said in this House last sittings that the changes would be implemented across the board in the Territory in 2007 - his words, not mine. The decision at that stage appeared to have been well and truly made. We heard from the contributions this afternoon that they would listen to what the community was saying. I hope for the community’s sake that the government does listen. I note that the member for Wanguri said that he would go into the Cabinet room and put forward the issues raised by the school councils in his electorate. You would have to say that, on the basis of that and that alone, we would expect Cabinet to slow down, so as not to immediately implement all of these models at the beginning of the school year in 2007.
In typical fashion, we saw the Education minister back pedal just a little recently when he mumbled something along the lines of: ‘Well, there are some infrastructure difficulties and they probably would not need to be done in 2007’. There is a reason for that. It is because the government has just about run out of money. It is noteworthy that when we are looking at these changes, we need to be very mindful of the person driving them. Many people I have spoken to, teachers and parents in particular - Labor members and supporters, and I do not mean members of this parliament but Labor Party members - have told me that they believe it is not the department who is driving this, it is the minister. They genuinely believe this, and I was somewhat astonished when a number of people said it to me. People who know the minister very well on a personal basis believe that the minister does want to leave his mark on education. I suppose if you are a minister of the Crown, you have a fantastic opportunity to make your mark for good in the Northern Territory. However, there is a difference between making your mark for the benefit of the community and making your mark just for the sake of making your mark before you knock off and go fishing.
It is particularly noteworthy that this is the same minister who is the Treasurer, who is taking us toward unprecedented debt in the Northern Territory - the same bloke who thinks that a $4bn debt for Territorians is a good thing and who will not be able to deliver on so many of the promises because he has blown the money he has already received. This is the same man who wanted to sell the Territory Insurance Office. This is a minister who has form. Also, in relation to the middle schools proposal, the details are similar to the TIO decision - not a word. Not a word before the election however many months ago it was. He was very quiet on the proposed sale of the TIO, and on the details which he must have known then on middle schools, but he elected not to say anything. This minister has been disingenuous with the Territory community. In typical Labor fashion, they make sure they win and win at any cost and then say words to the effect of: ‘Oh, we forgot to tell you that we wanted to do this and we wanted to do that’. If the minister is going to do the decent thing and listen - and he has assured us today that he will - then there can only be one thing: he must slow down. He must front the Territory community and say it does not all need to happen in 2007.
It will happen in 2007, in my view, because there is a series of electoral factors driving this decision. That is to have it bedded down, done and dusted, well before the Northern Territory election in 2009. Given that this minister has form, I would like to think that he would be somewhat reflective in the way he has conducted himself in the last eight to 10 months, and that he may have learnt a lesson or two. It is appalling that the minister continues to come into the parliament - and, indeed, outside the parliament as well - and deliberately confuses the issue of community support for middle schooling with his plan to install middle schools across the board in 2007. People are not that stupid, minister; they know what you are doing. I regard your conduct as contemptuous of teenage students. You are further contemptuous of them if you think that they have not picked the difference between middle schooling and middle schools.
As I have said, there is no doubt that there is community support for middle schooling and, partly, that is because the government consulted the hell out of pretty much everyone from 2003. Therefore, you would say there is widespread support for middle schooling. It was interesting during Question Time today when the minister said that he did not go to the community forums because he thought he would be a target. I believe that government ministers are paid handsomely to take a bit of heat on occasion. It is the height of cowardice not to have the guts to turn up and present yourself front and centre at a community forum which is being driven by you, and take the heat. The minister for Education will be measured, and is being measured, by many people for his conduct and his inability to bring himself to front a few hundred angry people. People have said: ‘Where is the minister?’ I note with interest that the member for Sanderson, in a radio interview 10 days or so ago, said: ‘At the same meeting I was at, members and ministers were all there’. No, they were not, Madam Speaker.
Mr Kiely: No, that is untrue, read the transcript. You are doing it again.
Ms CARNEY: No, they were not. There were only two politicians there. One was the member for Sanderson and the other one was the member for Araluen. It typifies the dishonest and disingenuous way this is being packaged by the Australian Labor Party and their spin support team.
I am, and I know a number of people are, particularly troubled about the fact that no mention of any of the details were mentioned before the election. Perhaps, at the next election …
Mr Stirling: We have only talked about it for three years.
Ms CARNEY: The minister is scoffing, but I defy him to show me or any other Territorian details of the proposals that were circulated to anyone outside this building about the very models he calls his own, that he wants to thrust upon the school system in the Northern Territory.
The fact is - and I say it again - that he has been disingenuous in the extreme. I also say again that this is a man who has form. By way of a digression, but an important one nevertheless, he has form when it comes to closing the Irrkerlantye school in Alice Springs - and weren’t the people there taken for a ride? And don’t they believe that they were taken for a ride! I have met with them. I do not know whether the minister has. I know he is very good at sending out little emissaries on his behalf. There is palpable anger in Alice Springs about Irrkerlantye. There is also palpable anger in Alice Springs about some politician from Darwin coming up with a ‘one size fits all’ model and imposing it from Darwin on Alice Springs.
I have one of the two affected schools in my electorate: Alice Springs High School commonly known as ASHS, there is also ANZAC Hill High School. I have had representations from people there as well. It is fair to say that my phone has been ringing hot. Bells are ringing in terms of the campaign that preceded the minister doing a backflip with pike on TIO. We all know the issues because we all receive e-mails and look at our faxes and take our phone calls. You know when something is hitting.
For the member for Wanguri to say this is political opportunism, surely he does not suggest that we, as politicians, do not respond and represent those around us? If that is what he is suggesting then we should all pack up and go home. What on earth are we here for? Absolutely, we represent the people around us. When I have constituents coming to me with an issue, I do not hide under the desk like the minister does. I am prepared to stand up, earn my money - every cracker of it - to say in this House and outside what those people want me to say. As long as people want me to say things that are not offensive or absurd, I will continue to do my job, and happily so.
In relation to Alice Springs High School - and people are saying that this seems to have escaped the minister’s attention - the fact is ASHS implemented middle schooling many years ago - for about the past seven years. As a result, they have developed a very effective way of dealing with the many social and student welfare issues which have affected the way in which students engage in schooling and in their school generally. Attendance figures are good, results are good, when you look at the aims of some of the programs - and if the minister does not know the details of ASHS, then he should. There is not enough time to go into all the details; however the outcomes for students at ASHS for a couple of years are worth quoting.
In 2005, 17 students were enrolled in a Year 12 program: four completed NTCE; two are continuing; two students transferred to Centralian College; five were helped into employment; three of those into apprenticeships; and one moved to Darwin and did not complete. That is a pretty good outcome for Year 10 students at Alice Springs High School. In 2004, 16 students enrolled in the Year 12 program: six received their NTCE; seven commenced full-time employment, including four apprenticeships; two left the Northern Territory; and one is a proud mum.
Therefore, for the minister to assert both here and elsewhere that things are just not working in Alice Springs shows a lack of understanding of what it is that school aims to do. Not every school can be focused on university studies, for instance. Some schools - and ASHS is one of them - have a holistic program and a series of initiatives that cater to their students. The minister, some time ago publicly, had a go at the teachers, calling them selfish, and some other word I have forgotten now. He got stuck into the teachers …
Dr Lim: Mean-spirited.
Ms CARNEY: Mean-spirited, thank you, member for Greatorex. The teachers were none too impressed, and rightly so, because it shows the lack of understanding by not just a member of parliament, not just an ordinary punter, but the minister for Education in the Northern Territory - the same bloke who wants to impose massive changes on these people. I believe that is the height of bad manners and rudeness.
I also think in relation to ANZAC Hill High School - which is not in my electorate, as some of us take the view that there are no electoral boundaries that really exist in Alice Springs – that it is the height of arrogance and shows the lack of knowledge by the minister for Education, demonstrated by his indication 10 or so days ago that, yes, he should probably visit - a request, as I understand it, that has been made for nearly 12 months. He has demonstrated a failure to understand what that school is about and the magnificent services it provides, not just to students and parents, but to the people of Alice Springs. I will quote from some minutes of a school council meeting:
Their words not mine:
They go on to say that it means that their deputy principal and other teachers probably know the name of every student in the school. There is very little chance of students getting lost or falling through the net. In relation to Year 10s, they say that it is an area where, in light of the minister’s comments, they cannot help but feel insulted on behalf of the school or the staff, which has put enormous effort into Year 10 as a transition to employment or higher education. That speaks volumes, minister. These teachers and, in particular, the members of the school council, are insulted by what you have dished up to them in recent months.
At ANZAC Hill High School, students already access VET and Year 11 subjects at Centralian College. It is very successful. I take the view, minister, that when the teachers, parents and members of the school council say this is very successful, that I should actually listen to them. I suggest that you should do the same. The staff at ANZAC Hill High School believe that if students are pushed into senior college in Year 10 many will simply drop out. Surely …
Mr Stirling: You just told me they go to Centralian now.
Ms CARNEY: What an interesting admission. The minister still does not understand. They go over to Centralian College to do some of their subjects. What an amazing admission and, by golly, I will send it to the people at ANZAC Hill High School. The minister does not even understand that they just go over to Centralian College to do some subjects. They are based at ANZAC Hill school; that is their school at the bottom of Anzac Hill in Alice Springs. I am sure one of your minders will be able to find the address to take you there when your arrival - which is anxiously anticipated - will be received with a wide range of feelings. Some will be anger, some will be frustration, some people will be chuffed that you actually bothered to turn up, unlike the community forums.
In any event, the staff at ANZAC Hill High School believe that if students are pushed into senior college in Year 10 many will simply drop out. This is not a good outcome. The school council goes on to say Year 10 students are 15 and 16 years old, some are very mature and some are not. The confident, the academic and the mature will survive and move to Centralian College. If you need a lesson on what Centralian College does, I will be happy to explain it to you later. Their concern is that kids will drop out. I would have thought for a bloke who says that he cares about achieving better outcomes in education, that he would actually be concerned about the prospect of people dropping out. I take the view that members of the school council of ANZAC Hill High and others actually know what they are talking about. Clearly, you have a different view.
The students in Alice Springs have, at this stage, a choice in terms of government education. We know that there is St Phillip’s and OLSH, and there are two public schools. I have seen members of the Australian Labor Party on the other side of this Chamber change their views somewhat on just about everything since they have come to office. If there was one thing I did not think they would change their personal and collective views on was that it is important to have choices in education. It is something that the CLP believes in. The way members of the Australian Labor Party wear their hearts on their sleeves, I know some of you do feel very strongly about having choices in education. If you close ANZAC Hill High there will be, for the non-private sector, no choice as to a government school. Do members of the Labor Party sanction that as a good outcome? How can you possibly sanction that? I bet that is not in your Labor Party platform and I bet it was not in your minds before you got elected only a few months ago. You should be ashamed.
Madam SPEAKER: Leader of the Opposition your time has expired.
Mrs BRAHAM (Braitling): Madam Speaker, I will be talking mainly to the situation in Alice Springs because that is what I know best. Let me say right from the start that, yes, I do support middle schooling. I have seen it implemented in Victoria and other states quite successfully and, obviously, in Alice Springs. However, I remind the minister that any change needs to be dealt with, with careful planning and good communication. Change management is a skill and I am sure the minister understands that, particularly being a former teacher himself.
I am not quite sure why the minister has taken the approach he has. It is almost as though he has taken it very personally that there has been some criticism of the proposals. The consultant went around and put forward models and, if people reacted to those models, surely that was the intent of the consultation. The minister should realise that it is not a personal attack on him. It is just people’s emotional reaction to something that they think is going to disrupt their children’s schooling.
I was surprised when he reacted to my press release which, in fact, was quite innocuous, basically stating a few concerns. I will tell the House what happened in Alice Springs. In 1987, we split into two junior high schools and Sadadeen Secondary was established for Years 11 and 12. We had Years 8, 9 and 10 from 1987. In 1994, the Year 7s from the primary school went into the junior high schools.
Possibly at that time, there should have been a change Territory-wide, but it did not occur. I think it occurred in Alice Springs partly based on accommodation reasons, rather than educational, but it was probably a good move. When these Year 7s went into the middle school or the junior highs as we called them, the teachers found they had to change their teaching styles. They found they had to change the way they treated these young Year 7s. However, it worked, and the two junior high schools – small though they are – have tried very hard to give their students the education that they required.
In my press release, I said I am concerned about the Year 10s going to Centralian College and that I did not think it was the best option. I also said that I did not think it was a good option to combine the two junior high schools into one because it has always been my personal belief and my experience that small is better because it brings back that more personal relationship. When Alice Springs High School had over 1000 students, we had problems. We had discipline and gang problems. Students tend to become a number and you can be in a school that size and hardly any teachers will even know where you are.
Therefore, minister, I was a bit surprised when you reacted the way you did. That is what caused a lot of angst within Alice Springs because your press release said that my release was incorrect and irresponsible: ‘Alice Springs Senior School results are poor. The system has not worked for 20 years. The system is failing local students and families. The two high schools are operating on less than half their capacity’ and so on. You received a very strong reaction to that because, as an educational leader, one thing you should not do is keep putting your schools down. If you want to build up their self-esteem and confidence, you try to concentrate on the good things. I thought it was highly unprofessional for the minister to turn around and bag them publicly.
In February, you said it is all very well for me to stand up and tell you to listen and asked why I don’t listen myself. Well, I have and I have been to numerous meetings, on talkback radio, and received letters - the usual things we all get within our electoral office. We have created a bit of a monster by looking as though we are not going to give people a choice, because choice is probably the one thing parents really want for their children. It is amazing the way they choose between even the two junior high schools or the private upper secondary and the public upper secondary. Being a small town - and we are geographically much smaller than Darwin - we do tend to know each other much more than, perhaps, people in Darwin. Because of that close community, it is pretty easy to get ideas running across the community.
I notice the member for Araluen has spoken about what happens at ASHS. Year 10s from ANZAC Hill High School go across to Centralian College. The minister might say: ‘If they are going across, why don’t they stay there?’ There are about 60 students from ANZAC Hill who go to Centralian College. Some do Year 11 SACE subjects, others do the VET course. It is the VET courses which introduce them to hairdressing, tourism and hospitality, metal fabrication, the motor mechanics’ course, etcetera. This is a great way to do that transition, to ease them in to those types of end points that they may have in their life.
It is interesting that the Year 10s go in two groups: one group go from 8 am to 10.30 am; another group go from 1 pm to 4 pm. Centralian College runs an 8 am to 5 pm timetable. Even the Year 11s and 12s find that difficult at times. As one mum said to me the other day: ‘My child is not starting until 11 am’. I said: ‘What is he doing?’ She said: ‘He is home watching telly’. Another mum said: ‘My child has two free periods in the middle of day. I do not know what he does during that time’. Therefore, the length of that timetable creates difficulties even for the Year 11s and 12s until they really get motivated. For Year 10s that, to me, could be quite a difficult transition. The fact that some of the Year 10s are going to 4 pm means they are doing things within their own time already. That is great, because it is giving them that easing in to this particular type of timetable that the school runs.
However, I heard an interesting story the other day that the bus had not arrived to pick them up to take them back to the school. One of the Year 10s was asked: ‘Why didn’t you go into the office and get them to ring the school?’ They said: ‘We do not know these people in the office’. It just shows a little of their insecurity and immaturity when you take them out of a closed environment and put them in something new. Pastoral care has been the strength of the two junior high schools and the kids know each other so well.
We harp continuously about the lack of skilled people. If you try to get an electrician, we just do not have them. It was partly due, I suppose, to the fact that, for a couple of generations, we all wanted our kids to go to university. We all wanted them to have Year 10. We had that shift away from the trades over a couple of generations, and we are suffering because of it at the moment. I have no problems with a child doing a VET course in Year 10 and then leaving school at Year 10 or 11 and going into an apprenticeship.
The young girl in the hairdressing salon I go to started her hairdressing as a VET subject. By the time she started her apprenticeship, she was well on the way; she had that background knowledge. She had made her decision, that this is what she wanted to do. Therefore, let us not get hung up that every child needs Year 12. Let us offer them VET - Victoria has done it; they have gone into the manual arts. Let us encourage them to do that. However, it is not also necessary to change the system that is working well; that is producing the results we want in that VET area at the moment, just for the sake of change.
I am pleased the minister is going to Alice Springs. I believe you are going to be meeting with people on Sunday and you are visiting a school on Monday. That is good to hear. It is what people have been asking for, for a long time. I want you to have a really good look at the way the curriculum works in both those schools and see how they cater for the wide diversity of young children in our schools. It is also interesting that the philosophy of these two schools says they want to give the kids better literacy skills, and they concentrate fairly hard on doing that.
If you look at the model of the Restart initiative which started in Victoria in 2002, it was to employ additional teachers to raise the literacy levels of Year 7 students and upward. We are not the only place that says our Year 7s are coming into high school without the required literacy levels. It found that this Restart program reduced the disparity in the literacy achievements, and that students did catch up. They concentrated on boys and on the Koori students who had quite lower levels of literacy. When you know that many people and schools around Australia are experiencing a low level of literacy, and there are good programs to tackle this issue, let us put the resources in these programs to make them work, rather than make huge changes that we really do not know are the right thing to do.
There is much corporate knowledge lost in Alice Springs. I was talking to an ex-principal of Alice Springs High School when the high school was a comprehensive school. I know you have heard about the families in Alice Springs saying they want to have choice. We had a bad experience in those days with riots and gangs. Parents were saying very clearly that they wanted to have a choice, to be able to be kept separate. I know it sounds emotive and a bit of an inane argument, why should we bother listening to these parents who think this? However, to be honest, it is a very valid argument. Just a couple of weeks ago, I had to contact the police because we had a family feud going on in Alice Springs. Everybody here knows that if a family feud escalates, it does not just stay with two people fighting; it is the extended families fighting. That is what has happened. You can often see it at the bus interchange in Alice Springs. You have to be careful. Do not dismiss what might only seem to be an emotional argument about Aboriginal families saying, ‘keep us separate’. It is quite a valid point in Alice Springs and it is something we should really be thinking about.
Minister, you said in your statement that we were sniping. We are not sniping; we are trying to ease people’s concerns at the moment, to try to make them understand that we are pleased that you are suddenly saying this is a good school. I believe the fact that it has brought that out in parents and students is probably a plus for the few students concerned. I do not think they realised they had such huge support for what they are doing for the students until this rattled along and made them feel uncomfortable.
However, if you are logical, you will say: ‘Yes, middle schooling, we will do it. Any changes we will make, we will make in cooperation and consultation with the schools concerned and with the parents’. We need to think of the consequences of any actions we take, and the consequences in Alice Springs may be a shift to the private schools. For a town our size, it is incredible that we have had the options we have for parents. I believe it is great, and they do a good job. However, we must also look at the consequences of any changes that we are making. We need to get teachers on side to do that. We have some brilliant teachers in Alice Springs, I have to admit that. We have a couple of very dedicated principals who love their schools dearly. When you look around the Territory, many of those experienced principals, unfortunately, are retiring. We have certainly seen it in Alice Springs. We do not have that breadth of experience there any more. You must also make sure you take the schools with you.
I do not know, minister, why you have taken this abrupt approach. It is not like you. You are an old campaigner from way back …
Mr Stirling: I have been misrepresented, Loraine.
Mrs BRAHAM: Very true.
We know that you have a wise head, but I reckon somewhere you are getting the wrong advice. It is as simple as that. I reckon someone has given you the wrong advice. Even the member beside you will probably tell you that his children had troubles at time coping with that wide curriculum at Centralian College.
Minister, I want you to visit Alice Springs. I am glad you are going, and that is good. I want you to listen carefully and weigh up what the good things are. Do not only talk about outcomes because they are receiving outcomes, but the social benefits for our town. Social benefits are often just as great for us; things we do not want to avoid. Have a look at Centralian College. Is it equipped to take Year 10s? Will they really consider the needs of those Year 10 students, or will they just continue the way they are? Is it really resource-efficient to combine the two junior highs when they seem to be coping very well as they are? Will it cause them more problems? Do not forget the diversity of the children going to that school. It is probably the same in many other schools around the Territory; however, it is the closeness of the population and the fact we know each other so well that often brings us special problems.
My final point to you, minister, is that I know you are doing a review on truancy. People still ask me why we see many school-age students on our streets and in our shopping centres. This is something you should address. However, what worries me is if the Year 10s go racing off to Centralian College and they have free periods in the middle of the day, then they may wander off to the shopping centres and they never go back to school. You are putting on them a huge responsibility to change the way they attend school at the moment.
Let us say to our schools in Alice Springs that, yes, they are doing a good job. The results you are getting are, perhaps, not as good as we would like; however, they are not bad for the material you have. Remember, everyone is never meant to be this high in achievement. We have an average group of people in the middle; we have the high achievers; and we have the low achievers. That is the mix of the population; it is probably the mix of this House. We have to be realistic in what we can do. Please do not send the message that everyone has to do Year 12. Let us send the message that we would rather have everyone have a job at the end of the day.
Dr TOYNE (Justice and Attorney-General): Madam Speaker, from the outset I strongly support the middle school initiatives which have been put forward by our government. They are based on good evidence and experience right around the country and elsewhere. I commend the minister on his stand on the educational outcomes for the students.
Good public policy must always stand on an honest appraisal of what we are getting out of our system. If we do not start with some sticking point to which the reforms are addressed, then it turns into a very ill-directed process which we may launch ourselves into. What better sticking point to take than the guarantee of a better level of educational outcomes for our students in the secondary education system?
The current debate is, of itself, beneficial to our community. How much better is it for an honest and a robust debate to occur which starts by confronting the facts of the performance of our education system and, in particular, our secondary programs, than the ill-founded apathy that has often presided over recent times in education in the Northern Territory? The comfort zone that people have often lived in, whether they be parents or commentators on our educational system, and some of the teachers who speak about the schools, has served our community well. We have had to pull up and take a good hard look at what is actually coming out of our education programs and be honest about it.
It is not a case of offering criticism of individual teachers or schools; it is about acknowledging the facts of what the programs are producing. In my entire career in education, both here and in Victoria, it was always most important in professional practice to be very honest and objective about what the programs were producing; the programs to which you are contributing in professional practice. Without that, the rigour can drop away, and you have to face up to a legacy where you have not served the community or the students you are responsible for to the fullest ability and effect.
That, to me, is what is so important about this middle school process. We are pushing back on to the community a strong picture of what is coming out of our programs and we are collectively saying: what do we do about it? Is there a better way forward and, if there is, then what sort of details do we have to deal with together?
One of the things I would like to foreshadow is that I will be focusing on the consultations and issues that have emerged in Central Australia because that can be my particular contribution to this debate. From the outset, I would like to reiterate what the minister has already said in that there has to be a consistent target on this debate. I absolutely support what he is saying; that the target for this debate and the reforms that will follow it is to improve the educational outcomes of the students we have responsibility for, both as a government and the professional people who work in our education system.
It is not about who is yelling the loudest, or about opportunism and political gain; it is about which actions can be taken that have some evidence behind them that says that that action is likely to improve the educational outcomes. That is where we are trying to go with this. If we lose that focus in this process then we find that it does not have the ability to improve these outcomes that we all want.
In talking about the consultations and issues in Central Australia, I want to make it very clear that I do not want to pre-empt the final decisions that will be made. As other members of government have already said, this is still a work in progress. We have gone out to the communities to look at the detail of issues and opinions that the various schools, parents, and students have wanted to put forward to this process. Obviously, they will all be taken consideration in presenting the final options to government. There are those who will stand on a full analysis of those views. There have been other undertakings made earlier in this debate that we will be listening to everyone, we will be taking into account all of the issues that have been brought forward by teachers, by parents, by other community members who have a major interest in education.
The one thing that is set around this debate is that government has expressed its commitment to the middle schools model as the vehicle for reform. We are at a stage now where we have to take that general reform and start to put all the context around it for each part of the Northern Territory - and they are all different. On the face of it, you would have thought Alice Springs and Central Australia might have been closer to having already achieved the middle school model in the way that the schools are already operating there. However, there are issues and they have come to the fore and will be dealt with. However, we have the basis of our middle schools and the senior secondary programs already existing in the schools in Alice Springs.
Let us look at the context that this reform will have to address in Central Australia, as a means of identifying the issues that need to be put together if we are to finally shape reform in that area of the Territory. We have a very large participation of secondary age students in the private schools. It is pretty much 50:50 in the town; St Philip’s College and the Catholic high school take a very large proportion of the age group into their programs. They are choices that families and parents have made over a considerable period of time. I guess you could include Yirrara College in that for the indigenous students. There are questions about that. Is that just simply an acceptable evolution of where parents put their kids to receive their secondary education, or are there some issues in there in the context of this reform? Why has that happened and what can we do to make the government schools more attractive to more families?
All schools have the requirement that they attract a viable cohort of students from within the region, so it is crucial to us what drawing power the government schools have to be viable into the future, in competition with the private schools.
There are two high schools which are operating close to a middle school model, one of which extends student course work up to Year 12. The other, as we have heard earlier in this debate, sends their Year 10s to Centralian College to do some of their course work two days a week, and are operating very close to a middle school model with a good, existing relationship to the senior high school at Centralian College. That relationship is one that could be built on. Those two schools have taken two different strategies in catering to the needs of the students they are currently responsible for. What needs to be thought about is what led to those two different approaches and what that says about the reform process that we are going into.
Both ASHS and the ANZAC Hill High School have relatively small student numbers. It has some positives, as we heard from the member for Braitling, but it also has negatives in the diversity of subjects and teachers available to teach that student body. There are many studies around the world as to what constitutes a viable student and teacher population in a school. As I said, you have to balance the ability of the school to cater individually for the students’ background and needs, but you also have to provide an adequate range of subjects to student numbers that are not going to get beyond the teachers’ ability to teach effectively. Those issues still surround both ANZAC Hill High and ASHS, and will need to be part of the solution that may be adopted by government. Centralian College, the senior high school, hosts Year 10 students from ANZAC Hill High School.
It is a bit strange, the high level of concern being expressed by that school, and particularly the campus as a whole through the Charles Darwin University, as to what impact the Year 10 students would have on the school and their degree of maturity in handling learning in that particular environment. The fact is that it is already happening on a fairly wide basis. There are, obviously, lessons or evidence there that could inform the final decision on how students are going to be placed within the three campuses. Again, to have a measured and informed debate, we have to take those current arrangements as a starting point, because they all provide very strong and important evidence about the potential effect of different ways in which you could organise the schools into the future.
We also have to keep in mind the existence of hundreds - literally hundreds - of primary and secondary indigenous children and secondary-aged teenagers in Central Australia who do not attend a school program right now - whether they be in town or out bush. This group is one that we have already indicated we are going to give a very high priority to their re-engagement in education. That raises a series of capacity issues about what sort of secondary capacity we need, both in Alice Springs and the Central Australia region, to accommodate the full cohort of available students in the age groups, both primary and secondary. It is very important, particularly in making the decision about how many campuses we want to continue to operate in Alice Springs, according to the different options that have been suggested, as to how many students we are going to have to cater for into the medium-term future - certainly to the future which would give us enough time to address this non-attending school population of kids and teenagers which are of very significant proportions. We have a huge amount of work to do, both out bush and in town, to engage those kids in a meaningful way into the school programs, and to, obviously, subsequently accommodate them, both in the physical facilities and the teachers who are providing the programs.
Another factor that we need to be thinking about is the emergence of remote-based secondary programs in places such as Laramba, Yuelamu, Yuendumu and Ti Tree. There are some very strong programs starting to emerge in response to the encouragement that our government has given to the development of secondary programs catering to remote-based students. I believe that is something our government can take great credit for. There is no doubt, having organised and run secondary programs in the 1980s and early 1990s at Yuendumu, that the previous government, through the Education Department at that stage, was actively discouraging and holding back the development of remote secondary programs.
That is to their lasting shame, Madam Speaker. I know many of the young adults now who have gone into the community with a total denial of the skills and the employable skills that they should have as a basis to their lives. That is the legacy of not allowing, or actively discouraging and wiping out attempts by good teachers around many of our remote communities, to cater for the real needs of their students. That is not going to happen any more. These are factors that we need to keep very much in mind if we are talking about what sort of directions of reform we should be taking in secondary education in Central Australia.
There is a wide variety of diversity of needs amongst the students and potential students that secondary education will have to address in Central Australia. These are everything from differences in cultural backgrounds to the wide differences in existing academic skills - from almost non-existent skills through to able and talented students who should be getting accelerated programs to fully realise their potential. All of that exists within the student cohort and potential cohort within Central Australia. All of that has to be capable of being accommodated within these future arrangements for secondary education.
There is a very worrying low level of direct connection from school to work, and from school to tertiary education in Central Australia. I do not believe that it is unique to there. While the numbers the Leader of the Opposition quoted - I am very happy to hear that that group of kids have found apprenticeships or found placements within tertiary education - have a look three years before that. What was the cohort that led to 17 Year 12 students, or the number of students that moved from school into the apprenticeships, as she was quoting? The drop-out rate is absolutely unacceptable in students not going either into some serious vocational training with some real employable skills and employable future, or into tertiary education. What we are seeing is many of those students drop out very early and go into non-career jobs that are simply not leading sequentially anywhere over the course of their adult employment. We have much work to do to get allowable or acceptable levels of engagement into employment and into further education beyond what we are achieving at the moment.
There are quite a number of geographical and logistical issues about connecting up these different programs, one to the other. That is not only within the urban area of Alice Springs, but also to give some connection between the remote-based secondary programs and their urban counterparts. I do not think we can go on treating remote and urban educations as if they are two different systems. We have to make sure that remote-based secondary students can transition in a constructive way into taking up employment and other engagement within our urban centres, if that is their choice. I do not believe that it is properly respecting their future to only give them a future where all they know is the remote community lifestyle. Like many young adults out there, they give up on it. There is nothing there for them. There are no real education prospects and they do not have the skills to take up those prospects anyway.
I believe that is the past history of remote education. We have to get beyond that and start building this into a very powerful secondary delivery network leading very strongly into education and further education. If we do not get that out of these reforms, then we have fallen short of what needs to happen.
All of the options are on the table. The options were put in full to the Centralian community. I understand, from a document I saw a couple of days ago, that there has been further options proposed building on the current situation with the secondary programs in Alice Springs and Central Australia. That is a great sign that people have embraced it in a constructive way and they are putting forward additional ideas beyond the models that were suggested for discussion. I look forward to joining with the Centralian community in pursuing this debate through to finality and, even more importantly, to work constructively on the initiatives.
Madam Speaker, I commend the minister for bringing these very important reforms forward to the community. Unlike the opposition, I cannot wait to get on with it.
Mr VATSKALIS (Primary Industry and Fisheries): Madam Speaker, I state from the very beginning that I support the minister. Let me describe to you my experience with education. I grew up in another culture; another country. I recall that primary school was Year 1 to Year 6, followed by high school from Year 7 to Year 12. In the last two years of primary school, we spent an enormous amount of time learning to write essays and to conduct a mathematics exercise, memorising history and geography. At 11 years old, you had to sit exams to enter high school - exams in mathematics, geography, history, religious studies and essays. That was an enormous pressure for a young 11-year-old. If you did not sit the exams, you could not go to any school. You had to become an apprentice at the age of 11 years old.
I remember very well when I walked into the high school on the first day and realised we were going from a system where we had one teacher throughout the year all the time and, all of a sudden, we had a different teacher every lesson. Every day, we had about seven different teachers and that was a shock to the system. However, the system changed in Greece. They introduced the system of middle schools, and then they went further with senior high schools. If you were an academic person and you wanted to go to university, you could follow an academic stream at senior high school.
Not everybody is the same, as the member for Braitling said. Some people are academic, some are better with their hands or with the way they are thinking; they want to become tradesmen. You could follow a trade. There was a senior high school like a TAFE, and others could continue to have a vocation at tertiary school.
When I came to Australia, and to the Territory in particular, we were surprised the Territory had this peculiar system of Year 1 to 7 at primary school, then comprehensive high schools, and a senior college, Year 11 and 12 only. In Western Australia and other states, there was nothing like that; it was totally different.
I come from a family of teachers. My wife is a high school teacher; her father was a primary school principal; and her mother was a teacher. Many times we discussed elements of education and how well or badly kids do. I was especially surprised when my wife came back from school shaking her head, trying to teach science in Year 8 or Year 9 when they could not even write their names, or read, or finish a mathematical equation. I was very surprised. What was the level of education we provide for our kids? Were we giving the best education?
I was not surprised when this secondary education review came back and said that things are not as good as they should be and we have to do something quickly. I was very supportive of the secondary education review. I recall sitting in Cabinet and talking with my colleagues about having to do something. There was no option to sit down and do a little today and a little tomorrow; we have had to do something radical. Of course, some people may say a courageous decision, minister. However, I am really pleased that my colleague, the minister for Education, has taken that courageous decision to go down that path because, by taking that courageous decision, he has put in a benchmark for a really comprehensive education for future Territorians who will be running this Territory or state in the future - Territorians who will probably be sitting at the same desks we are sitting at today who will become the leaders of the community.
I know people are afraid of change. I have been to many forums in my electorate, to primary schools and high schools and many people express fear of the unknown: ‘What is going to happen to my children?’ Also: ‘I do not like my child changing school. I do not like my child going from what it is now, which served me and the older two children really well, to go to a junior high school or a middle school’.
However, the reason that the human race has survived and colonised the planet for so many thousands of years is because we are highly adaptable. We adapt to the change in the environment around us; not only the physical change, but also the emotional, the climatic, the political, and the economic changes. Today, if we are going to survive, we have to adapt to a changing world around us. We have to adapt to a new reality. We are talking about paradigms. We are trying to create a paradigm shift. We have had a system working for many years but, obviously, now it does not serve as well. We have to do something different, and the middle school approach is the way to go.
In my electorate, I have spoken to teachers, parents, and to principals. In my primary schools, there is support for middle schools and some primary schools already have started applying the principles of mid-schooling in Year 6 and 7. In other primary schools, teachers are looking forward to becoming teachers for middle schools because they can see there is a career pathway there, and also because they are dedicated teachers who love what they are doing - teaching children. They have realised the best way to serve those growing children is moving from the current situation to a new situation, and they think they are able to provide the teaching environment, a disciplined grounding, the emotional and teaching support to those children which is very important.
After the secondary review, I recall discussing with my wife the possibility of changes in middle schools. She told me that teachers at Dripstone High School had already started talking about the possible models that could apply to this particular high school in order to sell the changes in the education system. There are some teachers who had not wanted it to become a junior high school; other teachers said it would be served better to be a senior high school. Within the education community, there was debate about possible models that could be implemented to serve the proposed change by the government.
The other question, of course, for the parents is: is it going to work? The minister said that we are going to see outcomes in five years; that is a typical example. If you start a health program today you are not going to get real outcomes until a certain period of time passes. You cannot say: ‘I am going to put fluoride in the water and within six months I will tell you if it is successful or there are no cavities in the teeth’. You cannot say: ‘I am going to do a mass immunisation and within one year come back and say everything is fine’. You have to give it time to progress and, after passing a period of time, evaluate the effects to find out if you have some real positive outcomes.
It is really unfortunate that the opposition has found a fertile ground to start a misinformation campaign and to scare the parents. I know very well that the opposition members attended many of these forums - and quite rightly so. We are politicians, as the Leader of the Opposition said. Our role is to listen to the community, and that is exactly what I did. I attended forums in our electorates with the member for Wanguri, and we made sure that we conveyed to the government all the information we obtained from these forums.
I had a look at the recent release by the opposition of their plan on reform in education and middle school for Years 7 to 10 and Years 11 and 12. A question regarding this was: is it a good idea? The response was that it was not a good idea. Mid-schooling is actually Years 7, 8, and 9. The reason for that is that this is the time that the kids are coming out of primary school, and they have to be supported emotionally and educationally to form the basis for moving to the senior high school and then to university. The example was given to me by my wife who said: ‘When our son was in school, if he was not in a senior high school as it was then, he would be unable to get some of the Year 11 units to study when he was in Year 10’. Therefore, Year 10 for him would be a lost year because he could not access some of the Year 11 units to study’.
The other question we heard from the parents was: ‘Is it working, will it work? There has been failure in other states; in America it did not work’. This may be true but, on having a look at some of the literature which is around, and a special report which was drafted by Rod Chadbourne from Edith Cowan University on behalf of the Australian Education Union in 2001 about mid-schooling for the middle years, in one of the chapters he posed the question: ‘What evidence is there that middle schooling works? He stated that Australia does not have a lot of evaluation results of mid-schooling. Some curricula programs applied in Western Australia, which incorporated middle schooling principles, have been quantitatively assessed:
‘Students scores on standardised tests of mathematics, language arts and reading achievement
increased significantly’ ...
The same program:
gains in seventh-grade reading scores (+10 percent), and substantial gains in seventh-grade maths scores
(+6 percent) … on state tests’ ...
There is evidence around the world, and in Australia, which shows that middle schools are working. What he points out is that significant and sustaining improvement of student educational outcomes is difficult to achieve if schools introduce only some elements of middle schooling; that is, middle schooling should be produced comprehensively and holistically, rather than in half measures.
Middle schooling does work; however, it is how you apply it. Nobody from the other side would argue that mid-schooling is not a good program and it will have positive results. The concerns regarding how we do it - do we rush it all together, or do we do it slowly? - is something that the minister has considered. In his statement, he said that Palmerston will be unable to construct the infrastructure in 2007; however, we implement the program in 2007 and students will start moving in 2008.
The government has not made a decision yet about different models. We have looked at a number of models and have invited people to put their own models in place. They will be assessed and then the government will make a decision about the applicability of the most suitable model to implement a middle schooling program.
I am a strong supporter of mid-schooling, and a strong supporter of education - full stop. We have an obligation to provide comprehensive and good education to our young Australians. I always recall something which a friend of mind - who was a refugee - told me about the urban myth that the Vietnamese who came in boats were carrying with them a lot of gold; that is why they established so quickly in Australia. Of course, I asked him the same thing: ‘Did you carry money and gold with you when you came?’ He said: ‘No, Kon, I did not carry any gold. What I carried with me was my education. Gold can be lost, stolen, misplaced, or spent, but education is something that I will have with me forever’.
Madam Speaker, as I said before, we have to give the utmost to education, because education is something that will be with them forever.
Dr LIM (Greatorex): Madam Speaker, I join in this debate to share with the minister some of the community consultation that he missed. I have spoken many times on education, and indigenous education - issues that the member for Stuart says that the CLP never provided. I believe the CLP had nothing to be ashamed of in what we tried to do within the resources that we had in education.
However, the minister failed to attend any of the community consultations across the Territory, as it was so confronting for him, and so conflicting for him. Then he comes along and says: ‘Oh well, we are still consulting, we have not made up our minds’, but he is going to do this and do that. Where he is with it, I am not sure. It sounds like he has made up his mind already but, irrespective of that, he is going to tell everybody he is still consulting. If he is still consulting, then let me tell him what I heard when I attended the community consultation that was held at Centralian College a couple of weeks ago.
The meeting started with Socom introducing the topic, providing fairly motherhood-type statements on the screen, and asking: ‘Do you agree with those things?’ Obviously, nobody disagrees that we ought to have good outcomes for our kids; everybody agrees with that. Everybody says we have to get the best education that money can buy for our children. The minister said: ‘Oh, well, this is what we want to do’. So do we.
The member for Casuarina said the man tells him that he will carry his education with him because that is the one thing that nobody can take away from him. They can take his gold away and all sorts of things.
When the consultation opened at Centralian College, one of the first people who commented from the public was, in fact, Des Rogers. His opening question was: ‘Is this about cost saving, rather than educational outcomes?’ - shifting the deck chairs, he said. Des was very much interested in pushing for the preservation of ANZAC Hill High School, and says that ANZAC Hill High School has the best practice that he is aware of. There was concern that the government was rushing too fast in this process and not listening to people. A teacher from Centralian College said the staff were very apprehensive about what is happening; that there was no frame of reference. This is a teacher who, supposedly, was involved in the workshops that the minister said have been held across the Territory - professional development that he provided with lots of funding. Obviously, this teacher must have missed out. This same teacher said: ‘It seems like it is a fait accompli’, and that the infrastructure was not ready. How does the school try to timetable the classes using the whole day at Centralian College? Lessons are conducted from early morning around 8 am right through to evening time. How do you bring the Year 10s into that?
A mother said that ANZAC Hill High School provided good pastoral care. The students were well supported and, in fact, many of the students from ANZAC Hill High School were taken to Centralian College to do some classes that were not available at ANZAC Hill High School. If Year 10 was shoved to the ANZAC Hill High School, the programming would make it too long a day for children who could be as young as 14 years of age, and that would not be a good thing. The pastoral care provided by Centralian College is very different compared to that provided at ANZAC Hill High School. She felt that the current system was a more suitable system for her children, that it was a staged transition from Year 10 through to Years 11 and 12.
Another person who spoke on behalf of the Alice Springs High School asked what would be the cultural impact of mixing the school students from ANZAC High School with the students from Alice Springs High School. Socom just said: ‘I am not here to answer questions. I am here to provide you with what the government’s position is and you can give me the input’. The questions were opposed.
A mother from Katherine, who is now living in Alice Springs but had come down from Katherine said: ‘Where have you been hiding this wonderful secret? I love this system’ - meaning the current system of ANZAC High School which has Years 7 to 10, Alice Springs High School has Years 7 to 10 plus extension into Years 11 and 12, and Centralian College has Years 11 and 12. Why have we not told the rest of the Territory about this system? She also claims, having come from Katherine, the town that the minister spoke so highly about with its cooperative system, that: ‘Year 10 has to stay in ANZAC Hill High School and Alice Springs High School as it works. That system works in Alice Springs’.
A teacher from Alice Springs High School said that moving Year 10 is not on. The infrastructure at ANZAC and ASHS was already there to provide for Years 7 to 10 and should be utilised accordingly; that there is a need to retain the status quo but to establish closer liaison between the community of the two schools, the sharing of resources between the two schools, and also to dovetail some of the vertical timetabling of some subjects between ASHS, ANZAC and Centralian College.
A member of the ANZAC Hill school council asked: ‘To what extent is this about cost saving?’ There has been no infrastructure spending on ANZAC Hill High School for a long time - well, definitely not in the last five years of this government. Another student at Centralian College said that Year 10 students coming to Centralian College would jeopardize the senior focus. Year 10 students are in a compulsory education stage, whereas Centralian College students are in a post-compulsory stage of education. The majority of Centralian College students want to be there to study and they are treated as adults, plus there are adult-age students at Centralian College doing Years 11 and 12 also. She believes that in the current structure the minister described, Year 10 should stay in the middle school.
It is one of the very few meetings that I have been to in the Alice Springs community where there was a high representation of indigenous people at the meeting. It was also very pleasant to see that there were indigenous people taking a real interest in education and prepared to speak their minds. I sat amongst a group of them in the front rows and just about all of them put up their hands for a microphone to speak. They were putting their points across and they were equally adamant that the system that this government wants to introduce is not good for them.
This ANZAC Hill AIEW said: ‘Putting Year 10 into Centralian College is not good because the children will not be ready. Particularly indigenous students will not be able to cope’. She asked also: ‘What about bush education?’ Another indigenous person used the Students’ Representative Council as an example. Year 10 students are leaders at middle school. Displace them before they are ready, and they take a junior role in the senior college that the minister wants to introduce. He said that if those Year 10 students were sent to Centralian College on a full-time basis, they will not be able to cope. In fact, this first year of Year 10s going to Centralian College will lose that experience of leadership in their school where they would have been the leaders in Year 10. A Year 7 student put up her hand and asked for a microphone and asked why the government would not keep Year 10 in the middle school?
Another teacher from ANZAC Hill High School used to be a teacher at Centralian College for two years. She said: ‘Centralian College is a special place; a unique place and it is at capacity. It does many great things for a great many people including ANZAC Hill High School students. The ANZAC Hill High School Year 10 students are not ready for an environment that Centralian College provides’. This is a teacher who has been at Centralian College for two years previously and now teaches at ANZAC Hill High School, so she knows both environments very well and understands the cultures.
A father who had a child at each school - ANZAC Hill High School and Centralian College - asked a question: ‘How open and transparent is the Martin government and will they listen to the people who have all this to say?’ I was surprised to hear Socom say the minister is determined to shift Year 7 to secondary school. That was quite a firm comment on her part. I do not have any problems with that. Darwin has been quite distinct in its junior high school system compared to Alice Springs. Alice Springs, as the member for Braitling commented, has had Year 7 in secondary school for many years. It has taken a long time and much cooperation amongst the older schools, the primary as well as secondary, to introduce the system and the cooperative environment that has existed in Alice Springs. One of the supporting factors was that Alice Springs is much smaller than Darwin, and allowed a system with Year 7s in secondary school. It has occurred very well and has kept going for the last 15 years.
A mother asked why the minister was not there for the meeting, listening to the students, parents and teachers. She thought it was an insult to them.
A Centralian College student, a young man, said that the students did well at Centralian College; they were treated as adults. He appreciated that method of teaching. The curriculum that stretched between 8 am to 5 pm each day allowed him to exercise his discretion and he did it responsibly and derived a lot of benefit from that. He said he could come and go to school as he felt he needed to. He said: ‘Year 10s will not be able to cope with that and, in fact, it will be safer, better for Year 10s to be left where they are’.
An ANZAC Hill High School student then next said that Year 7s to 10s worked well for them at ANZAC Hill High School. That student wanted to be left alone and asked the minister to leave the school alone. He asked that the rest of the Northern Territory come on board. My comment was made about Irrkerlantye School also, but I will come back to that in a minute.
A mother said: ‘My children have always benefited from the supportive environment of ANZAC Hill High School’. The member for Braitling mentioned that the pastoral care at ANZAC Hill High School and Alice Springs High School is very different to that provided at Centralian College where students are treated much more as if they were in the early years of a university environment.
A Year 10 student from ANZAC Hill High School told a story that she travels to Centralian College twice a week to attend geography lessons. She said that she really found it difficult to cope at Centralian College as she gets lost at the college and feels quite bewildered by the environment. Previous to ANZAC Hill High School, she had studied at Katherine High School and she felt that the system in Alice Springs was a lot better; that she was now in a more cloistered environment in ANZAC Hill High School, supported very well but allowed to vertically integrate into a course in Centralian College. She says that she achieves much more benefit that way. She does not want to be at Centralian College full-time but, by being at ASHS full-time, spending part of her time at Centralian College was more beneficial.
A young student, very cynical in her young years, said that the prospect of closing down the ANZAC Hill High School is for the government to sell the land, a sign of desperation for money. Another ANZAC Hill High School student in Year 7 said that Year 10s should not be moved from ANZAC Hill High School: how can they cope within a bigger school?
Finally, after all those comments were made, John Cooper, the current Principal of ANZAC Hill High School - a man who has been in that role for a long time, who is very highly respected in Alice Springs, and is very learned and whose opinions I respect - then walked up to the front of the room and provided a history of what happened in Alice Springs and made a proposal. First of all, he felt that there was a need to pool the resources in Alice Springs to support secondary education for Years 10 to 12. What he is saying is that Year 10, while it is the peak of junior high school, is also a preparatory year for students moving into secondary college.
There needs to be some degree of training of these Year 10 students to move into the secondary college system. The thing to do is to make sure that, first of all, staffing ratios for Year 10 are equivalent to the staffing levels for Years 11 and 12. As you know, at the moment for primary schools, the teacher/student ratio is one teacher to 22 primary students; for junior secondary, it is one to 17; and for senior secondary, it is one in 14. What he is suggesting is that Year 10s will be started in the ratio of one to 14 as well. That will allow better support for Year 10 students in the secondary school system.
He believes that the location of Year 10 in their current locations should not pose a major stumbling block for the vertical integration of Years 10 to 12 in secondary education. What he proposed was that Year 10 remains in ANZAC Hill High School and Centralian College, but that there be a formalised relationship between Centralian College, ANZAC Hill High School and Alice Springs High School so that Year 10 students can formally move between their current location in Centralian College to a government supported system where they can be transported across if need be. That if they were to have their core Year 10 subjects taught at ANZAC or ASHS, that there will be enough teachers at those schools to provide those lessons. It is important to ensure that enough resources are being provided for ASHS in Alice Springs, otherwise the students will not be able to move across easily. Centralian College is chock-a-block, as we all know. The only way we can accommodate Year 10 in that college would be to put more demountables in, because I am sure you are not going to put money putting bricks and mortar up at this stage.
Minister, you have not listened to the community properly. You talk about consultation, but all the consultation is just a sham. All you have done is make up your mind, and then you used Socom to try to soften the impact that you are going to cop. If you were honest, you would speak to the people, listen to them and take heed.
Mr WOOD (Nelson): Mr Deputy Speaker, in the minister’s statement he said: ‘Today is the time for the opposition and Independent members of parliament to put forward their plan’. I appreciate that offer, but I would probably need a department to back me up if you wanted a full-scale plan of education in the Northern Territory. I welcome the chance to at least put forward some suggestions and comments.
I suppose what you might say is the bleeding obvious: we all know that education is one of the most important gifts we can have in life. Without a good education, you are very unlikely to get a good job in life. We know that many people who do not have a good education end up in a life of poverty or crime to some extent, and struggle through their lives because they have not had the opportunity that good education would give them.
I am going to make a number of statements, and I do so in a positive way. This whole debate revolves around the issue of middle schools. There is a presumption that middle schools will change a problem we have at the present time; that is, we believe we are not achieving the results that we should. I am not the person who can say: ‘I support middle schools wholeheartedly because it is going to do the job’. There are experts here and there saying that the proof of the pudding will be in 10 years time. The minister may not still be here in this parliament in 10 years time - although you never know.
Mr Stirling: Still be minister for Education.
Mr WOOD: That is very good. He will be able to come back to this parliament and say: ‘Told you so’. We really do not know.
The government is taking a gamble, you might say, to some extent by introducing a scheme occurring in other states of Australia that they have looked at, and saying: ‘That is the process, the type of schooling system we should have in the Northern Territory’. I say let us try it. If the system we have at the present time is not working, let us give it a go.
One thing that came out of the meeting at Taminmin - and I will get back to that meeting later – was a number of people said that we should have been looking at the whole school system in the Northern Territory; that is, primary and secondary. A number of people at that meeting at Taminmin said they felt that children were not having the literacy and numeracy skills from their primary schooling that would enable them to do well in secondary school. There were a number of comments about that. I wonder whether, by focusing purely on secondary, we have missed an opportunity to look at primary education because, as we know, there is a direct correlation between whether your years of primary school have been successful and given you a good grounding in education, as to whether you will be able to carry on in secondary school successfully, or you will always be struggling. That was an important comment and, regardless of this middle school process, at the same time we should be seriously looking to see whether the results that are coming out of primary schools are going to be of a high enough standard to make the middle school system work. I hope the minister will take that on board.
I want to talk about the meetings that were held regarding middle schools in the Taminmin and Palmerston area. Unfortunately, I could not get to the Palmerston meeting. As the member for Goyder would know, there was another interesting meeting on that night regarding the Humpty Doo landfill. We were caught between the devil and the deep blue sea.
The reports I had come back from Palmerston was that you probably did not miss much because it was mainly Palmerston people who attended. Those rural people who did go felt it was generally a Palmerston-orientated meeting. What it did highlight is that we should not always put Palmerston and the rural area in the one box. There needs to be meetings in the rural area because it is different - thank heavens – and it does give people in the rural area time to look at their high school which is different from many other high schools in the Northern Territory.
The meeting at Taminmin was, I think, co-chaired by Tony Considine, the new principal of Taminmin High School, and Annette Jamieson who was a principal of one of the schools in Alice Springs. That was a good move because Alice Springs has had the change of Year 7 in high schools for quite a long time, and that was an issue that a number of parents raised. They had concerns about their children moving into this new high school. They had concerns about Year 7 students mixing with Year 12 students. I suppose, from my point of view, that is no big deal.
I started what was Form 1 in Victoria at the age of 10 and I was so excited to get into secondary school because I could wear long trousers. It did not worry me because, if you are brought up with that system you do not see any concerns. However, for people who have lived in the Northern Territory – especially the Top End of the Northern Territory – all their lives, there is a genuine concern that this is a major change for their children. They feel they have missed things their children were looking forward to such as being the school captain next year or on the SRC.
It was good to hear one of the teachers say to those parents: ‘Yes, we understand those concerns and we will do our best to help those children, especially this first group of children who are coming through from primary. We will help them adjust’. The thing I liked about that is that you saw that they were not just teachers; they were people who understood the feelings of the parents and the concerns of the students, and that was good. That helped people get a better understanding of what was to occur. I felt that having the teachers attend that meeting, who will be the ones who will deal with these students, enabled parents to see that they just are not teachers teaching A, B, C; they are teachers who understand the needs of these children and will do something about it. They will help them when the transition occurs. That was very much appreciated.
The other issues from that meeting relate to an issue that I will get onto a little later. You said in your statement there are at least two things that we need to look at – the stages and the infrastructure. I would also add the timing. I have just mentioned Year 7 and the stages are covered pretty well. Year 10 has been an issue in many places. At one of the school council meetings, it was thought Year 10 at Taminmin could be a bit of a crossover. You start to do subjects for Year 11 whilst in Year 10 so, with a bit of clever manipulation, Year 10 is a grey part of the education where it is leaving the middle schools and moving into the senior, not as a cut-off but as a graduation.
I should comment on the Casuarina Secondary College process at this stage, because Year 10 is one of the issues raised there. I know you have a different point of view regarding Casuarina Secondary College. I suppose I am looking at it as an outsider. I go to the students’ awards and see that big list of students who achieve well in Year 11 and 12 at Casuarina Secondary College. All I can say is I hope the models are not that rigid that you cannot allow choice. Could Casuarina Secondary College exist as it is as a choice for parents? Some other models might be different. There might be Year 10, 11 and 12. Casuarina Secondary College is still Years 11 and 12 and the choice is there for parents whether they wanted to send their kids to that school or another model. If it is not broke, we do not need to fix it. I would be interested in the minister’s point of view on that.
Infrastructure is one of those areas that concern people at Taminmin. My understanding is that the infrastructure requirement for Taminmin - to have it ready by the year 2007 - would be five new classrooms, a major upgrade in the IT Services, and a power upgrade. I know there are people in the library who know that the library would need a major upgrade; it is too small at the present time. If we are to increase the numbers in that school, we would have to upgrade the library. You have to remember the library is also a community library which is not only the school, but the local rural area and also country borrowers use it. It is the area where the books go out throughout the Northern Territory.
Mr Stirling: Same as Nhulunbuy.
Mr WOOD: Same as Nhulunbuy. Like many facilities; we should share them.
If parents do not believe that you can have that infrastructure finished and the model running successfully by the year 2007, they will not send their kids to the school. They will either keep them back in primary school or they will send them somewhere else. What they would need to know from the government is whether they can have that infrastructure in place by the year 2007.
That leads me to timing. I would rather see this process go to 2008 if that is not the case. Do not rush it. We have gone this far, let us make sure it is right. One of the dangers is you could do more damage rushing it, and all the good work you have put into trying to get up a new concept in education could go out the door if people find the infrastructure is not in place nor properly set up when their children go to school. That is why there are important stages; the infrastructure and the timing are the key things. The timing at this stage – especially as my understanding is that the school council at Taminmin, parents and teachers are generally in support of the middle school process that you are trying to introduce. However, that will fail if it is rushed. I would rather see you provide five classrooms, upgrade the IT services, put in the power and upgrade the library properly at Taminmin by 2008. That would make the process much more successful and give parents confidence that everything is okay when they send their children to that school.
There are other issues as well. You are going to have to upgrade the bus service or, if you do not upgrade it, you are going to have to change it because more children will be going to a different school. The Minister for Planning and Lands loves issues about buses. There will have to be changes which have to be looked at. In the rural area that is not an easy process because, even though we are talking about Taminmin today, quite a number of students in the rural area already do Year 7 at secondary schools like Marrara, Kormilda, and St John’s which have a middle school concept and, I gather, O’Loughlin could move over to that any time it liked. There are a number or private schools already taking children from the rural area who are going through the middle school process.
I believe the member for Goyder might have received this letter as well, so he might have been going to refer to it. It is from Norma and Cliff Fowler. They used to be in my constituency but they are now in the member for Goyder’s constituency. I will read this letter from Cliff Fowler:
Perhaps this person and I could have got together and put forward my plans, minister:
That is the Junior Secondary Studies Certificate:
I read that because he is a person who has had many years experience in teaching. He says, partly, what I was trying to say and what I have picked up from the Taminmin High School: let us not hurry it in case that causes disruption and ill feeling. Let us introduce it, but make sure that the parents, the teachers and the community are satisfied that it is time to, that all the infrastructure is there, and people have an understanding of exactly what is occurring. That way, in the end, we bring in a better system for all our children so that they are educated and have a much better future in the Northern Territory, especially trying to get employment and jobs which we all need.
Dr BURNS (Planning and Lands): Mr Deputy Speaker, I am very pleased to support the Education minister’s statement on middle years education in the Northern Territory. The Northern Territory faces unique challenges in the provision of education resulting from its size and scattered population. The issues confronting teachers and students in our major population centres such as Darwin and Alice Springs are different to those faced in communities such as Ramingining and Kalkarindji. One thing, however, is abundantly clear: our children are entitled to an education system that is at least equal to, if not better than, other jurisdictions in Australia. It is simply unacceptable that students in the Northern Territory are, on average, five points behind their South Australian counterparts in their tertiary entrance results. The educational outcomes are an indication that something is wrong with the system.
When this government came to office in 2001, one of its clear objectives was to turn the situation around. My colleague, the Minister for Employment, Education and Training, has outlined the work which has already been completed. The Martin government commissioned the Ramsey review in 2002. This comprehensive analysis of secondary education in the Northern Territory identified the problems within the existing system and recommended solutions. As the Education minister has detailed, the Ramsey review’s fundamental conclusion was that a greater focus on the middle years of education was the key to achieving better results and stemming the flow of students dropping out of high school.
There has been a growing awareness over the past decade of the specific learning needs of students in the middle years of schooling. This is as a result of significant research activity, both in Australia and overseas, and identifies the challenges in engaging these students in learning. If students are alienated rather than engaged in learning, then it is equally likely that they are alienated in developing the knowledge, skills and capabilities that allow them to participate in a meaningful way in academic, social and community life.
At the heart of the Ramsey review was an extensive process of community consultation. The success of this process is reflected in the fact that it received more than 100 submissions. The recommendations of the Ramsey review were again put out for public consultation. As parents, we appreciate the premium that people place on their children’s education. Let me reiterate: we are committed to public consultation and engagement in this process.
Like many MLAs, I regularly attend council meetings at schools within my electorate. In my case, I have been listening to the views of parents and teachers at Wagaman, Jingili and Moil Primary Schools, as well as Casuarina Senior College. In general, primary schools in my electorate are supportive of the concept and approach of middle schools. Nevertheless, parents have rightly raised questions and concerns about the process of moving to middle schooling, and I would expect nothing less of people concerned about their children’s education. I have sought to answer their questions and listen to their concerns. I can assure them that all the issues they have raised will be passed on to my colleagues within Caucus and Cabinet. This, after all, is what community consultation is all about.
Recently, I also met a delegation of teachers from Casuarina Senior College. I must say the meeting was very cordial. We canvassed a broad range of issues over the course of the meeting, which went on for over an hour-and-a-half. I respect the teachers input, as well as their professionalism. At that meeting, I was able to share with those teachers that I went to a selective school when I grew up in Brisbane – I went to the Brisbane State High School which was a school which selected students on the basis of their marks in what was known then as the ‘scholarship examination’ which was a public examination in Queensland in Year 8. On the basis of your marks, if they were good enough, you were accepted into the Brisbane State High School and into the selective class. If you came from the feeder area for that particular school, you could automatically attend that school.
That selective process continued throughout my secondary schooling in that, once you reached Year 10, there was another public examination which was called ‘the junior examination’, similar to what the member for Nelson was speaking about before. On the basis of those marks, you could then get into the senior class, which had all the best teachers and resources. It was a showcase of the public secondary system in Queensland. It was out of that class that quite a lot of the top marks in the Year 12 examination came from. I was not one of those. I did pretty well in that examination, but I did not get a place in the top 20. There was much competition within my class to see who could get the best marks.
Most people I went to secondary school with in Years 9 to 12 with whom I have kept in contact with have done pretty well in life. They have received a good education and a good foundation for their lives. I often wonder about the rest of the school. I suppose it did not have the attention or the teachers for the particular subjects that we did.
So it is with Casuarina Senior College. There is no doubt that, in the Northern Territory Certificate of Education, Casuarina Senior College does very well. Every year it gets at least 10 out of that top 20. However, as I discussed with the teachers that I met, from the spread of results that I could see, my analysis over the years of 2000 to 2004 is that there are actually two groups of students within Casuarina Senior College. There is that group of students who do very well and are represented in that top group of students. Then there are the students in another group who struggle to get their NTCE, particularly in the two-year period, and their marks are well behind. You can actually see in the distribution of marks there are two peaks that really represent those two groups of students.
I commend Casuarina Senior College for the work they do and the results they achieve every year in that NTCE. That is highly regarded and I am proud to be the local representative in that area where Casuarina Senior College is. It draws students not only from my electorate but from all over Darwin, and they do a fantastic job.
However, this is not just about any one school or any one group of students. This is about all our students; it is about all our schools. I have been really heartened by the debate this evening because members from all sides are taking this debate very seriously. I believe the community is taking this debate very seriously. I can assure them that, as a member of Cabinet and of the Caucus on this side of the House, all of us are listening very carefully to the feedback that we are getting from our communities. That will be an integral part of the consideration about the implementation of this model.
It is a very important debate that we are having. I have been a member of the Casuarina Senior College Council for a number of years now. Ever since I entered parliament and before, when I was a candidate, I started attending the Casuarina Senior College Council meetings. I have worked very constructively with the college and I have written to all new members of the college this year. I have said up-front that the middle schools issue is a very important issue that we have to work through. I have undertaken to work constructively with the college and the council to secure a positive result for all concerned.
The middle years of schooling encompasses the developmental stages of a child’s adolescence. Students who prosper in their middle years at school - whether it be emotionally, socially or educationally - have an excellent chance of success at senior secondary level and beyond. The opposite is true for students who become disengaged in their middle years. The quality of this phase of schooling is of crucial importance to the future lives and prospects of young Territorians.
I emphasise the middle schools approach is about how you teach and not so much about what you teach, although the member for Nelson made some good suggestions, I thought, about students in Year 10 taking on subjects and pointing them towards Years 11 and 12. I am assured that that is part of the approach as well.
The transition from primary school to secondary school can be a traumatic period for some students. At primary school, children develop closer relationships with their teachers, a bond of trust is developed and the child is accustomed to having a single teacher to teach all their lessons. On arrival at secondary school, the student is suddenly confronted with numerous teachers teaching numerous subjects. The middle years approach is a transition between the two, which is a move away from the single teacher concept, but not to the extent of having one teacher per subject. For example, teachers may group subjects teaching both maths and science or both English and social studies.
This has the effect of providing a more stable environment for the student, as well as allowing for greater pastoral care; a crucial element in any child’s education. The Education minister has spoken at length about the Building Better Schools package he launched last year. This $42m package reflects the Martin government’s commitment to improving standards of education in the Territory. It shows what can be achieved with responsible fiscal management and the delivery of three surplus budgets in a row. The package targets resources for both students and teachers - students through greater choices and options as well as providing access to counsellors and career advisers, and teachers through funding for professional development. This commitment to the professional development of our teachers deserves to be applauded.
Since 2001, the Martin government has allocated nearly $5m to this program. I was very pleased to hear the Education minister detail extensive programs of professional development and training that his department will conduct this year. This includes support for individual schools and teachers to prepare for the introduction of middle years approaches to teaching and learning, as well as leadership training, study scholarships and grants for teachers to attend conferences. Last year’s budget also focused on improving education infrastructure with the program of nearly $50m. This included $23.95m for capital works; $6m for minor new works and $19.5m for repairs and maintenance.
Mr Deputy Speaker, the Martin government is investing in Territory schools, teachers and students with greater funding for teaching and education resources, school upgrades and more classroom equipment. The minister began and concluded his statement with the message that ‘doing nothing is not an option’. I endorse that position and restate the government’s commitment to focusing on this crucial development phase for our students, their middle years of education.
Ms LAWRIE (Family and Community Services): Mr Deputy Speaker, I congratulate the minister for his important statement. You do not need to go past the start of his statement that ‘our students lag behind the rest of the nation’, to realise the importance of this statement to our society. As both a parent and a politician, I agree that we cannot sit back and do nothing. For too long, education was under-resourced and under-funded. The Martin Labor government has put additional resources into education. Importantly, we have employed an extra 100 teachers. Now that we have put more resources into the system, it is quite appropriate to look at the overall structure of our education system. This was the point of the secondary review of education, which has led to the debate that we are currently having in our community on middle schooling.
In regard to middle years, in talking to the primary schools and the secondary school in the community, I found overall support for middle years, as we have also seen in this Chamber through this debate. The concept of middle years has strong support. People appreciate that there is an intention to improve educational outcomes, and middle years is a proven method of improving educational outcomes.
There is a whole host of queries around what the implementation of the change will look like and what the changes will do to affect each person’s child or each person’s school or, indeed, each teacher’s career path. Quite legitimately, there has been some really robust and important debate around the detail of that. I see that as a really good service to the government, because it is exactly our intention in community consultation to tease out the issues of concern in the community and in our school system.
That has happened in the debate on middle years schooling. It is a very healthy thing for the Territory because, even though the government has been putting forward discussion around middle years for schools since 2003, it was really only a core of parents on the school councils, teachers and administrators in education who had even cottoned onto the debate at all. It took a time frame. It took a concerted effort and a bold step by the minister for Education to say: ‘We are introducing middle year school policy and this is the time frame in which we are looking at doing it’, to focus the community’s mind quite clearly on the debate that middle years of school deserves.
I congratulate the minister for Education for taking that bold step and, indeed, the government for supporting him in that step. In discussions I was having with school principals in my electorate late last year and into early this year, they were all of the view that it would take something bold from the government to get the community to actually focus on understanding middle schools; what the pedagogy of middle schools meant; understanding what potential structural changes would come about as a result of middle schools; understanding what opportunities were inherent within the middle school system; and that was only a bold announcement around time lines that would get people focused on it. That is exactly what we have seen.
I know that the shadow minister spent a fair amount of his contribution focusing on and disparaging the work and professionalism of Sheila O’Sullivan. However, it is extremely useful to have a skilled facilitator undertake community consultation. Through the secondary review consultation process, I saw the way Sheila O’Sullivan did everything, during debate at the community consultation, to try to tease out peoples’ suggestions, views, alternative ideas, and alternative proposals. It is sad when you get down to a level of debate that we have had in the Chamber this evening, attacking the professionalism of someone who, quite appropriately, is there to engage the community and tease out the community’s thinking on the issue.
I congratulate Sheila O’Sullivan and her Socom team. They have done that extremely well - so well, in fact, that we heard the Chief Minister in Question Time today say that there have been additional models brought forward as a result of the community consultation. That is all information that is quite legitimately put before government in the assessments that are going on at the moment around the community consultation, the response and feedback to the models, and any new suggested models that have come forward from the consultation.
For example, within the section of northern suburbs that I represent, Mr Deputy Speaker, along with yourself, there was a Pathways model put forward by Sanderson High School which involved Malak Primary School. I attended a meeting of parents at the Malak Primary School where the Pathways model was suggested to the parents by both Principals of Sanderson High School and Malak Primary School. People were shocked - absolutely shocked. Their reaction was: ‘We do not want Malak Primary School to change as a primary school. We think this is a primary school of excellence. We are delighted with what you are doing in the primary education of our children at this school’. To me, it was a really interesting debate where you had educators who said: ‘Here is a model’. They are enormously experienced educators. Those principals put a lot of effort and thought into what kind of a model could work as a Pathways model to meet a cohort of students in the northern suburbs. Yet, the parents responded and said: ‘No way. We will not accept that model’.
What it showed me is that, in looking at models, you have to be prepared to have a genuine debate and discussion with your parent, student and teacher communities. It might be uncomfortable and confronting at times, but it is a healthy process to go through. That is what I recognise by this middle years of school debate that is happening through the consultation process; we have teased out the concerns that people have. Those concerns are quite broad-ranging. The range of concerns is: ‘Is our school canteen going to continue to be viable? Is the transport system going to cater to my child’s needs? Will I be travelling in a direction away from work to drop my child off at school, or will I be travelling in a direction to work? Will my different aged children attending middle years of school and senior years of school be able to be catered for?’
For parents with many children in a household, if they have two or three kids straddling the years of primary to middle to senior, these are very legitimate issues that, as parents, they are quite appropriately grappling with - quite separate to the actual educational issues that, as a parent and not necessarily an educator, they would find more difficult to get their heads around. When people start to talk about middle years of school pedagogy, you literally see parents shift back in their seat, uncomfortable because it is taking them outside of an area of knowledge that they have. I really enjoyed participating in the discussions at my school communities around just what pedagogy means.
What I have been delighted to see in the debates, certainly in the electorate of Karama, is that people are prepared to embrace change if they understand the change. They are prepared to embrace change where they see the benefits to not just their children but the broader education system as well. It has been quite confronting for parents to say: ‘How does this affect my individual child but, importantly, how does this affect the education of children in the Northern Territory?’ I have been really very proud of the debate that I have heard in my community where people have taken the bigger picture as well as their own individual picture on board.
I can say that, whilst there have been logistical issues raised at each of my school communities, there is an underlying and broad support for middle years of school. I have been able to work through many of those logistical issues in discussion with the school communities, to the point where many people have become far more comfortable about a process of change that could be as early as January 2007.
Quite legitimately, teachers want to know what their professional development is. One of those areas where government, I understand, has done a lot of work through DEET is around the issue of professional development; around the issue of curriculum. Sometimes, when you are having a debate you cannot get to the level of detail to inform people of the legitimate questions they have around pedagogy, curriculum and the relevant human resources aspects that will confront the teaching profession through this change.
It has really shown the great leadership we have within our school communities, where the principals have embraced the need to engage their school community, both in terms of their own staff as well as the parents and, importantly in this picture, the students. Where principals have shown leadership and embraced their school community, I have seen a great deal less concern and anxiety than where people have not been as well informed or well attuned to the information that is available in our community.
I congratulate DEET, which has gone to a great deal of effort in producing easy as possible to understand literature and pamphlets that went home to all affected parents. I know that through the high schools it was directly mailed out, and in the primary schools it was distributed through the school system. The feedback I received from parents was that they were very appreciative of that information. I congratulate DEET for going to the effort to provide that level of information. There is a really good tool in the web site, to be able to access additional information regarding the middle years of school. Giving informed parents the triggers to find out more information has been an important aspect of the middle years schooling debate. I congratulate the minister for ensuring that his department has been geared to providing information for people who want to obtain it.
We should never have lost sight in this debate that it is so important for a kids that they get a good education in the Northern Territory. We are not going to be prepared to sit still and sell them short of what they justly deserve; that is, the best possible education, because a better education will lead to a more skilled work force. It will be great for our economy, will have good outcomes for health, for social cohesion and things such as crime reduction. The benefits that a good education underpins in the broader community are enormous.
I commend the government for being bold enough to say that we will do what we have to do in our role in government to improve education. It is interesting, when I am having debate at the local community level, I say: ‘There is one thing that you can rest assured about, there is not a single cost-saving measure involved in this middle years of school debate’. There is no saving to government budgets in middle years of school, in fact, quite the opposite. The government is committing to middle years of school, a far greater expenditure of resources, a far greater education budget. This is not paring down what we are providing in education; it is actually about enhancing our education system. When you can put it in that context, you can see people then start to engage. They have lost their fear and cynicism, and they start to get curious about improving education. For me, that has been a really engaging and enjoyable process to go through with my local community. I am not saying that there will be 100% agreement in our society about any ultimate decision of government.
I have to say that the aspects of the opposition’s contribution that I was disappointed in today were some presumptions that decisions had already been made by Cabinet. I am a member of Cabinet. I know that those presumptions are wrong. I know that this has been a genuine process in adopting a policy of middle years schooling, and taking an approach around that policy out to our community for consultation. A presumption that we have already made a decision on that outcome is absolutely wrong. I can say that, in all honesty, there is a genuine desire by this government to hear from our community about what they are interested in with the implementation of middle years of school. I have articulated only a few of them in my contribution to this debate in the Chamber.
I have not touched on the concerns that minister Burns, for example, commented on in regards to Year 10s joining Year 11 and 12 at Casuarina Senior College. One of the things that I found attractive in the debate and discussions I have had with my school communities last year and into this year, is the desire to see an improved pastoral care within our education system; to see an improved emphasis on caring for the student and the student’s overall wellbeing. If you do not care for their wellbeing, they tend to be the ones who drop out and contribute to the appalling retention rates that we have within the Territory. Whereas, if you support the wellbeing of the student, their wellbeing encourages an improved learning capacity and an improved learning capacity encourages retention and keeping them through school and skilling them up for their future, which is critically important to their overall wellbeing in their life.
One thing I have challenged people on in the Casuarina Senior College debate is that it is a school where the emphasis is on - and debate has been articulated around - teaching kids who want to be there in Years 11 and 12, and not wanting to take on the kids who have to be there. I challenge some of those urban myths. I have spoken to kids who have just come out of Casuarina Senior College. As a person who has been through the Territory education system myself, as a local, I have challenged them to show me any kid at their school who, irrespective of the law in regard to the compulsory age of schooling, stays in school if they do not want to stay in school. It is an absolute myth to think that a kid will stay in school because they think: ‘Oh, hang on, what is the legal compulsory age of schooling?’ That is an absolute nonsense. The kids stay in school because school is engaging them, caring for their wellbeing, and providing them with learning opportunities that they actually feel interested in and engaged about.
I have a great deal of regard for the teaching staff at Casuarina Senior College. I know some of them well. I have known past senior teaching staff of Casuarina Senior College extremely well. I do not undermine their professionalism when I say that I know students who have not survived the Casuarina Senior College ethos where it is up to you to turn up to school, to engage in these subjects, and to learn. The kids I have seen fall through a system like that are the disadvantaged kids in our society. They are the kids from a non-Anglo Saxon background. They are the children of my Thai, Filipino, Indonesian, and South-East Asian constituents. They are the indigenous kids in my electorate. I am sorry; if there is a way that we can improve pastoral care by putting Year 10s into Casuarina Senior College, then good. It is a good outcome as far as I am concerned. If you have to give a damn about whether or not a kid is attending school, is engaged in the school process or going to stay at school, that is an excellent outcome.
I encourage the minister for Education in the path he is taking. Does that deal with the relevant and quite appropriate issue of the Year 10 curriculum? No, it does not. However, I have absolute confidence in both the minister and his agency in looking at the SACE review and what it has raised in relation to Year 10 curriculum, and embracing as an aspect the next stage of our middle years at school debate, and ensuring we have a strong curriculum within our senior schools, which is Years 10, 11 and 12 under the model that the government is currently proposing. When middle years at school is resolved as a debate within our education community, the job is not finished there.
As the Minister for Family and Community Services, I know there is a great amount of work being done around early learning within our education system. I have always argued vehemently that if you wait until someone is 11 to 14 to deal with their fundamental education needs, you have waited too long; you have missed the boat. The most important time for learning is nought to eight. That is what the studies say; that is what the information shows. There is still a challenge there in the integration between the Family and Community Services aspects of government, which I have responsibility for, and the education for which the Education minister has responsibility. Is the government sitting idle on that? No, it is not. We have working groups between the two agencies which are developing and improving our early education from nought to eight within our Territory government system.
What I am doing in explaining this debate around middle years schooling is that this is part of an education reform. It is not the end; it is an important section of it and we need to get the middle section right. However, it does raise issues around the Year 10 curriculum which teachers have brought to me and said there has been a dumb down of our Year 10 curriculum over the years. Issues raised in the review said that there is a potential of a further dumb down of Year 10 curriculum which does not underpin the strength and veracity we need for Year 11 and 12. I have absolute faith in our minister and our agency to embrace and tackle those issues as part of putting to bed any implementation around the middle years of school, as we have a focus and debate in education reform that has been brought forward and driven by a government that has an absolute understanding of the need to improve education in the Territory.
Mr Deputy Speaker, I commend the minister for his statement. I urge all members of this House to enter into a healthy, non-divisive debate to improve the education of our children in the Territory.
Mr McADAM (Local Government): Mr Deputy Speaker, I support the statement by my colleague, the Minister for Employment, Education and Training. I know the minister has the best interests of Territory students and their families at heart. That is why he is showing the courage and determination to reform secondary education in the way he is. His essential point ‘that doing nothing is not an option’, cannot be argued.
Since this government came to power in 2001, education reform has been a priority. The minister and government recognised then, and even more so now, that change was necessary as the results were just not there. Our greatest resource in the Territory is our young people, but for our young people to participate in the fastest growing economy in Australia it is necessary for them to have the skills, education and knowledge. As the minister has outlined, the results secondary students achieve are considerably lower than their South Australian peers. Bearing in mind that the levels achieved in Darwin and Alice Springs are, on average, five units below that of South Australia - which, incidentally, is the worst jurisdiction in Australia - it asks the question: what the hell is happening to our people out in the bush? If our people who have reasonable opportunity to educational opportunities in the larger regions are five points below, who knows the situation with our people out in the bush. It is for that reason alone that it is very important that the minister has undertaken this particular task as, in the long term, it will provide some real impetus and outcomes for those people who live in the bush.
Much of the economic growth of the Territory is coming from the regions. Growth in the mining sector, continued development of the tourism industry, the continuous stability of the pastoral industry, and exciting new prospects in horticulture and agriculture means that employment prospects have never been better in the regions. However, such economic opportunities can only be realised by a work force with the skills and ability to participate to the maximum. Our secondary schools are a critical element in our society and our economy.
Allow me to outline some of the steps this government has made, or is making, that will advance secondary education in the regions. This government has made it compulsory for all schools, no matter how remote or how small, to cater for all students up to the age of 15 years. No longer will we see 13- or 14-year-olds turned away because there are no educational programs for them at their local school. The creation of a new improved Distance Education Centre will see it support middle year students who are living outside urban areas.
As well, small remote schools through the cluster system are exploring ways to aggregate middle year students so that visiting staff can service their educational needs. It is my understanding also that pools of secondary teachers have been created under Building Better Schools that will support small and remote schools and middle years education. In addition, collaborative school sites will see smaller remote schools work with larger regional schools to deliver middle years and senior secondary education.
I know that Borroloola Community Education Centre has begun planning to become a centre for secondary delivery in the Gulf region. This will enable middle schools to be approached and delivered there.
At this point, I find it a very sad indictment on the previous CLP government in regards to their policy whereby they determined that there would be no secondary education opportunities for those people who lived in the bush, or at least for those people who lived outside the major regional centres. One can only wonder at the lost opportunities, the denial of rights of individuals, the denial of human rights and, essentially, the denial of a person to be able to fully participate on an equal footing with the rest of our community. For this reason, I believe that the steps that the minister has taken today will automatically flow on to those regions out in the bush that have previously been denied opportunities so much cherished by people who live in the larger centres.
I now turn to Tennant Creek High School. Most members will be aware it has been taking Year 7 students for a number of years and is also thoroughly committed to this model. The minister has mentioned the full range of community consultations undertaken so far. I can report that the Tennant Creek consultations were very well received, and demonstrated a positive attitude to the concept of middle schooling. Indeed, there is a particular teacher at Tennant Creek who is a trained and experienced middle years teacher. He cannot wait to get his teeth into this new model.
Tennant Creek has long been a place where forward thinking ideas originate and thrive. It has to be on account of issues of size and distance that bedevil places such as my home town. It is also a town that is well aware of its cultural background and the need to work with the various communities that constitute its population. A successful alternative provision program has been running for the last few years, which includes many aspects of a successful middle schools approach. This alternative provision program has influenced the way the high school operates.
As I said earlier, Year 7 students have attended Tennant Creek High School for quite some time. We have learned from Tennant Creek High what may be successfully applied and what is required in a successful middle schools approach. Firstly, in the critical Years 7 to 9 cohort group, Tennant Creek has chosen to segregate indigenous boys and girls into separate classes. This is entirely in keeping with indigenous educational practices and seems to produce improved results and, obviously, a better learning environment. As well, students are placed in multi-age classes, enabling older students to assist in the education of their younger peers - once again, a method based upon traditional Aboriginal educational practice. School is run in such a way that the teachers come to the students - not the reverse – therefore, providing a stable learning environment for a student relatively new to the high school. It is envisaged that teams of teachers will be organised so that young, new teachers gain the benefit of working with more experienced teachers.
Not surprisingly, what we have learnt from Tennant Creek High School above all else, is that indigenous students need warm, friendly teachers with them for large blocks of their learning day. It is possibly close to an old-fashioned primary school model, based upon friendly faces and people learning together and respecting each other. What has also been learnt is that there needs to be a strenuous effort put into breaking down barriers between the bush and the town kids.
I am informed that the alternative secondary approach run in Tennant Creek has been very successful in that regard. As part of the approach, Years 7 to 9 do accredited training every day, as well as the more traditional academic programs such as maths, science, etcetera. Also included are units in beef cattle production conducted on the site of the old Juno Horse Centre, as well as units in construction and motor mechanics. At present, the alternative secondary education model in Tennant Creek is not linked with similar programs run in other parts of the Northern Territory. I would very much like the Department of Education, Employment and Training to look at how these linkages could be developed, because the teachers delivering the program in Tennant Creek are assuredly some of the most experienced teachers in the Northern Territory and they have made significant breakthroughs in delivering secondary education to indigenous students.
I believe, for the first time in the Territory’s history, we are well placed to take advantage of our geography. For most of our history, we have been vast distances from where the economic action has been occurring, but now, with the dynamic economies of China and India growing, the Territory is the right place at the right time, probably for the first time in our history. However, to take advantage of our geography, we need our people to be educated, trained and prepared. Reform of secondary education is essential if we are going to be smart enough to take advantage of our geography.
In conclusion, I am proud that the minister has the courage to take on the important job of reforming secondary education. I am confident that middle schooling is one of the ways that we will realise our potential as a smart state, with a population dynamically involved in the fastest growing region in the world. I do know that, by institution of these reforms, these efforts will flow to the bush automatically and allow the same opportunity for our young children who choose to live out there.
Ms McCARTHY (Arnhem): Mr Deputy Speaker, I support the Education minister’s statement on middle schools. I would like to focus largely on the bush schools and, in particular, the electorate of Arnhem, where we have at least 15 schools many of which have already been very much a part of secondary middle schooling.
On my visits, which have been quite regular in recent weeks, I have been able to discuss this with the teachers, parents and school councils in the region who are watching very closely the debate and all the information that is coming through in Darwin, Alice Springs and Katherine. As the Chief Minister said today, we are on track, there is no need to slow down. Those words are really encouraging because, of the work that has gone into middle schooling by the Education minister and people in his department. This work goes back to Dr Gregor Ramsey, who had a team of experts that travelled across the Northern Territory, receiving 113 submissions, visiting 129 areas, including 40 remote communities. On those visits, it was quite clear, and Aboriginal families in particular made it quite clear, that secondary school was failing indigenous children in our communities.
It was the driving force behind a lot of the things that Dr Ramsey made in his recommendations towards improving secondary schooling for children in remote areas. It is something that I commend the Education minister on for picking up quite early in the piece. As I have travelled around Arnhem, I have had the delight in seeing the increase in student numbers in our secondary component of our schools. We now have our children in schools like Bulman and Minyerri staying on, not going away to Darwin or Katherine because they are being offered opportunities right there in their communities.
I would like to just share a little information about some of the communities which are going very strongly. In May this year, it will be the first anniversary of the Minyerri School, the Stage 2 secondary building which was opened last year. That came about because the community wanted to have secondary education in their own community. They were worried about their children going away. Many of them would come back because they were homesick or because they could not keep up with the work or teasing – all sorts of reasons why kids going away to boarding school were just not succeeding.
Minyerri was able to have its own secondary school which opened in May last year. It has taken them quite some time to get to that point but, because the school is now there, it also has been able to maintain and hold on to those children who have left primary and continue on. Those age groups we lose from school of all our 11-, 12-, 13-, 14-years-old children - at those ages, they become disinterested, disengaged – Minyerri is holding onto them and saying: ‘Hey, stay here. Stay with us. Complete your education because we can do it right here in our community’.
The school at Minyerri has quite good facilities. It has a computer lab, administration office, storerooms, specialist classrooms for home economics and science, and three general classrooms and ablution facilities. I highlight Minyerri because it gave me a lot of hope as I travelled around Arnhem, to see that we already had something in place, albeit new, that was leading the way. Surrounding communities like Jilkminggan, Urapunga and Ngukurr are just down the road on the Roper Highway and they are seeing what is happening at Minyerri. There is great hope in those community schools that they can progress into something similar to what is happening at Minyerri.
Last week, I was at Bulman where Annette Miller is doing a great job, so much so that the secondary school students who are staying on at Bulman School and not going into Katherine or Darwin, have increased so much that the school now needs to use the local teachers’ staff room as an extra classroom. That is probably not a good thing in resourcing for our kids, but it is certainly a delight to see that the number of students staying there and continuing on. Students that we would have lost quite early in the piece, not going to school at all, are continuing on at Bulman primary/secondary school there. The next step, no doubt, which I will be working hard at, is to ensure that we do have extra classrooms for these children who are staying on in our communities.
At Ngukurr, the senior secondary is the same. We have a couple of classrooms there. It is really exciting. The teachers who have taken on the senior secondary at Ngukurr are teachers who have left Minyerri. They have been able to establish the senior secondary school at Minyerri, and now have kicked off at Ngukurr with such an increase in attendance of school-aged children from those ages of 13, 14, 15, the really vital ages where we know within our indigenous communities and where Dr Gregor Ramsey was told on numerous occasions, we were losing our children and their interest in any form of education. For indigenous children, in particular, the necessity to at least learn and understand the western way of life is absolutely crucial to their survival, as it is to all children.
When I talk about the schools in the remote areas, I also think of places like Bickerton Island. We have a teacher there who is working with children from the ages of five to 15 years, with the interest and enthusiasm of students wanting to stay on there. It is a pattern that we are seeing. The government and the Education minister is acutely aware that, because students are staying on, we know we need to resource all these areas, in particular out bush.
With the debate that is going on with middle schools in Darwin, Katherine, and Alice Springs, it is highlighting the exciting developments and the new road that we are going to go down. Yes, we have heard the word ‘risk’ but it is not something to be afraid of. I am absolutely confident that with all the debate that is going on people are feeling as though they are being heard. Students, teachers and parents are all being heard amidst this process and this debate about secondary or middle schools education.
In talking about the bush schools of the Arnhem electorate, I would also like to add how the teachers in those areas battle all sorts of things from the isolation to the weather. Just last week, our teachers in Beswick experienced concerns again with the nearby Waterhouse River. It is difficult to cope in those circumstances, and these are factors that our government is acutely aware of. We know that Beswick needs and would like to have a new school on higher ground. I am confident that it is going to happen and it is something that I know the Education minister is also familiar with. I am also pushing on behalf of the teachers and students in Beswick; conscious that every Wet Season we watch and wait to see whether they are going to make it through.
What makes it even more hopeful is that you can look up the road from Beswick and see Manyallaluk. Manyallaluk teachers and students are now housed in the most beautiful building where once they were in a small storeroom for quite some time, screaming for their own school building. This year, we are going to be opening a new school building at Manyallaluk which caters for children up to the ages of nine, 10, 11, and 12. I am sure the community there is thinking and talking about how to keep their children going to school. That middle school component is the area that we all know is the development of our youth, whatever their colour or their background. It is that age group we know we must keep engaged and interested, in an environment where they feel secure to learn, to grow, to be the people that they are here to be.
As I travel around the Arnhem electorate and see these things occurring and talk to the teachers and students and, in particular, the parents, I ask them: ‘How are you going? What is going on here that is encouraging? What more can we do?’ There is plenty more we can do.
One of the things that I find really discouraging when we talk about the need for teachers, families and children who work together in a collaborative situation, is that was supported under what was known as the ASSPA program which, for those who are unfamiliar with that term, is the Aboriginal Student Support Parental Awareness Program that no longer exists because the federal government axed that program over a year ago. For many Aboriginal students, the school would actually get up to $200 per student to be able to incorporate families into the school environment to put on activities in a way that encouraged school and community participation in a harmonious way, but also in a culturally appropriate way. For most schools, I know it worked really well. There were the occasional schools or committees where it did not work that well but, on the whole, the program was very good.
In places like Beswick now, where once they would have had $30 000 in ASSPA funding, they do not have anything. They now have to apply under what is called the PSPI program and compete for that funding. In most cases, they do not get it. Therefore, they have gone from $30 000 to absolutely nothing. If you are lucky, you might have $2000 to $3000 under the new program. The impact that this has had on the schools that I have been visiting in the last few weeks and over the last six months, is that the parental participation in the schools has dropped off. The encouragement does not seem to be as strong any more. This is of real concern. I am talking to families and parents again to see what we can do to overcome the fact that that bucket of money is gone.
However, the core issue still remains that our children need to be educated. How can we work together and come together on this? The bright light is what is happening out of the Northern Territory government with the building of schools like Minyerri, Manyallaluk, and with the support of schools like Bulman. I bring back to the Education minister that, yes, the middle schools process is so important out there in the bush schools. No doubt, the bush schools are watching what is happening. It is absolutely courageous that we are initiating this right across the Northern Territory. It is important that we always listen in every circumstance. I am confident that we are doing that. Indeed, the Education minister has been hearing today the thoughts that were coming from all members of parliament on what they see as some high points and some low points.
Madam Speaker, I commend the minister on his statement.
Mr BURKE (Brennan): Madam Speaker, in reply to the minister’s statement, my contribution is one of optimism, congratulations and thanks to the many stakeholders and contributors to this consultation. It is mainly focused on Palmerston, although I will make some wider personal observations.
First, let me make clear my interest is to see in place a better public education system than the one that currently exists. I have no doubt whatsoever that this is the key aim of the minister for Education and this government. How should we gauge what is better? Perhaps it is no surprise that I agree with the minister that ‘better’ must be measured in the outcomes our students are able to achieve. Students are the key stakeholders. Everybody else is important and necessary, but the interests of students are foremost. Education systems, teachers, and government departments all exist to assist students in gaining the skills they need to thrive in a continually evolving and more demanding world. We ought not to forget that our future wellbeing is very much dependent on our children.
I have heard many contributors to the discussions refer to our high achieving students as examples of our current system working. Their reference is to those who have achieved high marks and TER scores. We will take nothing away from these high achievers. However, we also recognise as high achievers those in rural and remote areas who successfully finish Year 12 where very few previously have. We must also recognise the significant achievement made by re-engaging a young person with education where, for a variety of reasons, they have disengaged. I would like to recognise the excellent work of the Alternative Education unit in Palmerston and elsewhere: Ross Macandrew, Brendan Cabry and others rightly view as significant the agreement of a young person to return to school where, previously, that person has been adamant that there is no point.
Some of the young people at the Alternative Educational Unit have not been in school since primary school. One of the hurdles such a young person encounters on their return is that everyone else is so far ahead. The commitment and fortitude of these young people simply to keep going deserves recognition as a great achievement. In my view, those of our students who already achieve high TER scores and NTCE scores are not the ones to evaluate our system by. The quality of our system certainly affects their performances, but their self-motivation, and most likely strong family support, will almost see them achieve high marks whatever obstacles are thrown their way.
The minister has referred to interstate averages for students, and the fact that our high schools uniformly fail, with one exception, to meet that average. Our best resourced public schools averages fail to meet the state-wide average of other jurisdictions. I am informed that, if we compare these particular schools individually to like schools interstate, the comparison is even less favourable to the Territory schools. I do not call this successful. I do not accept this shows the present system working well for a majority of students. I do not accept that our young people are less clever than those interstate. Nor do I accept that our teachers are any less skilled than their counterparts interstate. That leaves the public education system. The problem must be found here. Government, therefore, must act to fix it, and this is what the government is doing.
The key stakeholders are the students, which is why I and others made representations to the minister for the process to include student forums. I thank the minister for ensuring that a student forum was part of the process. I would like to thank the independent consultant engaged by government, Socom. I particularly recognise Ms Sheila O’Sullivan for her considerable efforts. It is no easy task to keep meetings of 100 people or more on track to discuss any topic. I also thank all those parents, students and those in the teaching profession who have been involved in the meetings. I know that there have been many discussions at many levels, both formal and informal, between friends, work colleagues, student bodies and student representative councils, parents and parent councils. The whole point of this process was to generate discussion and ideas. In this respect, the process has been a resounding success.
I particularly thank the principals and chairpersons of school councils of all the Palmerston primary schools and the Palmerston High School. The Palmerston principals and chairs have been extremely proactive. Most, if not all, attended the consultation forum in Palmerston. One message that was loud and clear was that the infrastructure at Palmerston High School could not be ready to accept the approximate 350 Year 7s by 2007. The member for Drysdale and I heard this, and we immediately beat a path to the minister’s door to ensure he heard it too. It was not very long after that public meeting that the minister announced that Year 7 students would not be moving to Palmerston High School until 2008, but other components of the transition would continue to go ahead, including the building of infrastructure at Palmerston High School. This is an example where the government clearly listened.
What has been put to me, particularly from various people involved with Bakewell Primary School, the Territory’s largest primary school, is that parents are prepared to work with school staff to manage overcrowding, as long as they know that there is a solution that will ease this pressure by 2008. The principals and chairs in Palmerston wasted no time in arranging meetings with each other, and I know that they have had at least two joint meetings, resulting in a couple of submissions to the minister. I would like to thank those people who have spoken to me candidly about their views and concerns.
The Palmerston School Councils and principals support the introduction of a middle years schooling program in Palmerston in an orderly planned and adequately resourced manner. They support the staged introduction of middle schools pedagogy in existing Palmerston schools from 2007. This they have said is subject to appropriate planning, teacher professional development, curriculum and supporting structures being in place.
I am aware also that Palmerston schools have been very proactive, ensuring their teachers have been able to participate in middle years training that has already been ongoing for some time now. The Palmerston councils and principals, as I previously said, are concerned that Palmerston students are not transferred until sufficient permanent infrastructure is in place to provide appropriate teaching accommodation for all students, in all schools, in recognised school facilities. As many people are well aware, the Palmerston High School and the Department of Education have already had discussions about the extra buildings that are required at the high school, and government has committed the funding to ensure it can happen.
The school councils and principals indicated that they want to be involved in further consultation, particularly in relation to which model or models might be adopted in Palmerston. I wholeheartedly support their request. The member for Drysdale and I are already working with the minister’s office on ways we can most effectively facilitate this. I understand that a further model has been put to government from Palmerston. I believe that this could be referred to as a collegiate model. I believe that this model is used in Queensland. This would see all public education facilities in Palmerston part of one entity: a multi-campus college of excellence. I ask you, minister, and your department to look seriously at this proposal. As you are aware, there are three primary schools that have overcrowding issues in Palmerston. Literally down the road from these are three other schools which have capacity. It has been put to me that this collegiate model has the ability to address this imbalance. That would be a great result for all Palmerston’s primary schools and students.
The council chairs believe that implementing middle schooling in Palmerston requires investment to transform existing teaching and learning facilities into middle schooling facilities. Certain chairs have indicated to me - and I understand as a group have advised the minister - that this is over and above the development of additional senior secondary facilities to cater for student numbers.
Minister, you will recall the member for Drysdale and I raised with your office the need to modify existing classrooms at Palmerston High School. Certainly, given the change in pedagogy, I can also see in principle that if one of the existing primary schools were converted to a middle school this, too, would require infrastructure work. I have had many discussions about the short and medium-term shape of education in Palmerston. One thing was clear from the meeting in Palmerston: many people felt there was not a choice available to them. Palmerston High School was the only secondary option. I do note, however, that there were voices present that argued a single entity was preferable because it meant the resources available could be focused on the one institution.
It is clear from the discussions that have happened since the public meeting that there is widespread support for an initial focus on Palmerston High School as a comprehensive Year 7 to 12 school. I note that the Palmerston chairs of the school councils have put their weight behind the notion that the development of additional senior secondary facilities in Palmerston is the first step. I take then, that this means the building of infrastructure at Palmerston High School. My understanding is based on discussions I have had with several individuals involved in the various schools. In the medium-term, the aim is to have a stand-alone senior campus of Years 10 to 12, either at the existing Palmerston High School site or another site, according to the chairpersons of the schools and the submission they have put together.
The council’s chairpersons have recommended that the process should include continued consultation with teachers, parents and other stakeholders. I would add students to this list as primary stakeholders. I fully endorse the recommendation which has come from the council chairpersons. The consultation process so far has yielded so much; I see consultation with the community as a very positive thing.
During Question Time the minister held up a newspaper article and made reference to 1986. He referred to the students’ strikes of 1985 and the unrest that the change to the entire secondary school system, except Darwin High, caused. I remember that period very well; I was a Year 10 student at Dripstone High School in 1985 and was one of the ones who went on strike. There is one distinct difference between how the changes were implemented then to what is happening now: in 1985 there was no consultation. We were not told until some time during the school year in 1985 that it was all happening in 1986. However, our views were not called for; there was no community consultation then. This is one of the reasons behind my strong support for community consultation and, especially, involvement by the student body.
The Palmerston Council chairpersons recommended that the development of facilities to cater for students with special needs should be an integral part of the implementation of a middle school model, and should be included in all future planning and funding commitments. I fully agree with this recommendation. The Palmerston High School has a special needs facility as part of its existing campus, and they do an excellent job. I have previously referred members to the web site the students have put together which includes information about cane toads. A number of Palmerston’s primary schools provide education for special needs students also. The rights of special needs students are equal to every other student, and I will do what I can to ensure that their needs are part of the planning and funding considerations.
I recently attended a Palmerston Regional Business Association dinner at which representatives of the Red Cross gave a presentation. During the presentation, it was said that 14.5% of Palmerston’s population is aged five years or younger. This is an extremely high proportion of the population, and anyone walking around the shopping centres in Palmerston would not doubt the figure. The council chairpersons from Palmerston, as part of their recommendations, have put to government that it acknowledge that the introduction of middle schooling in Palmerston would only briefly alleviate the capacity issues at primary schools, and that meaningful investment in developing more primary school facilities will be required in the near future.
Discussions I have had with the department indicate that this is accepted. I know from discussions with the minister that middle schools are not seen as a panacea for capacity issues at some of the primary schools in Palmerston. I understand the Rosebery school remains on the forward planning agenda for 2008. I give my commitment to Palmerston residents that I will continue to make sure this government remains aware of the importance of building this facility. I am not saying this should be a primary school or middle school; however, there is no doubt in my mind that the facility is needed.
Finally, the council chairs have put to government that there needs to be a master plan for school facilities in Palmerston. This sounds to me like a very sensible idea and I commend this recommendation to you, minister. I would like to thank the principals and council chairs for their considerable work putting alternative models to government and making the various recommendations. Their input has been extremely valuable and welcome. I also thank them personally for their discussions with me.
Mr STIRLING (Employment, Education and Training): Madam Speaker, I thank all members for their contribution this afternoon. It has been a quite wide-ranging debate, as you would expect, on quite a major reform. I pick up on some issues put forward by the member for Brennan. Why would I not be surprised that he was one of those students on strike in 1985-86? I do not know why I am not surprised; I expect that, as a person of quite strong principles, he would have been exhibiting those principles at a quite early age. I thank him and his colleague, the member for Drysdale, for their work and continued representation to me about educational matters in Palmerston. They stay close to their schools as good local members should, and they are not shy in coming forward and telling me current views and needs, and what ought to happen in their part of the world.
In relation to Rosebery, some thought that it ought to be from Transition all the way through to Year 9 so you would have a primary school plus middle school at the top. However, it was not locked in at all because that decision has to be made in order to advance the design work and bring that all forward. I have this very strong view that that school has to be commenced, construction-wise, well before the end of this current term of government.
The member for Arnhem recently did a quite extensive trip through her electorate. I was pleased to meet with her and Senator Crossin and her staffer, John Prior. John was a principal at Yirrkala and, of course, Trish was a teacher at Yirrkala in years past. Barbara was well served on that road trip through the schools, because she had two quite high-quality former educators with her. Those enthusiastic three are people who know this area and these schools. Senator Crossin could not believe the numbers of students that are in those schools compared to previous experiences. In effecting change in the bush, we are striking the right chord and are getting those students back to school. The challenge is to continue to roll out secondary schooling, which we have been doing.
To go back to the commencement of the debate with the shadow minister on education, he talked about the system regarding the 11- to 14-year-olds needing to be more responsive. That is accepted by parents, and we agree. However, he cannot accept the need to implement this by 2007 – that it is too risky and too inappropriate. We do not share that view, and let me be very clear about that. He asked why we conducted community consultation when the decision has already been made. No decision has been made around implementation. That report from Socom is still not with me. I expect it to come to me and the department within the week, then an analysis of all that feedback, and recommendations by way of a Cabinet submission.
The attacks on the consultant, Sheila O’Sullivan, from Socom, I thought were just uncalled for. She is an excellent facilitator. In fact, he made the comment himself that she is an excellent facilitator in the community engagement process and has done a fantastic job on behalf of government.
He is trying to pretend that there are still issues around the Palmerston High School infrastructure; that we might try to force the students in ahead of the infrastructure needs. Nothing could be further from the truth. As the member for Brennan commented, I have clearly made the statement several times at press conferences and in media releases that we will ensure infrastructure was right before Year 7s move. That is not to say a whole lot of things could not happen around establishing middle schools processes; albeit the Year 7s not making it there in 2007.
I pick up on this so-called alleged abuse of students and teachers on 8HA. I have a bit of a problem with this announcer from 8HA. I understand the member for Araluen has extensive radio time on 8HA, probably up to 30 minutes at a time. Any minister from government who has ever been on that show gets about eight minutes - maybe 10 minutes at best, myself included. I was asked to phone the 8HA studio for an interview with the particular announcer, and to be introduced and then put on line to an open call in. That is fine; that is the minister’s job. However, he ought to have the manners and the courtesy to tell you that you are going to have people from the public calling in rather than just an interview with the announcer, so you are prepared. That is all right, we got into that.
The second caller, presumably, said: ‘Well, thank you very much, minister. See you later’. From a long way away, I heard a voice, and I thought, ‘That is the announcer’, and I hung up. I said: ‘Thank you very much’, and hung up. I am sure that would be on the transcript; I have not bothered to check it: ‘Thank you very much, minister. See you later’. In fact, it was the caller. That gave the announcer a great opportunity to gleefully announce that I had hung up on him, which was far from the truth. When the Office of Central Australia said: ‘What is going on? He is claiming you hung up’, I rang back. The announcer took my call, and his invitation was: ‘Oh, there has been a bit of a misunderstanding. Let us go back on air and clear this up’. So we went back on air. I explained my case. I apologised. There was a view that I hung up deliberately, when it was clear it was the caller and not the announcer who said, ‘Thank you very much, see you later’. I found out over the next three or four days they ran a promo around the program that I had hung up. He invited me back on air to clear it. I will be having issues with this young announcer when I am in Alice Springs next week, and with Radio 8HA, which is not serving its listening public very well when it carries on in a very unprofessional manner such as that, and is absolutely biased.
On the issues around the slow down from the member for Blain said: ‘Slow down Syd’. The Leader of the Opposition said: ‘This is an opportunity for community engagement. You have to show leadership by furthering engaging and further talking’. Let us go back to 15 April 2004 to the big question from Terry Mills as to whether government has the political courage to follow through with the reform that is needed. On 8 June 2004, Richard Lim said: ‘Minister has to decide on senior education’. On 26 August 2004, Dr Lim: ‘Education - community needs certainty’. On 17 December 2004, Dr Lim: ‘Minister continues to procrastinate on secondary education’. On 9 December 2004: ‘The government and this minister do not have the courage to actually implement any of the recommendations’. I save the best for last, Madam Speaker. On 8 September 2005, the member for Blain said: ‘If you are elected, you are elected to lead, which means you make decisions’. Therefore, decision making out the door today, and leadership is about slowing down, engaging in further talking.
In September last year, it was about ‘enough of the talking’. On 30 June this year, on the Daryl Manzie show, Terry Mills said: ‘They will consult to death on an issue such as the education review, leaving no stone unturned’. He said: ‘We have done that, we have done that. We said that is what we would do and we have done it’. However, in September: ‘If you are elected, you are elected to lead, and that means you make decisions’. When we get around to decision-making time, it is all a bit too much for the member for Blain, and he says: ‘No, slow down, Syd. This is an opportunity for community engagement. Show leadership by further engaging’. Forget it, there is such hypocrisy in the captured comments here, they are on the record. He forgets what he said last week. He certainly forgets what he said in September last year and January 2006. On 17 December 2004, that is a fair while ago now, Dr Lim said: ‘Minister continues to procrastinate on secondary education’. He would have us procrastinate another 18 months.
I thank the member for Wanguri for his supportive comments. It is not easy for any of us as members, including me as a local member in Nhulunbuy, around some of these issues. I thank my colleagues for their support in relation to this.
The member for Araluen commented on the opportunity to be receptive. Well, we have been receptive and the fact that you disagree with a group of students saying ‘we are not having Year 10 at Casuarina High School’ does not mean you are not listening. Of course, I am listening because I disagree with them. I respect their right to have a view. They ought to respect the right of government and the minister to have an opposing view, which I do in relation to Year 10. The member for Araluen likes to muddy it all up. She talked about middle schools, middle schooling, and a ‘middling approach’, and it was actually in a press release. A ‘middling approach’ is very close to muddling, but it suggests a do-nothing. A ‘middling approach’ is suggesting a do-nothing approach to me, and nothing else to do with it.
In relation to every student becoming a university student, I do not subscribe to that theory at all. It is about every student achieving to their individual, maximum potential. Whether that is vocational education, apprenticeship, a traineeship, or straight into work, I do not care. Whether it is to Year 12 or university, then okay. I am in the Brendan Nelson school where he is as proud, which he said so publicly - in fact, years before it happened, when he was the first minister for Education - ‘I would be as proud of one of my children becoming an apprentice as I would be if they became a doctor like myself, a lawyer, a nuclear scientist or whatever’. Guess what? One of his boys is doing an apprenticeship, and he is every bit as proud of that lad as he would be if they were studying medicine as he himself did. I am of that school. As long as there is a successful outcome in meaningful employment or still on a path to employment, I am happy.
It is not solely about Year 12. I talked about various other measures of success. It is simply not all about the TER score for university. However, the system as it stands is not allowing our students to achieve to their full potential; otherwise we have to accept our kids are not as bright as the rest of Australia. I do not accept that. I do not accept that for one bit. We have to get behind and support this push.
I was greatly encouraged by the member for Braitling’s comments. I thought it was a terrific contribution and I do not mean to be patronising. I listened very closely to what you had to say. I appreciate your support of middle schools. I probably do not understand enough about change management skills. It is a difficult area. However, I understand the need for adaptive change and whatever change management skills we can bring to the picture.
You said ‘small is better’. I hear what you are saying in relation to a school of 1000 and gang fights and the rest, but small is not better when middle schools are robbed of their very necessary resources in order to feed the senior levels and provide a broader curriculum. Then you still struggle because you have small cohorts of students.
I do not intentionally - and I have never meant to anywhere in the debate - put schools down. That is not my game, but there is a case for honesty in this debate. I have seen claims about schools with excellence. Well, schools of excellence compared to what? They are certainly not schools of excellence compared to South Australia, which we know. Language is at the bottom of the education table in Australia, so they are not schools of excellence unless you are talking in the very narrow context of the Northern Territory.
Year 10 to Centralian College and the transition of Year 10 to senior college is one of those areas that need every bit of change management skill that we can employ. I accept the critical areas of our pastoral care, duty of care responsibilities, to be a part of that change management skill. I believe the stronger duty of care and pastoral care that we will have to bring in, in both Centralian and here at Casuarina Senior College, is as the member for Karama was saying: ‘It will benefit Year 11 and Year 12 students as well’. It will benefit them.
Regarding timetabling, so they do not have two-and-a-half hours free to duck off downtown, or go and do whatever they want, that is a timetabling mechanics issue, a change management issue – it is all of those things. School management will have to be aware of those concerns, given these Year 10s are a year younger. I am very confident the Year 10s, overall, will have the maturity to respond to this, provided we have all of those concerns, as well as those expressed by the member for Braitling, addressed in response to the question of choice touched on by the Leader of the Opposition and the member for Braitling, if you were to amalgamate these two schools to one Alice Springs High School as a middle school, you wipe out choice in a sense of a government school. You have to balance that against creating a middle school of excellence which you would want everyone to aspire to.
On the question of separation and the need for various groups to be kept separate because of family feuds to extended families, I do not dismiss these concerns at all; I take them very seriously, indeed. I know there are these issues within the Alice Springs community. However, I believe from the other side; that there is an opportunity to do something very meaningful in Alice Springs. It is an opportunity to bring the community together. Alice Springs is a relatively small community and there is an opportunity to build consensus and harmonious relationships within the community. It is a bigger question, I accept, than one of simply closing one school and amalgamating it with another; it goes outside the bounds of education. It goes, in some way, to the heart and core of the community of Alice Springs. However, I guess I am putting on the table: should we shy away from an opportunity for community building because we know there are issues between families? We have a role as government to lead. I would be interested - and I think the member for Greatorex touched on Des Rogers – to seek out those type of people. I will be talking again to the member for Braitling, and very closely to my colleague, the member for Stuart, on some of these key individuals to see if I am way out of line here with this thinking, and whether something quite important could be pulled off.
If we maintain separation on these boundaries and these lines, do we in fact perpetuate that separation forever; do we prolong those differences between people rather than bringing people together? They are the issues there: a strongly resourced middle school of excellence versus that loss of choice.
There are a lot of school-age children still on the street, as the member for Braitling informed us, and that is still a concern. I pick up her issue regarding if there are spare periods in the middle of the day would that put more students on the streets. The schools have to work those timetables out so that simply does not occur.
The member for Greatorex, I think, quoted Des Rogers saying this is about cost saving. If amalgamation was to occur - and I give this unequivocal commitment straight out - not one education dollar and cent that goes into the two schools, ANZAC Hill and Alice Springs High School, would be lost. I would make sure that the new middle school, if that is the decision that is taken, would have the opportunity that any savings from amalgamation would go into intensive resourcing, particularly around maintaining those current school programs of value and those student wellbeing counsellors, wellbeing officers, and so on. Des is certainly one of those whom I will be seeking out as to whether I am out on a limb or barking up the wrong tree here in relation to these issues. I do not dismiss those issues at all. While I recognise their critical importance, I ask myself whether there is an opportunity to work through them and bring them together.
Year 10s jeopardizing senior focus was put forward by the member for Greatorex who was feeding back issues he picked up. Some comprehensive high schools - Years 8 to 12 - we know have results up there with Casuarina Senior College, so it is not an educational argument I accept. If it was the case that Year 10s did seriously distract senior studies of Years 11 and 12, would not Casuarina Senior College have the outstanding best results of any school in the Northern Territory? Of course, they would. The evidence does not support that proposition at all.
The Year 10s being leaders of the middle, a suggestion again from the member for Greatorex. To me, that is a bit like Year 7s at the top of Year 6; they look back over their primary or, at Year 10, they look back over their middle. We want to challenge and focus them looking forward. We want Year 8s to be looking forward to middle school, end of middle school - primary school behind them and Year 8 and 9 ahead. We want Year 10s, in a very serious year of first year in the senior school, picking out their course - a mix of vocational education. Year 11 stage one subjects mandated into that Year 10 course puts them on to a good rigorous road for those senior years. We want them integrated with senior years looking ahead, rather than reflective looking back from where they have come from.
‘Will the government listen to the people’ is a common refrain. We have from day one of the process. We have continued to listen. In fact, if I disagree and have a disagreement with a view being put forward somewhere along the line, I would have thought that was further evidence that I am continuing to listen. We will scour all the feedback from the latest round of consultation to ensure all of those views are considered. When you go to a community consultation engagement process such as we have had, undoubtedly many of those views are going to be contradictory. Many of those views are going to undermine some of those others that are put forward. That does not mean that government cannot make decisions, nor does it mean that government has not listened to all of those views put forward. Somewhere along the line, you have to make decisions.
The culture of Centralian College not being appropriate for Year 10 is a similar argument around Casuarina Senior College. The cultural reality of both schools has to be challenged, and they have to adopt and strengthen that pastoral care and duty of care to accommodate Year 10 students. That is a cultural shift, as I said before ...
Mr HENDERSON: A point of order, Madam Speaker!
Mr Stirling: I am sorry. I was trying to be quick.
Mr HENDERSON: I move an extension of time to allow my colleague to conclude his remarks, pursuant to Standing Order 77.
Motion agreed to.
Mr STIRLING: Thank you for your indulgence; I will move as quickly as I can.
I would expect that that cultural shift and that strengthening of pastoral duty of care for Year 10s is, obviously, going to be of benefit because you are going to have better resourcing around that for Years 11 and 12 as well. That is going to be a beneficial effect for all those students.
Member for Nelson, you cannot disagree education is one of the most important gifts in life. The review of primary schooling - my God! Let us get through this one first. He wants to take another chunk before we have finished with secondary schooling. I do not have the concerns, as minister for Education, around primary that we certainly were beginning to have around secondary. That is not to say it ought not to be looked at over time - curriculum, resourcing all of those sorts of matters ought to be reviewed from time to time. However, let us get through this one first.
We do not put Palmerston and Taminmin in the one box. We value both schools, and we are looking to strengthen each of them as we are all schools. An interesting concern - and I have picked it up in my own electorate as well – is the concern around Year 7s and whether there be school SRC - are real issues for families and kids. Some may feel that they have missed out on some things.
I was pleased to hear the member for Nelson relay the efforts some of the teachers at the Palmerston meeting said they would make to ensure that those students were able to adjust through their supportive attitudes.
Taminmin talked about Year 10s as part of senior secondary – a forward looking school and always has been. He said of Casuarina Senior College: ‘If it is not broke, do not fix it’. I am on the record enough about that: it is broke and we are going to fix it. Taminmin has five new classes, IT upgrade, library upgrade, and infrastructure report. I do not have the infrastructure report to hand on just what the full extent of needs of Taminmin High School is but, if parents do not believe the infrastructure is ready, they will not send them there - fair call. We have the same view in Palmerston and in Nhulunbuy. There are going to be issues if the infrastructure is not there and we have to get these infrastructure reports in, in relation to how far we go in implementation.
There is a similar view in Katherine, in fact: the infrastructure has to be there. If it is not ready, parents will expect a delay in that particular school or part of the system until 2008. At the end of that, of course, I still say we have to do what we can in 2007 because, as soon as we make the shift, where possible we strengthen the system as much as we can. We continue to implement the middle years approach, and where infrastructure is problematic in time, move the Year 7s in 2008.
I was interested in the letter from Cliff Fowler which seemed to argue that either system is okay and it does not matter if you have a middle schools approach or you have not, just leave it alone. That is not an option for us. He seemed to, on the one hand argue a clear break from Year 10, 11 and 12, but also that there was a need to reintroduce the Year 10 certificate, the old JSC. I am a bit of a conservative in these things. It might surprise the member for Blain but, in fact, I always thought it was a retrograde step to take away the old junior school certificate. The question is worthy of consideration, albeit not just at the moment. I have little to think on in relation to education without saying we are going to reintroduce a Year 10 certificate. Would a Year 10 certificate be appropriate in the middle schools approach as the first year of senior year? What about a Year 9 certificate? How appropriate would that be at the end of middle schooling? What would it be worth? Would it be deemed worthy of note?
They are fair dinkum suggestions put forward by Cliff Fowler through the member for Nelson and well worthy of consideration. I do not dismiss them, but I do say that I am a little busy just at the moment without taking on that argument. But certainly, the Year 10, and there may still be a role for that into the future.
With those comments, thank you, all members for your contributions. I am pleased on balance to be able to wrap up by saying there is strong support. Everyone spoke about strong support for the middle schools approach, notwithstanding there are issues. I understand there are issues. Once we get into clear air, once decisions are made, then those anxieties and concerns become real, and then you are dealing with reality rather than boxing with shadows. I look forward to the opportunity of putting it out; saying this is where government’s going to go, and then being able to deal in a realistic fashion with those deemed deficiencies, shortcomings, problems coming forward after that.
Motion agreed to; statement noted.
Mr HENDERSON (Leader of Government Business): Madam Speaker, I move that the Assembly do now adjourn.
Dr LIM (Greatorex): Madam Speaker, tonight I will speak about a very well-known personality who passed away recently. Three years ago, I spoke about his wife, Frances. Today, I want to speak about Clarry Smith, or Clarence Smith. I am making this adjournment using information sent to me by his recent widow, Jo Scheppingen, who married Clarry some 12 months ago.
Clarry was born in Mulgildie, Queensland on 20 March 1936, where his parents owned and operated a bakery. The family then moved around Queensland a little, going to a property in Wallumbilla, and then eventually moving down to Geebung, where Clarry grew up. He attended Virginia State School, and then spent a year at Boondall during the war, and did a scholarship and went to a state school. It was then that he went to the Industrial State High School, before becoming an apprentice motor mechanic with the Department of Works.
In August 1957, Clarry moved to Alice Springs with the Department of Works and, subsequently, became a plant inspector, a job which took him to many parts of the Territory. Clarry and his mate, Dave Fietz, had Land Rovers and would take people out to Kings Canyon. I will come to David Fietz’s eulogy in a little while and tell you the stories of the two men in Central Australia. It was during the time that Clarry was with David, that he met Frances and they married. I will come back to that story before long too.
After Clarry’s marriage to Frances, they lived in Burke Street, which is a few hundred metres down from where I live and currently in the electorate of Greatorex. Clarry’s history is very strongly linked with Alice Springs, with the Olive Pink Botanical Gardens and also with the public service that he served.
David Fietz put this eulogy together, and I would like to read it as best I can with the limited time that I have. David said this:
The Centralian Advocate wrote a very large article on Clarry including a photograph of him with his typical Clarry Smith smile. I seek leave to ask that the wording within the Centralian Advocate obituary on Clarry be incorporated into Hansard, but more importantly the eulogy delivered by Michael Smith, Clarry’s eldest son. I read through Michael’s eulogy. I feel I am not able to read it through because it will upset me too much. I would ask that …
Mr Acting DEPUTY SPEAKER: Are you seeking leave?
Dr LIM: I seek leave to have Michael Smith’s eulogy and the Centralian Advocate obituary on Clarry incorporated into Hansard. .
Leave granted.
Dr LIM: Thank you, Mr Acting Deputy Speaker. Having asked for the papers to be incorporated, I would like to say something from the Centralian Advocate. The headline is, ‘Generous man with a big heart’. I have known Clarence Smith for many years, all the time while he was the curator of the Olive Pink Botanic Gardens. I remember him being very enthusiastic and very keen to make sure that the Olive Pink Botanic Gardens flourish. He worked many long hours trying to get not only the plants together, but also the administration of the organisation. I remember him showing me the plants around the place and he seemed to know a lot of the place, obviously, being the curator there.
His first wife, Frances, passed away. The community, with the blessing of Clarry, sought for the Place Names Committee to name the park behind Clarry’s house at Burke Street that extends from there right through to Kurrajong Drive, the Frances Smith Memorial Park. It is a very large park that people in Kurrajong Drive frequent and enjoy. It has continued to be kept in pristine condition by volunteers, people who have known the Smith family for a long time.
After Frances passed away, a family friend, Jo Scheppingen, kept the association going and, over time, became the next Mrs Clarry Smith. They married in July of last year. Unfortunately, soon after, Clarry suffered a stroke and was later diagnosed to have a fairly aggressive tumour in his brain.
Clarry’s activities in Alice Springs included being involved in the Pistol Shooting Club and also in four-wheel drives and going out bush collecting plants around Central Australia to be then grown in the Olive Pink Botanical Gardens. After having started this work in Alice Springs in 1959, I think I said, he then retired from working for the government eventually in 1989 or thereabouts. When he retired he had the time to then fully devote his life to the flora of Central Australia through his connection with Olive Pink Botanic Gardens. As Dave Fietz said, he was one of the very few people that got on with Miss Pink. I never had the chance to meet Miss Pink, of course. From all the stories I hear, she must have been a fairly severe, intensive, cantankerous old lady. Why, I do not know. Apart from that, she appeared to be a very lovely lady who embraced the environment, the Central Australian aspects of life there. It is amazing that a woman like that could, on the one hand, be such a great leader in the ecology and environment of Alice Springs and, yet, on the other hand, be such a scary person to many kids and senior public servants.
For Clarry, who devoted his remaining years to the Olive Pink Botanic Gardens; he did a fantastic job and will be forever gratefully appreciated by all those people who have known him in Alice Springs, and be sadly missed. I extend my condolences to his family, particularly to Jo Scheppingen, whom I have known for many years.
Mr WOOD (Nelson): Mr Acting Deputy Speaker, I want to talk about a visit to the Darwin prison which I took part in two weeks ago. No, I did not stay in there, member for Daly. With permission from the minister and, with two of his staff, I visited the prison. I wanted to learn about how a prison operated and physically see what the prison looked like. I had visited Wildman River and Alice Springs prison previously and, I must admit, I was a bit remiss in not following that up sooner with a trip to the Darwin prison.
When I was there, the Darwin prison had 405 prisoners, made up of 383 males and 22 females, including 84 on remand. About 80% of those people are indigenous and about 40% of the prisoners have some form of employment.
My initial thoughts when I arrived at the prison on a rainy day was that it was old and dingy. You might ask: so what, it is a prison? However, it is a prison that, to some extent, needs some upgrading. It was built in 1979 and there are certain parts which need to be looked at, and either upgraded, or demolished and rebuilt.
These comments I make are, by no means, fulsome comments. I would like to follow up some of these issues when I have more time. Perhaps I can raise some of these issues as a motion in parliament on General Business Day.
When I entered the prison, I entered the reception area and was met by a number of prison officers who had some viewpoints they wished to put forward, and which I was quite happy to listen to. It was explained to me - and it is fairly obvious when you look at it - that the reception area is far too small and too old. It certainly does not allow any privacy and it is an area which needs an upgrade. It reflects the time it was built and things have to be looked at in that area.
I went over to the remand area. It is strange that, when looking at the prison review that the government presented recently, it said in relation to remand:
From what I was told, you could not get a more urgent need than building a new remand centre. There are 84 people in remand in a relatively small area, who can be there from one day to two years. They do not have contact with the other prisoners and they do not have access to education facilities, or at least not like the other prisoners do. It seemed to me that it really is a facility that urgently needs to be built with educational facilities attached so that these people who have not yet been found guilty or not guilty of the crime that they are on remand for, actually can have something to do.
We then visited the medical area. That area is where every prisoner who comes in is seen in the first 24 hours. They are checked for heart problems and diabetes and all sorts of ailments that you might expect people to have. They have an annual check up, a dentist visits once a week, an optician, a physio once a week, they can get chest check ups, a nutritionist pops in, mental health every Friday, and a podiatrist once a week. They certainly keep an eye on the medical health of prisoners.
We were taken over to the officers’ recreation room. If you are looking after the welfare of the people you employ to look after our prisoners, then you have to give them facilities which are worthy of that support, and their recreation room, to be honest, was just a smelly dump. The furniture looked like it had been there since 1979, it had a terrible odour and certainly was not the place, if you were a prison officer, in which you would enjoy sitting to have your lunch. It certainly needs a total refit, to be made far more homely and a place where prison officers can enjoy their lunch and have a break from their work.
We also visited the education facilities. We were given a fairly good understanding of the funding that is used to run the education program, and there are some issues that need to be looked at there. There appears to be only one full-time staff and the rest are on contract, which seems to be a problem, because people do not know how long they will be working there. There certainly was a problem with the amount of room that is available; rooms were too small. Those rooms were also used for interviews and for programs. There is very little room to store books. The area, overall, is fairly limiting, because it actually used to be a hall at one stage. One would think that, if education is one of those priorities in a prison, especially when you have 80% indigenous people, that the government should be looking at a purpose-built education facility at Darwin prison. There are some different points of view on where the education program should head; whether they should be promoting the attainment of certificates, or just concentrating on the basics and trying to enable people to have some basic numeracy and literacy skills. Again, it is an area which I believe needs to be looked at more closely.
I then walked to the classifications area. This is the area where prisoners are classified into whether they are maximum, medium, minimum or low security, and I found the staff in that area very friendly. It surprised me that any prisoner can knock on the door and walk into that office, have a discussion with the staff there and talk about various issues that concern them. The classification people, I suppose, are very important from the prisoners’ point of view because, if you can get down to minimum security, or open security, you have a chance of working outside, which a lot of them would like to do instead of being stuck around in a prison.
I visited the kitchen. It is certainly a very big kitchen. Quite a few of the prisoners work there. I would say they enjoy working there because, on occasions, there are some perks in working in a kitchen because, if there is a bit of food left over, I imagine that is one of the good perks about it. From what I saw, they enjoy that kind of work. It is quite a modern kitchen. I was of the understanding that it had been upgraded to some extent since the prison first opened.
We visited the dormitories. I hope my figures are right here, but there were about 10 prisoners in each dormitory, and about 70 prisoners in each block. Those blocks have recreation areas, and prisoners are allowed out between about 8 am and 3 pm. It is low security. Because of the weather - it was pouring rain most the time we were there - we did not look at every block that was there. However, low security people do get out between 8 am and have the advantage of going to bed or going back in their cells a bit later, I think about 11 pm. We had a look at the single cells; they are quite small. We had a concern about some of them having overhead fans and, of course, there has been concern about deaths in custody. However, we found out that if someone tries to attach anything to the fans, they just fall straight off the ceiling. They have been designed so that nothing can be attached to them with any weight. That was interesting to see as well.
There had been a concern that some of the cells did not have fans at all, so on very hot nights it was a fairly difficult place to sleep. They had force-fed air through those cells and, as one of the prison officers said to me, if there was problem with mosquitoes, prisoners can buy mosquito coils from the shop in the prison.
I visited the women’s section and that is one area that certainly needs to be looked at closely. Women prisoners are in the Darwin prison from all parts of the Territory. All classifications get together: that is the maximum, minimum, medium and remand. That is not what happens in the male section of the prison but, for some reason, it is allowed in the female section. The building that the female prisoners are housed in was actually designed as a pre-release facility and not as a gaol. They only get about one class of education a week because they cannot go over to the education buildings that are in the male section. To do that, they have to close their little recreation area down because there are no proper facilities for education. There is very little protection from the weather. Again, it is because the building itself or the main part of the building was not designed for what it is being used for today.
It was a very strange feeling when some of the women prisoners asked the prison officer in charge if they could speak to me. It was an interesting meeting. I had never done anything like that before. These women, obviously, had some issues they wished to raise and they were allowed to do so; and they could say what they liked about their conditions. They had a number of issues. To give you an example, unfortunately, those prisoners who are minimum security are not allowed out in the work gangs. One of the problems is that they are not allowed out with a male driver any more and there is no female driver to take these work gangs out. It is a rule that has just been changed recently. There are women there who should be entitled to go out in the work gangs who cannot go. That is something that needs to be addressed because again, you do not want people bored. You want people to be able to get out and do some work if they are of the category that allows that.
They were concerned there was no policy for women in prison. They were concerned about no incentives to behaving yourself, like automatic remissions. They were concerned about the need for a halfway house; they believe there needed to be a lot more support after leaving prison. They are some of the concerns they had. They also mentioned they never seemed to see anyone from the Department of Justice visiting the place. One of the prison officers told me that they really wonder whether they know of the conditions in Darwin prison.
They are just my broad feelings from my visit there. I was there for four hours and I realise that is not really long enough to get a handle on many of the difficult issues that we have with our prisons. You do not want bored prisoners in gaol. That is the last thing you want. How do you overcome that? You make sure the prison has good education facilities. As I said, many of the people in prison are indigenous. If you can educate them with basic literacy and numeracy, you are helping them be able to fill in forms for themselves and to read books, newspapers and, when they go back to their local communities, they have some basic skills.
There are work gangs that go out from the prison. However, there is not enough work there for everybody. You can work in the kitchen or laundry, but the industries do not appear to be working. There is a small garden, which I could not look at because of the rain.
I have thought about it for a while. One of the concerns when prisons start to do things is that the private industry says: ‘Oh well, you cannot compete with us’. That has happened in Alice Springs where there was a truss factory in the Alice Springs gaol and a company that built trusses in Alice Springs said they could not do that, and they closed it down. There might be an opportunity for private companies to work within the prison. I will be putting forward some of these ideas later. Perhaps government can provide secure areas within the prison, a shed, and they can get companies to do some of their work within that area. A tyre changing company is nearby; perhaps that company could set up a smaller version of what it is doing elsewhere employing prisoners, paying them the full wage, half of which goes to their board and lodging and the other half into a trust account for them when the leave.
There are lots of opportunities for perhaps more sporting facilities and opportunities. Maybe outside football teams could come and play teams at the prison.
Mr Acting Deputy Speaker, I want to talk more on these issues at another time. They are just my initial thoughts on my visit to the prison and I thank all those people who helped me with the visitation.
Mr KNIGHT (Daly): Mr Acting Deputy Speaker, I speak about a fine lady who passed away last week, who spent a lot of her time in my electorate; Mayse Young. She died at age 92 in her home at Pine Creek with her family, for whom it was a very sad time, and for the community and those who knew her.
Mayse was born in Queensland in 1913. This young woman, at 14 years old, arrived in the Northern Territory from Mt Isa with her family and spent years travelling around with her family establishing various businesses throughout her life. A lot has been written about Mayse, and there was an article yesterday in the Northern Territory News by Peter and Sheila Forrest. They summed up most of her life, where she worked and what she did. I will not go over that ground again; I want to talk a bit more about the person and reflections that her family have passed on to me about her.
In her last few days, she did not see her life as a struggle, although it has been reported that way. She saw it as life; it was normal, exciting sometimes, but she saw it as part of things that just happened and got on with her business. She accepted that for her children as well as they grew up in the Northern Territory and, sometimes, in South Australia. They just accepted that the hardships they faced were normal and they did not get upset about them but got on with business.
She was very much a person who loved to have a little joke and spending time with her family. She had seven children and there are a great many grandchildren and great-grandchildren. She enjoyed that big family and was very proud of it. She, obviously, lived by a code and certainly instilled that into her children. Even right to the end she was talking about her children, grandchildren and what they were doing and how they had been a success in their lives.
She returned to Pine Creek after spending time backwards and forwards from Adelaide. She had enough of Adelaide. She had been looking over the ocean and wanted to come back to Pine Creek for the last time and spend the last stage of her life in Pine Creek, around her children and the place where she spent a great deal of her time.
There are a great many stories about here life, and these stories keep are told to her family, since her death, by people the children did not even know. The stories sum up the type of person that Mayse was.
An Aboriginal man from Katherine who would be in his 50s now remembers being brought in from Manbulloo Station as a child. Mayse was running the Katherine Hotel at that time and, for some reason, they were forced to eat rhubarb. The kids objected quite a lot to that. So Mayse mixed in red jelly to encourage the kids to eat rhubarb. This person reflected on that 30 or 40 years after it happened. The memories of Mayse, at that time, were warm.
There are other stories of her in Darwin in her younger years. At that time, she was a keen golfer and got around the town in an old Chevy belonging to a friend of hers. Apparently, there was a few of these Chevies in Darwin at that time and one of them belonged to a minister of the Legislative Council, I believe. They were not very good drivers, apparently, but the police were reluctant to pull up this car because they were not too sure whether it was the minister’s wife driving the car or not. They had a great time.
Mayse was also a keen horse rider and had quite an affinity with the bush. When she came here in the early years - and I will quote from the newspaper; it sums up her feeling for the bush. It says:
That sums up how she felt - not of the hardship of the Northern Territory bush, but for the love of it.
Some other stories about Mayse are of her generosity and the way she made people feel. In the early days of Katherine when the Tindal Base was being developed, the workers used to come to Pine Creek, a distance of 90 km, to help her out in the Pine Creek Hotel and play music to the early hours. That is certainly something that they remember.
There is another example of her generosity. Whilst running the Pine Creek Hotel, station hands would come in and hand over their pay cheque to Mayse to allow her to hold it and run it out. One of these guys had been staying there for almost two weeks. He was complaining that she kept on saying he had money left because she never took out board, she would always make sure he was fed, and she would only take out for any drinks that he may have had. She had a huge generosity and it was remembered. That is the key thing with Mayse, and something that, obviously, her children, grandchildren and great-grandchildren have in them.
I pay my respects to Mayse tonight. I do not think that I can do her justice. I met her several times but do not feel that I truly knew her. I know her children and they are fine people. That is a credit to Mayse. Her service will be on Thursday and I will be going to pay my respects to her and honour her memory, and pay my respects to her family.
Motion agreed to; the Assembly adjourned.
MESSAGE FROM ADMINISTRATOR
Message No 8
Message No 8
Madam SPEAKER: Honourable members, I have received from His Honour the Administrator Message No 8 notifying assent to bills passed in the February 2006 sittings of the Assembly.
COMMONWEALTH DAY MESSAGE
Madam SPEAKER: Honourable members, I have received a Commonwealth Day Message 2006 from Her Majesty the Queen, dated 13 March 2006
Health and Vitality
The Commonwealth Challenge
A message from Her Majesty The Queen
Head of the Commonwealth
The Commonwealth Challenge
A message from Her Majesty The Queen
Head of the Commonwealth
- There a few feelings more satisfying than waking to a new day with a sense of wellbeing. Good health is a precious gift.
Yet many do not share in this. Some forty million people today are living with HIV/AIDS, well over half of whom are Commonwealth citizens. Half a million women die each year in pregnancy and childbirth – and the death of any mother has huge consequences for the rest of the family. Yet very many of these deaths are preventable with adequate healthcare. Ignorance and lack of understanding about these issues sometimes breed uncertainty, even fear and the inclination to turn from those who are unwell. But we know, for example, that someone who is HIV positive can, with proper support, lead a full and rewarding life.
I am pleased that Commonwealth governments are playing their part in tackling disease and improving health for all. Polio, for example, used to cast its shadow across many countries. Today, thanks to concerted international action, just a handful still need to eliminate polio. The same approach and commitment to other global scourges, such as malaria and tuberculosis, can achieve equally impressive results.
There is also much we can do through non-governmental organisations and especially as individuals. Poor health is sometimes linked to the way we choose to live. But many of us can often take steps to eat better food or take more exercise. We can also as communities work to improve our surroundings to make them cleaner, safer places in which to live.
The importance of good health is so wonderfully exemplified on the sports field. Sporting events can be the spur to extraordinary human achievement. Sport also demonstrates the value of co-operation and team-work, and the importance of mental and physical control. In Melbourne, in just a few days’ time, I will be opening what are known as ‘The Friendly Games’. Commonwealth athletes will gather once more in a spirit of goodwill and fellowship, and will strive to achieve new heights of excellence. As we watch our finest sportsmen and women compete, we will see clearly what exercise at the very highest level can contribute to both body and spirit.
There is a traditional proverb which says, ‘He who has health has hope, and he who has hope has everything.’ This year, as governments search for new ways to tackle these important challenges, we as individuals can also play our part so that, in pursuing health and vitality for all, we bring hope to the world.
Elizabeth R.
GENERAL BUSINESS DAY
Mr HENDERSON (Leader of Government Business): Madam Speaker, on behalf of the Chief Minister, I nominate Thursday, 30 March 2006, as the next day on which precedence will be given to General Business pursuant to Standing Order 93.
Motion agreed to.
LEAVE OF ABSENCE
Member for Millner
Member for Millner
Mr HENDERSON (Leader of Government Business): Madam Speaker, I move that leave of absence be granted to the member for Millner, Mr Bonson, for the remainder of this sittings week, and advise the House that Matthew has become a father overnight. I am sure all members would join with me in wishing Matthew and Mona - and I am not sure of the name of the new baby boy - all our best and congratulations.
Motion agreed to.
ADMINISTRATIVE ARRANGEMENTS
Government Whip
Government Whip
Mr HENDERSON (Leader of Government Business): Madam Speaker, I advise that the member for Daly will be performing the duties of the Whip for this sitting week.
LEAVE OF ABSENCE
Member for Katherine
Member for Katherine
Ms CARNEY (Opposition Leader): Madam Speaker, I move that leave of absence be granted to the member for Katherine, Mrs Miller, for these sittings due to ill health arising from a motor vehicle accident earlier this month.
Motion agreed to.
OPPOSITION OFFICE HOLDERS
Ms CARNEY (Opposition Leader)(by leave): Madam Speaker, I advise members of a change in office holders and additional shadow ministerial responsibility of opposition members. The new arrangements, which were put into effect on 15 March 2006, are as follows:
- • Jodeen Carney, Leader of the Opposition. Additional shadow portfolios are: Tourism; Mines and Energy; and Natural Resources, Environment and Heritage.
• Terry Mills, Deputy Leader of the Opposition. Additional shadow portfolios are: Primary Industry and Fisheries; and Regional Development.
• Richard Lim, Opposition Whip. Additional shadow portfolios are: Transport and Infrastructure; and Senior Territorians.
STATEMENT
Member for Katherine’s
Medical Condition - Update
Member for Katherine’s
Medical Condition - Update
Madam SPEAKER: Honourable members, I have given the Leader of the Opposition leave to speak.
Ms CARNEY (Opposition Leader)(by leave): Madam Speaker, I provide an update to the House on Mrs Miller’s condition.
Mrs Miller underwent surgery a week or so ago. I am happy to say that she has now left the Spinal Injuries Unit at the Royal Adelaide Hospital. She is being cared for by family in Adelaide, and is receiving daily care from health professionals.
It is expected that her recovery and further treatment will take many weeks. However, she has already shown herself to be extremely determined having surprised doctors so far with her progress. She needs to remain in Adelaide for some time. This is, in part, a cautionary measure in case of unforeseen complications. In any event, it is not possible for her to travel at this stage.
The member for Katherine, has been - as we have - overwhelmed by the level of support and best wishes from Territorians. I am sure that his has aided her recovery to date. She would like me to express her thanks to all Territorians, on both sides of politics, who have provided their support and best wishes, in addition to the emergency services personnel who helped her at the scene of the accident, as well as the staff at the Alice Springs Hospital.
Together with Mrs Miller, I take this opportunity to thank members of the Assembly for their concern. We were very grateful for some early assistance provided by a couple of members in particular.
Madam Speaker, I thank you, the Clerk, and the staff for your assistance as well. It has been greatly appreciated by Mrs Miller and her family, as well as her colleagues. I am sure members will join with me in saying that we all look forward to Mrs Miller getting back to work. I thank you for the opportunity to update the House.
VISITORS
Madam SPEAKER: Honourable members, I draw your attention to the presence in the Speaker’s Gallery of Mr Les Penhall and Mrs Helen Lines, friends of the late Mr Reg Harris AM. On behalf of honourable members, I extend you a very warm welcome.
Members: Hear, hear!
CONDOLENCE MOTION
Mr Reg Harris AM
Mr Reg Harris AM
Madam SPEAKER: Honourable members, it is with deep regret that I advise the House of the death on 21 February 2006 of Mr Reg Harris AM, a prominent member of the Alice Springs community.
I ask honourable members, on completion of debate, to stand in silence for one minute as a mark of respect.
Ms MARTIN (Chief Minister)(by leave): Madam Speaker, I move that this Assembly express its deep regret at the death of Mr Reg Harris AM, a prominent member of the Alice Springs community, and place on record the Assembly’s appreciation of his long and meritorious service to the people of the Northern Territory, and tender its profound sympathy to his family.
The first thing that immediately strikes you about the life of Reg Harris is how he managed to achieve so much over such a long period of time for his community. It is true to say that Alice Springs would not be the place it is today without him.
Reg was born in South Australia in 1924, and came to Alice Springs in 1947, on the day the Centralian Advocate was published for the first time. He was sent to the town to do the electrical installation at the new Hotel Alice Springs and, in another great bit of Territory trivia, was responsible for installing our very first lift at the hotel.
Reg loved Alice Springs and decided to make the town his home. He started his own electrical engineering business in 1948, and married Marge Hobbs the following year - a partnership that would last a lifetime.
It did not take Reg long to make his mark and gain the respect of the Alice Springs community. By 1955, Reg had introduced the first evaporative airconditioners to Alice Springs, meaning families could now cool their entire homes rather than just a single room. He was to make his mark in many other ways over the next half a century.
Both Reg and Marge were very passionate about sport. They introduced basketball to Alice Springs and built courts at their own expense. They were the coaches and, more often than not, the referees. Marge also brought hockey to the town, and Reg was a talented footballer who captained Alice Springs in what many believe to be the Territory’s first interstate match. He was also very involved in cycling and was President of the Alice Springs Amateur Cycling Club. Their involvement in the sporting arena was, in essence, an act of community building which had a big impact on the town. As Reg said:
- There was not a lot for young people to do in Alice Springs in the 1940s and 1950s. We joined with other people to do something about it.
The Minister for Sport and Recreation - and other speakers today – will no doubt talk more about the contribution Reg and Marge made to sport in the Northern Territory.
However, sport was not Reg’s only passion - far from it. He also wanted to do something about getting a commercial radio station up and running in Alice Springs. Reg was relentless, and it was largely due to his perseverance and passion, and that of Ren Kelly, that 8HA was established in 1971. Of course, it is still going strong today and the family link is still there - Reg’s son, Roger, is now the manager of the station.
Reg was also an astute businessman who could see the big role tourism would play in Alice Springs’ future. He built the Midland Motel in the mid-1960s, and was chairman of the Alice Springs Tourist Promotion Association for 12 years. His expertise was widely sought. He chaired the NT Tourist Board for five years, was a member of the NT Reserves Board and the NT Conservation Commission, and was a life member of the Central Australian Tourism Association.
In 1970, he published This Fortnight in Alice to promote the town. It went through a number of name changes, eventually becoming Welcome to Central Australia. His work in the tourism sector was rightly acknowledged in 1991 when he won the major Brolga Award for Excellence.
Many Territorians, especially those who lived in the Top End in 1975, will remember Reg for his incredible work in responding to the Cyclone Tracy disaster. He chaired the Alice Springs Combined Services Club Tracy Appeal Committee, and stunned many by raising $153 000 in less than a week. By the way, it should be remembered that the population of Alice in those days was only around 14 000.
Reg Harris made a real difference to his community and the people around him. His achievements are widely recognised - the Queen’s Silver Jubilee Medal and his Member of the Order of Australia, bear testament to that.
Reg is also one of the 200 remarkable Territorians honoured in Bicentenary Park in Darwin, and the word ‘remarkable’ really does sum up his life.
Our profound sympathies go to Reg’s wife, Marge, and their two sons, Roger and Scott. I wish them all the very best for the future. This Territory will certainly always remember Reg Harris.
Ms CARNEY (Opposition Leader): Madam Speaker, I join with the Chief Minister and all members of the Assembly in this condolence motion. I thank the government for moving this condolence motion. It is very important that someone like Reg Harris, who has made such an outstanding and significant contribution to the Northern Territory, and Alice Springs in particular, be acknowledged in such a formal and solemn way. It is true to say that Reg Harris was one of the founding fathers of Alice Springs, and it is fitting that tribute is paid to him.
Sadly, Reg passed away on 21 February, aged 81 years, in Adelaide when he accidentally fell outside his home on the way to a routine check-up at the hospital. Reg is survived by his wife, Marge, sons, Roger and Scott, along with seven grandchildren and two great-grandchildren.
Reg’s son, in an article in the Centralian Advocate, described his father as:
- A straight talking man with a tough exterior that covered a soft nature. He was a very honest and genuine person. He had a rough exterior and a soft interior. He loved telling stories about the history and characters of the town, but his biggest legacy was that he loved the place and always had confidence in it.
I, together with the Chief Minister, would like to touch on just a little of the life of Reg Harris.
He was born in South Australia’s Riverland in 1924 and Reg is said to have not started life with any advantages. His father was a market gardener and river fisherman. At school he was part of the single class of 45 students spread over seven grades. When he reached Grade 7, the teacher got him to teach the lower grades in the morning, then teach himself in the afternoon. That was not a problem for Reg Harris. In a competitive exam at the end of Grade 7, Reg came near the top of the state and won a coveted scholarship which would have paid secondary school fees. However, there was no secondary school near Reg’s home and he would have had to go to boarding school in Adelaide, which was out of the question in 1936. So he went back to school to repeat Grade 7 until he reached minimum school leaving age of 13 in 1937.
Reg then commenced working for his father, gardening and fishing. Other jobs Reg did in the district led him to electrical work, which then saw him approach one of the biggest electrical contractors in Adelaide who gave him an apprenticeship. It was from his ability to take charge of large jobs, even while still an apprentice, that his employers then sent him to Alice Springs and into an enduring place in the history of the Northern Territory.
Reg first came to Alice Springs in 1947 to install the first lift in the Territory at the Alice Springs Hotel. He fitted in straightaway. In week two of his job, it turned into a 60-year love affair with the Alice Springs town and community which, of course, at that stage was very small. He was a man who took to Alice Springs very quickly and, over a long period of time, his legacy is recorded and will be recorded, I am sure, by not only the people in Alice Springs but around the Territory. However, I will come to more of that later.
Reg Harris not only liked Alice Springs and saw its huge potential, but he also fell in love with Marge Hobbs who had arrived in Alice Springs in July 1947. Marge and Reg married in November 1949.
During Reg’s long and fruitful life, he worked in a variety of industries. He owned sheet metal, gas, retail and tourism firms throughout his years in Alice Springs. Reg selflessly gave his time to many community organisations and boards, some of which were touched upon by the Chief Minister.
In 1965, he was elected to the Alice Springs Town Council Management Board, a precursor to the town council. In 1970, he began publication of the booklet This Fortnight in Alice. Our annual and popular Henley-on-Todd Regatta is another Alice story which owes much of its success to Reg Harris. With a group of local businessmen, he established the town’s first radio station, 8HA, in 1971. The station is now managed by Reg’s son, Roger, proudly one of the few remaining locally-owned radio stations in Australia. Reg was part-owner of the Ayers Rock Hotel and chairman of the NT Tourist Board from 1974, until the board was replaced by the Tourist Commission in 1979.
The Harris contribution to Territory sport is immense. Marge introduced women’s basketball, netball and hockey to the Centre, while Reg played in the first peacetime Aussie Rules match. He also captained an Alice Springs team in what is widely regarded as the Territory’s first interstate match. Reg and Marge did not just play sport: they built courts and ovals and they put in the hard yards to create and administer sporting organisations.
Reg will, undoubtedly, always be remembered for heading the town’s relief effort to assist Darwin after the devastation of Cyclone Tracy in 1974. Reg was appointed chairman of the Alice Springs Combined Services Club appeal and relief effort. Alice Springs people donated more than $150 000 in a few days and sent tonnes of desperately needed materials to Darwin.
Reg Harris was a man who was very passionate about Alice Springs. Even some years ago when the possibility of merging South Australia and the Northern Territory as a super state was broadly discussed, it quickly brought comments from Reg to say that he was happy for the Territory to remain independent. He was quoted in the Centralian Advocate as saying:
- It is hard enough for us being run from Darwin, let alone from Adelaide. The idea came out of World War II to make Elliott the capital of the Territory and it did not work then.
Reg Harris was a renowned historian. He supplied many historical details and photographs of early Alice Springs. Many of these photographs are still proudly displayed today around the town.
In addition, somewhat gratuitously, towards the end of last year, radio announcer Matt Conlan at 8HA in Alice Springs invited Reg Harris, who did not spend much time around 8HA in his later years, into the studio. As a result, we have for the benefit of everyone in future years an oral history provided by Reg Harris which was recorded at 8HA. Of course, no one knew then the significance of what Reg Harris had to say, but I am delighted as a person who lives in and feels very passionately about Alice Springs that we now have that history recorded forever and a day by his radio station 8HA in Alice Springs.
Reg Harris was remembered fondly by other well-known Territory historians, in particular Peter and Sheila Forrest. Shortly after Reg’s death, Peter told the Centralian Advocate:
- Reg arrived in Alice Springs in May 1947 and from then until last week not much happened in the Alice that Reg did not have a hand in.
He went on to say:
- Darwin has much to thank him for too. He often said that Darwin was just a parasite on the productive part of the Territory but when the capital desperately needed help, Reg was the best friend in need. The man who loved to present a crusty exterior proved that he had a big heart made of solid gold.
Those of us who live in Alice Springs understand the sentiments expressed by Mr Forrest.
A reunion of the old and new Alice Springs community occurred at the funeral of Reg Harris and I was very honoured to have been there. Many people turned up from all around the Centre and, indeed beyond, to pay their respects to Reg at a service in the Flynn Church and the wake thereafter at the Federal Sports Club. Many well-known Territorians attended and swapped their tales about their old mate.
Reg’s legacy will live on and there are all sorts of reasons why. One, in particular, is the fact that Reg Harris Lane exists in Alice Springs and is very well-known. Most of us walk through Reg Harris Lane a couple of times a week. He will surely be remembered by future generations when kids or teenagers walk up Reg Harris Lane. We would like to think that they will ask who Reg Harris was. Thanks to the recording of this condolence motion, the recording by historians, and the recording at 8HA, those people will be able to find out who Reg Harris was. As a person from Alice Springs, I will certainly commend to young people, in particular, that they find out who Reg Harris was.
As I said at the outset, it is fitting that we pay tribute to Reg Harris in this way. He struck me as the sort of person who would have made a great politician. I suppose in a local community he was a politician; he went in to bat for people. He was very passionate about the community in which he lived and its future. We politicians regard ourselves as having those attributes or, at least if we do not have them, we should strive for them. Reg Harris, in my view, would have done well to have been a member of this Assembly. However, the Territory is no poorer for him not having been a member of the Assembly because his contribution is enormously significant and felt by old and new people of Alice Springs. I still count myself among the new people of Alice Springs but, when the older people in Alice Springs turn up to honour a man like this, you know that he was, indeed, a great man to be remembered for ever and ever.
With those comments, Madam Speaker, I will conclude. I take this opportunity to place on the Parliamentary Record that my thoughts and those of my colleagues and my party are with Marge, Roger and Scott and their families.
Dr TOYNE (Central Australia): Madam Speaker, Reg Harris was a good builder and a good talker as well. He was a passionate advocate for his community and the interests of the people around him. He was involved in building many of the physical assets in Alice Springs such as the Anzac Oval where we had the great NRL match just recently. Reg had a big role in constructing many of the buildings that were in use that day. Traeger Park and the Anzac Hill Youth Centre are all parts of his legacy of building in the town. Of course, Reg Harris Lane is the area that the Leader of the Opposition is referring to.
With his wife, Marge, he was involved in building many aspects of the social fabric of Alice Springs from the early days. Without people like Reg and Marge, who gave so freely of their time and energy, Alice Springs would not be the town it is today.
I would like to make a pledge to Reg: there are a couple of legacies I will certainly honour. One is being very vigilant about the Berrimah Line. In many conversations I had with Reg, his opinions of decision makers north, south, east or west - his Berrimah Line seemed to go a lot further than most people’s – was that they were, basically, impaired by being congenitally idiotic.
Reg had a very strong sense of where he belonged in the community, and the need for that community to be self-reliant. That is something we have always prided ourselves on in Central Australia: that we are self-reliant, we innovate and find our own solutions to things. I would hate to see that ever threatened by a too dependent attitude about not being able to do anything, and other people have to help us with this, that and everything else. Alice Springs has never been like that and should never turn that way. Reg is part of the pioneering tradition that built that self-reliance and absolute independent spirit that many people still display in the town and the region.
Reg was also involved in a huge number of sporting organisations throughout town. You could see him anywhere on a busy weekend. When you add to that all the community organisations he was involved in, I do not know when he used to sleep, perhaps they had meetings at 2 am to fit them all in!
Reg was a member of the Rotary Club of Alice Springs for more than 21 years and served as club president. He was also one of those responsible for the formation of the Rotary Club of Stuart formed in Alice Springs in 1970. He was a Rotary Paul Harris Fellow, and gave his time to the Churchill Fellowship as a member of the selection committee. He was also a member of the NT Town Planning Board and the Alice Springs Town Management Board. Reg’s many achievements and voluntary work were deservedly recognised later in his career. He received the Queen’s Silver Jubilee Medal in 1977 and became a Member of the Order of Australia in 1982. It is a very impressive list of achievements.
However, it does not give the real picture of the type of bloke Reg was. He was the type of man who really valued mateship and the qualities I was talking about earlier. Reg was a doer; he epitomized the spirit of just getting on with it and getting things done - stop whingeing about what is wrong with the world; get out, get it done and help your community, and stand back and admire what you have achieved. That is something I will always remember of the spirit of he and other people such as Bernie Kilgariff, another one who springs to mind of that same ilk, and Andy McNeill. They are people who really set the spirit of self-reliance in Alice Springs.
It is fair to say that in a phone call - or indeed any conversation - with Reg Harris, you had to allow a fairly extended time if you were going to do it at all. During the height of a particular flap going on about the quality of services in the Alice Springs Hospital a couple of years ago, I was sitting in my office saying: ‘We have all these issues to deal with’. The phone rang and it was Reg on the other end. He said: ‘How many doctors do you have in the Alice Springs Hospital?’ I said: ‘Just a bit over 100’. He said: ‘What are they all doing? When we had 2000 people in Alice Springs there were two doctors; that is one doctor for every 1000 people. On my figures, if there are 100 in the hospital that means that there is about one doctor to 250 people here. What are they all doing? There are four times as many doctors as we used to have and we all survived. So what is the story here?’ I tried to explain to him about medical specialities and modern medicine, but he was not going to have a bar of that. He decided that the doctors should all go out, treat their 250 people each and get the job done. That was Reg’s contribution. I was very pleased to get that phone call. It put the world back into perspective a bit.
Reg was a doer and right to the day he died he never sat back and left something undone. He was not a man who lived in the past. He had a keen interest in the future, especially the future of his beloved Alice Springs. I just hope that we can all march to the tune that Reg, and others like him, set for Central Australia, and not let that go for any circumstances - we have to do our own things down there. We have to find our own solutions and innovate, so when that happens in the future, that is one for Reg.
Ms LAWRIE (Sport and Recreation): Madam Speaker, this morning I offer my condolences to the family and friends of Reg Harris. As we have heard from contributions this morning, Reg Harris was a magnificent contributor to the growth and development of sport in Alice Springs. He absolutely loved his sport and was a driving force behind much of the development of sporting infrastructure in Alice Springs. He was truly passionate about his sport. In his younger days, he loved to play a variety of sports and, in later years, he was closely involved in the administration of sports.
He and his wife, Marge, were a dynamic team when it came to sports such as basketball. As the Chief Minister pointed out, the Harris’s were responsible for introducing basketball to Alice Springs in 1948. Apparently, there was a sporting gap during the summer months so Reg and Marge thought that there was a chance to shoot a few hoops. They paid for the building of the first courts. Reg was the coach of the men’s teams while Marge coached the women’s. Their roles were reversed during games when Reg umpired the women’s games and Marge blew the whistle for the men. I am told they often joked about the other being too tough in their umpiring decisions.
Aussie Rules was another of Reg’s sporting passions, and he played in the first organised game in Alice Springs in 1947. He was captain/coach of the Federals Football Club for 10 years. He coached Pioneers. He was captain/coach of the first Alice representative team and he was a life member of the Federal Sports Club. Apparently, he was pretty well known as a forequarter ruckman who never gave up and was a fierce competitor on the field. He was recognised as a major contributor to Federals Football Club winning six premierships in the 1950s. His other footy achievements include being the first player to be made a Central Australian Football League life member. He chaired the CAFL tribunal for three years and was also patron of the league.
In the 1940s and 1950s, footy was played on Anzac Oval and Reg was appointed to the Anzac Sports Oval Board of Trustees. Under his and the other trustees’ management, the oval was turfed, boundary fenced and dressing rooms were built. Anzac Oval continues to be an outstanding sporting asset in Alice Springs, enjoyed by the community at the recent ARL game there.
Later, Traeger Park became the headquarters of football and other sports in the Alice. Reg, who assisted with the original design and building of the park, was appointed chair of the Traeger Park Board. He held this position for more than 10 years. I am told he was very happy to see this government invest $5.5m in improvements at Traeger Park.
Reg Harris was a supporter of many other sporting clubs and organisations in Alice Springs, and was generous with his time, support and advice to new groups getting off the ground. He was a supporter of cycling, and was president and race organiser of the Alice Springs Amateur Cycling Club. He also helped the Alice Springs Aero Club purchase its first trainer aircraft. Reg maintained his interest in sport, and his radio station, 8HA, continues to play an important role in the promotion of local sports in Alice Springs.
Reg Harris was a driving force in Alice Springs, both on and off the sporting field. It is due in no small part to his efforts that the town enjoys such a high standard in its sporting facilities and has such a big reputation in the world of sports.
My sympathies go to Marge and the family and their friends. They can be proud that Reg got the runs on the board for the Alice Springs community and left an indelible mark on the community.
As the minister for Sport, I am eternally grateful for his contribution to sport and participation of sport in Alice Springs.
Madam SPEAKER: I thank honourable members for their contributions and extend my condolences to the family and friends of Mr Harris.
Motion agreed to.
Members stood in silence for one minute as a mark of respect.
RESPONSES TO PETITIONS
The CLERK: Madam Speaker, pursuant to Standing Order 100A, I inform honourable members that responses to Petitions Nos 6, 8, 10, 13 and 14 have been received and circulated to honourable members.
Petition No 6
Noise and Air Pollution from the Ron Goodin Power Station
Date presented: 19 October 2005
Presented by: Dr Lim
Referred to: Minister for Essential Services
Date response due: 29 March 2006
Date response received: 22 March 2006
Date response presented: 28 March 2006
Local residents have raised concerns about Power and Water Corporation’s nearby Ron Goodin Power Station through direct contact with Power and Water and by signing a petition that was recently tabled in the Northern Territory parliament.
I have sought from the Power and Water Corporation an update on what is being done to address these matters.
Power and Water has advised:
and Kilgariff Crescent. Monitoring was completed in October and a report, including recommendations to solve
the noise issue, is expected next month. Power and Water will assess the report and recommendations, and
implement the necessary engineering solutions.
A survey to monitor soot levels in the Golf Course Estate commenced in early November. Samples from a
number of properties, including swimming pools, were collected and are being tested in an independent laboratory
that will provide Power and Water with a report on the results.
I trust this information is of some assistance and look forward to further advice being provided to local residents on the outcomes arising from these steps.
Petition No 8
Irrkerlantye Learning Centre - Closure
Date presented: 30 November 2005
Presented by: Mrs Braham
Referred to: Minister for Employment, Education and Training
Date response due: 13 June 2006
Date response received: 24 March 2006
Date response presented: 28 March 2006
Thank you for your correspondence of 14 February 2006 in which you forwarded me the terms of a petition read in the Legislative Assembly on 30 November 2005 (Petition No 8) regarding my decision to transfer students from the Irrkerlantye Learning Centre to schools in Alice Springs.
I note that the petitioners request that the Northern Territory government review and reverse this decision pending a full review and evaluation to fairly assess whether students have progressed or made any achievements to their individual full potential using current statistics and qualitative outcomes as measures of progress. I note also the request that the outcome of the suggested review be used as a document to open consultations with the Aboriginal Arrernte community members and the Northern Territory government to identify education strategies to deal with disadvantaged children who are at high risk.
The decision to have students continue their education in Alice Springs primary and high schools was based on a number of factors. These include few students, low attendance rates, unacceptable educational outcomes and the poor state of the Irrkerlantye Learning Centre facility. I do not believe that the educational provision at the Irrkerlantye Learning Centre is the best that the government school system has to offer and these students deserve the best.
Alice Springs has a number of quality schools with indigenous student populations ranging from 40% to 67% of the total number of students at each. These schools have excellent facilities, resources and programs and students from similar backgrounds to those at the learning centre are achieving significantly better results and have higher attendance levels.
All students should have access to the quality facilities and professional support services that exist in our schools, such as libraries, sports facilities, playgrounds and equipment, information technology, wellbeing officers, and special education and English as a second language support. Attending these schools will also give the students currently enrolled at the Irrkerlantye Learning Centre the opportunity to interact with other Alice Springs students.
The Department of Employment, Education and Training (DEET) has developed a transition plan to support students as they move into schools, which I will be monitoring very closely. Teacher staffing levels will be maintained and resources such as assistant teacher positions will remain to support students. I would also be pleased to see the kind of support offered by Ngkarte Mikwekenhe Incorporated continue for families and their children.
All government schools in Alice Springs are working hard to address the challenges of providing education for diverse groups, particularly those indigenous students who have become disengaged from mainstream schooling. Alternative education programs and indigenous units are operating effectively in several schools. Partnerships and mutual endeavours, for instance in relation to school transport for students living in town camps, have been established between DEET and peak indigenous organisations such as Tangentyere Council.
In specific relation to the Irrkerlantye Learning Centre, senior DEET officers in Alice Springs have been proactive in opening up productive communication channels with Ngkarte Mikwekenhe Incorporated. To facilitate a smooth transition, a project officer has been appointed to liaise with Ngkarte Mikwekenhe Incorporated and the families of the Irrkerlantye Learning Centre students. It is anticipated that the project officer’s work will continue until the end of Semester One, 2006, by which time the students are expected to have settled in to their new schools.
In addition, a consultant was recently engaged to facilitate a meeting of all the parties associated with the centre. Those present discussed the opportunities for continuing support for language and cultural programs and agreed on a time line for the transition of the Irrkerlantye Learning Centre students, which includes the possibility of them moving to a school as a group.
I assure the petitioners that my decision to transfer students from the Irrkerlantye Learning Centre is based on my commitment to provide them with the best possible educational opportunities.
- Petition No 10
New School for Palmerston
Date presented: 1 December 2005
Presented by: Mr Mills
Referred to: Minister for Employment, Education and Training
Date response due: 13 June 2006
Date response received: 24 March 2006
Date response presented: 28 March 2006
Thank you for your letter of 14 February 2006 regarding petition No 10 of 1 December 2005 regarding a new school for Palmerston.
In accordance with Standing Order 100A the following is in response to the petition calling upon the Northern Territory government to build a new primary school in Palmerston to commence operation in the first term of 2007 or before, to relieve the pressure on existing schools; and to clarify for Palmerston families exactly when an additional secondary school will be built.
The planning process to establish new facilities has commenced to build a new government school in Palmerston on Lot 8584 at Rosebery. Lot 8584 will require rezoning in order to allow the proposed development. This land has been identified for a Community Hub in the draft Palmerston Eastern Suburbs Framework Plan.
A proposal to build a new school at Rosebery is listed on the DEET Capital Works Rolling Program as a forward works item for 2008-09 and will be subject to budgetary consideration in the years leading up to the design and construction stages of the school. The timing of a new school at Rosebery may be influenced by the outcome of the middle years community consultation process, in addition to population growth factors and the rate of take up of new land developments in Palmerston.
Some schools in Palmerston are nearing maximum student enrolment capacity. Projects are under way to provide new modular style classrooms at the Woodroffe and Durack Primary Schools. They are due to be completed in March 2006 and May 2006 respectively. The situation at Bakewell Primary School is being closely monitored to assess the need for a further modular classroom to be added to the school.
Modular classrooms are used to provide additional enrolment capacity in the Northern Territory and elsewhere in Australia, to strategically manage the cycle of fluctuating demand for student places. This option will be considered in Palmerston where schools are nearing capacity.
A concept plan for a senior student wing at Palmerston High School is in the planning phase. A decision to proceed with this will not be made until the community consultation about the middle years is finalised and consideration given to the kind of facilities needed to support the education framework in the Northern Territory in the future.
Petition No 13
Sale of Territory Insurance Office
Date presented: 14 February 2006
Presented by: Mr Mills
Referred to: Treasurer
Date response due: 13 June 2006
Date response received: 16 March 2006
Date response presented: 28 March 2006
As you would be aware, on 8 February 2006 I announced that the government had decided to retain the Territory Insurance Office in public hands. The response of the community to this issue, including through the petitions presented to parliament, provided strong feedback for the government in understanding the role that the Territory Insurance Office played in the Northern Territory.
Petition No 14
Sale of Territory Insurance Office
Date presented: 14 February 2006
Presented by: Mr Wood
Referred to: Treasurer
Date response due: 13 June 2006
Date response received: 16 March 2006
Date response presented: 28 March 2006
As you would be aware, on 8 February 2006 I announced that the government had decided to retain the Territory Insurance Office in public hands. The response of the community to this issue, including through the petitions presented to parliament, provided strong feedback for the government in understanding the role that the Territory Insurance Office played in the Northern Territory.
MINISTERIAL REPORTS
APEC Ad Hoc Energy Ministers’ Meeting
APEC Ad Hoc Energy Ministers’ Meeting
Ms MARTIN (Chief Minister): Madam Speaker, this morning I report on progress on the Asia Pacific Economic Cooperation Ad Hoc Energy Ministers’ Meeting to be held in Darwin from 27 to 31 May next year. This is the first time Australia will host the APEC forum and it is expected that there will be around 100 days of APEC meetings across the country covering issues such as trade, health, counter-terrorism, and energy and mining. These meetings will culminate in the APEC economic leaders’ meeting in Sydney towards the end of next year.
APEC is a key regional institution in promoting regional cooperation as well as a sense of community in the Asia-Pacific region. The 21-member participating economies include the United States, China, Japan, Russia, and the major states of ASEAN. The economies represent about 50% of the world’s trade and include some of Australia’s top export markets.
The Territory has been given the opportunity to contribute to this important event. I am pleased the Australian government has agreed that we would be an ideal location to host the Asia Pacific Economic Cooperation Ad Hoc Energy Ministers’ Meeting. The meeting will create opportunities for Darwin and Territory business. This will include the provision of services required for the event, and an immediate boost for our tourism and hospitality industries. There will also be opportunities for bilateral meetings and, importantly, a priceless opportunity to showcase the Territory to an international audience through the large media contingent which will cover the meeting.
There is no doubt that a successful energy ministers’ meeting will give the international profile of the Territory a major boost. While the Australian APEC 2007 Task Force will be responsible for managing the organisation and logistical arrangements for the leaders’ meeting and other APEC events, the Territory will assist the task force in coordinating and preparing for the Darwin meeting. There are opportunities for the Territory to be directly involved in certain programs in the events scheduled such as hosting functions for participating economies. These opportunities will be negotiated with the Australian task force.
My department has worked closely with the Australian APEC Task Force and other Territory government agencies on various aspects of coordination, planning and venue appraisal. This cooperation will strengthen with a Territory Government Coordination Group which is currently being established to assist the Australian government task force in preparing for the Darwin meeting. The Australian task force has already made several visits here, and I am pleased to say that they have been most impressed with what we have to offer.
The size and complexity of the events means that security is a big issue. The APEC 2007 Security Branch has been integrated into the Australian APEC Task Force to oversee security. They will work closely will relevant agencies, in particular our police who will be responsible for operational security of the meeting, and Fire and Emergency Services. I am pleased to advise that my department has signed a memorandum of understanding with the Australian government to identify the organisational and administrative arrangements on the coordination of APEC events and specifically for the ad hoc energy ministerial meeting. The memorandum of understanding will also cover aspects of intellectual property and clarifies at a high level each government’s responsibilities in the organisation of the event here in Darwin.
I am very proud, as I am sure everyone in this House is, that Darwin has been selected as the venue for this event. I can assure honourable members that the Territory government, in collaboration with the Australian APEC Task Force, is committed to ensuring that the Ad Hoc Energy Ministers’ meeting will be a success in 2007.
Ms CARNEY (Opposition Leader): Madam Speaker, I thank the Chief Minister for her statement. It is both timely and important. We are grateful that the Australian government saw fit to hold this important meeting in Darwin. Frankly, it was very pleasing to hear the efforts being made by the Chief Minister and her department because, as the Chief Minister said, this is a wonderful opportunity. Clearly, there will be a large media contingent. It is important that we in the Territory use just about every device we possibly can to promote ourselves, not only to our fellow Australians but to others around the world and, in particular, those in this region.
I genuinely thank the Chief Minister for her statement. I look forward to hearing of the outcome of the meeting. Obviously, the Australian government will be providing details. I am hopeful that after the meeting the Chief Minister will think it appropriate to provide the House with the end result of the meeting. However, we wish you well, Chief Minister, and thank you for bringing this timely and important statement to the House today.
Alice Springs Town Camps Task Force
Mr McADAM (Local Government): Madam Speaker, I present a ministerial report on the progress of work undertaken by the Alice Springs Town Camps Task Force.
As reported to the House at the last sittings, I have established a task force to examine and report on social conditions and government’s arrangements relating to town camps in Alice Springs. The task force, in undertaking its work, has consulted widely with a diverse range of stakeholders and sought public submissions. These consultations confirm the complexities and challenging nature of many of the key issues. There is a general consensus across the whole community regarding the pressures from an increased number of visitors to Alice Springs and problems associated with antisocial behaviour, litter and alcohol abuse.
Whilst these are legitimate and well-founded concerns, unfortunately much of the discourse has become an ‘us and them’ mentality. This has contributed to a number of widely held misconceptions, misunderstandings and resentment about the causes and potential solutions that might be found.
It has also led to outrageous assertions by people like the member for Greatorex that the government is forcing, in his words, ‘5000 to 7000 people into Alice Springs’. There is no evidence to support such an absurd allegation. The member for Greatorex should be ashamed of himself for peddling such untruths.
These misconceptions will need to be re-examined if we are to find consensus on how to respond to the challenging issues facing Alice Springs now and into the future. There are widely shared views and anecdotes about town camps and visitors: from sniffers moving into town because of the expanded roll-out of Opal fuel to people moving from South Australia because of the alcohol restrictions in Port Augusta. Investigations by the task force reveal a paucity of evidence to support these conclusions. For example, inquiries by the task force were confirmed that there had been a group of sniffers in town but they had returned to their home communities towards the end of last year. Similarly, the reported influx of people from South Australia has not been possible to substantiate. The task force has been informed by a range of service providers that there have been some visitors from South Australia. However, the numbers are small and certainly not in the hundreds as has been reported.
These examples highlight the paucity of available data on mobility patterns, the length the visitors stay, reasons for visitation and the need for services while people are in town. In order to develop an informed understanding of emerging trends and current and future needs it is important to examine the broader socioeconomic context for the region and demography, and to re-examine both perceptions and potential solutions. Alice Springs, after all, is the regional service centre for pastoralists, tourist and miners. It is important to note that there are some 260 surrounding remote indigenous communities. Approximately 30% of the region’s population lives in outlying communities and the Aboriginal population in the region is growing rapidly, all of which highlights the challenges of providing housing infrastructure and services, both in Alice Springs and, of course, in the bush.
Consultations and submissions reveal the principal issue of concern to all stakeholders is that of alcohol abuse. Current health data shows an increased level of harm associated with alcohol as well. Ongoing problems associated with alcohol misuse will require a carefully considered response. A survey of town camps conducted by Tangentyere during 2004-05 confirmed high visitor numbers and an acute shortage of accommodation for short- and long-term visitors. A key priority for action will be to improve existing housing and infrastructure in town camps through the Connecting Neighbours program in partnership with the Australian government. With this in mind, the Chief Minister, the federal Minister for Families, Community Services and Indigenous Affairs, Hon Mal Brough, and I have agreed that Alice Springs should be an area of priority attention for both our governments.
The work currently being undertaken by the task force - comprising representatives of both governments, local community organisations and the town council - has begun to identify some short- and long-term proposals for addressing a number of issues impacting on the whole town. The task force has consulted widely across the Alice Springs community and there will be a further opportunity when a community briefing is held at the Alice Springs Town Council offices at 5.30 pm on Thursday, 6 April. The report of the task force will provide our governments with a useful basis for developing a collaborative approach. Madam Speaker, the task force will provide this report by the end of April 2006.
Dr LIM (Greatorex): Madam Speaker, I welcome the work that the Alice Springs Town Camps Task Force is doing in Alice Springs. It is much needed to understand what is happening in town. However, let me say that there are many things happening in Alice Springs which cause much concern amongst our citizens. Fact: there is an urban drift into Alice Springs. Fact: there is more antisocial behaviour. Fact: there is more litter. Fact: there is more violence. Fact: there are more people gambling in public areas. Fact: there are large numbers of people living in Territory public housing in the suburbs. There are significant issues in this town that this government must address. However, they do not; that is the problem.
People do not particularly care who moves into Alice Springs. That is every Australian’s right. However, this government makes a racist argument. People in Alice Springs are saying: ‘We welcome anybody who comes to our community, but respect our community’. What is happening right now is people who are coming into Alice Springs do not show any respect. That is what erodes the goodwill that Alice Springs people have for anybody who comes to visit our community. It is nothing short of this government being racist, to say that anybody who criticises any antisocial behaviour in this town is racist - and that is a lot of rubbish.
What is important for this government to understand is every community deserves respect. If you visit any community, you need to show respect. I am glad the Arrernte people, through Lhere Artepe, have stood up and said: ‘Respect our country or do not come here’. This Chief Minister should have been there on Harmony Day, standing side by side with the Lhere Artepe people, to show her commitment to ensure that there is law and order in our town. That she did not; she sent a backbencher with platitudes. That is not what this town needs; this town needs action from this government. This government is failing Alice Springs.
Mrs BRAHAM (Braitling): Madam Speaker, I welcome the task force; it is long overdue. The town camps’ living environment has degenerated for a long time now. We all know the consequences of what has happened because the services have not been provided by Tangentyere or the town council in Alice Springs. I hope this task force addresses that and makes the town camps a better place to live. I was appalled when I went into some of them. There are aged people who are not being looked after properly; the children have no play area; there is nothing to keep them there; the rubbish and litter which has been passed to Tangentyere should be the town council’s responsibility; and there is a dog problem. We continually get complaints about the noise, the fiasco, and the hardship that is occurring in town camps. I know the member for Stuart gets complaints.
Let us hope this task force comes up with some good hard decisions: (1) make sure Tangentyere gets back to the core business of looking after town camps; and (2) make the town council responsible; it is in their municipality. Let us ensure that we get the kids to school, that we make life for the town campers’ better; that we say to visitors: ‘You cannot camp here because we cannot have that many people staying in a house’. The number of visitors lobbing into town camps in unreasonable. Let us ensure that we provide alternative camping areas for them if they want to come into town. Let us come up with solutions. It is easy to knock it, and it is easy to say they are a problem, but we know that. I am hoping something comes out of this task force. I realise the report is not available yet, and I look forward to it. I know this minister has a heart, and that he is concerned about what happens to his people on town camps. I hope he guides this task force to a good result for everyone.
Mr McADAM (Local Government): Madam Speaker, I thank both speakers opposite for their contribution. As the member for Braitling has indicated, we are very sincere, as a government, about trying to find mature solutions to what is occurring in Alice Springs. There is no doubt there are a lot of issues impacting. However, unlike the whingeing, the whining and the unconstructive and immature approach of the member for Greatorex, we are in there working with the organisations, the local council and the community - as opposed to getting out and spreading all these fallacies around the place. You used the word ‘respect’, member for Greatorex. I say to you, respectfully: you get in there and do your bit. You roll up your sleeves. You provide some constructive input. Do not whinge from the side.
East Timor Public Sector Development
Dr BURNS (Public Employment): Madam Speaker, I provide details of the role of the Northern Territory government in supporting skills development in the emerging public sector in our newest neighbour, East Timor.
From its tumultuous recent history, Timor-Leste has risen as a brave new nation. When East Timor was part of Indonesia, few of the current citizens of Timor-Leste held senior positions in government and there was little opportunity for locals to participate in the processes of government. It is estimated that about 7000 Indonesian officials fled the region following 1999, and this left a vacuum in the senior ranks of the public service.
It is also important that a developing nation such as Timor-Leste be supported by an efficient and effective public sector. It is vital to such a new nation’s development that the public sector is free from nepotism and corruption. It is for these reasons that AusAID provides support for the East Timor government in developing sustainable and contemporary human resources and public sector governance.
The resulting development of partnerships between the Northern Territory government and the Democratic Republic of Timor-Leste intends that a transfer of skills be facilitated. This partnership focuses on concepts such as performance management, recruitment, career development, ethics and values, leadership training, values, success in planning, organisational change, communication, capability planning, knowledge management and work force management.
One of the means by which this transfer of skills can take place is by an arrangement known as ‘twinning’. Most recently, we have received two delegations of senior officials from Timor-Leste in the weeks of 6 March 2006 and 13 March 2006. These individuals are senior officials from various East Timorese ministries. As part of the twinning program, these officials were placed in a range of Northern Territory government departments and central agencies. I thank the following Northern Territory government agencies for their cooperation: Department of Corporate and Information Services, Department of Employment, Education and Training, Department of Health and Community Services, Office of the Commissioner for Public Employment, Treasury, NT Police, Fire and Emergency Services and Department of Primary Industry, Fisheries and Mines.
The East Timorese visitors had varying levels of English and, in this regard, we were greatly assisted by Ms Dulcie Munn, a finance officer with the Department of Primary Industry, Fisheries and Mines. Ms Munn was able to expertly translate questions and answers to and from Tetum, Portuguese and English. I was most impressed with the insightful questions asked by the visitors. In particular, they were interested in recruitment and retention, indigenous and multicultural employment, the employment of women in senior positions, the number of portfolios held by ministers in the Northern Territory government, the separation of powers between ministers, the chief executive and the departments, and also the future of capacity building for the government of Timor-Leste.
I hope that I was able to contribute to the visitors’ understanding of our government. I have no doubt that the placement of these senior people from Timor-Leste in various Northern Territory government agencies will substantially increase the capacity of these already astute senior officials from East Timor.
I am proud of the role that OCPE has played in the development of the public sector of our newest neighbour. I look forward to further developing strong ties for Timor-Leste. I am able to place on the record today this government’s support for the future progress of a strong and efficient government for East Timor. We are committed to continue to work with Timor-Leste to ensure that this program is not a one-off and that there is suitable follow-up.
Madam Speaker, in closing, the visitors presented me with this beautiful scarf which takes pride of place in my office. It was a pleasure to meet with them. They were very intelligent, interesting people and asked a number of very pointed and profound questions.
Mr MILLS (Blain): Madam Speaker, this is certainly good news. It is a role that we must play being so close to a country and people with greater needs than our own. I would like the minister in his reply to indicate what amount of money has come from AusAID. It is good to hear that we are getting more reports of AusAID dollars being acquitted through the Territory. It has been a long-held position of the CLP that the quantum of money that flows into our region, particularly in the eastern provinces and East Timor, is huge but the Northern Territory, as yet, has been unable to acquit a significant amount of that. It is a very important revenue stream. I would like to know how much that AusAID contract was, and what amount was contributed by the Northern Territory government.
I am very pleased to hear about the obligation to follow-up so that we ensure that the relationship is not just a token effort but we actually see and acquit our responsibilities to ensure that there is long-lasting benefit to the people of East Timor.
Something came to mind as you were speaking, minister, regarding a Commonwealth Parliamentary Association meeting I attended in 2001. At the meeting, there was discussion of East Timor becoming a part of the CPA, albeit not a Commonwealth country, but there being some kind of formal relationship and acknowledgement from the CPA from the parliaments of Australia to East Timor. I wonder if that has been advanced. Secondly, in that meeting it was decided that the best parliament to do that would be that of the Northern Territory. On the strength of that, it would be good to have a report. However, if nothing has occurred that could be an area we could explore for parliament to strengthen our links between this parliament and the parliament of East Timor.
Dr BURNS (Public Employment): Madam Speaker, I thank the member for Blain for his reply. Starting with the last matter that he raised of Timor-Leste being admitted to the CPA, I am not sure of progress of that. I suppose all of us here, as members of this Legislative Assembly, are members of the CPA. It is possibly something we could take on board and, with your guidance, Madam Speaker, try to further that issue.
In relation to the exact amounts of money that have been spent through the AusAID program, I do not have those figures here with me at this moment, member for Blain. However, I will attempt to ascertain that and formally reply to you on that issue. I am aware that the program is coming to an end and there is another application before AusAID for a continuation of the program. I am sure that members of both sides of the House will support that application because it is a very important matter that we support our near neighbour, as you said.
Once again, it is a wonderful project and we all need to get behind it. I welcome the support of the opposition.
Royal Darwin Hospital –
AMA Public Comments
AMA Public Comments
Dr TOYNE (Health): Madam Speaker, during the past few weeks there have been some disappointing and inaccurate public statements made about the state of our health system, particularly about the Royal Darwin Hospital. Today I put the record straight, and assure Territorians that their hospital is safe.
This government has a strong history of support for the Royal Darwin Hospital and the health professionals who work there. We opened the new emergency and critical care wing of the Royal Darwin Hospital in July 2003, with a $6.1m per year recurrent funding commitment for an extra 35 beds and 30 new staff. We have also put in place a number of initiatives to free up hospital beds and reduce bed block. Nevertheless, we know that on busy days the staff at the hospital are under pressure. The main reason for this is simple: more people are coming through the doors.
We have a way forward for addressing this increased demand. First, I have asked the hospital management and staff to work together to make sure that patient flow-through of available beds is optimal. Second, we will build our partnership with Darwin Private Hospital so that, where appropriate, insured and compensable patients can be treated there. Last, we have promised and will deliver more beds at the Royal Darwin Hospital, as well as a further expansion of the Hospital in the Home service.
In the meantime, claims by the AMA that overcrowding in the hospital is causing deaths of one to two patients a month are totally false. As a result of these claims, I asked my department to examine reports and reviews of deaths to determine if any of them identify bed block as a contributing factor. Only one such case was found. As this case had become a focus for public comment, it is important to set the record straight.
I was told verbally about the case when I visited the emergency department in April 2005. I immediately asked my department to look into the allegation. I was briefed about the circumstances of the case and was advised that a root cause analysis was being conducted. A root cause analysis is a confidential and expert investigation into any adverse event. Conducted by senior clinicians, it looks at the causative factors for the event, ensuring high-quality care for patients. During this month’s departmental examination of possible cases where bed block was implicated, it transpired that the root cause analysis of the individual case mentioned had not yet been completed. It was completed immediately. It identified bed block as one of the several contributing factors to the death. As soon as the department was aware of the results of the root cause analysis, they came forward and put it on the record.
Any death is deeply regrettable. However, to extrapolate from this one case to claims that there are one to two extra deaths per month in the RDH emergency department is false and misleading. I urge anyone with evidence of any such cases to report them to the medical administration of the hospital. The AMA president has now withdrawn his claim that there was another such death and admitted that he was mistaken in making such a claim.
I refer to the member for Greatorex and his calls for the Coroner to investigate this case. I would expect the member for Greatorex, as a medical practitioner who has had personal experience of the coronial process, to understand how the coronial system works. Let me remind the member for Greatorex that the Coroner’s Office is an independent judicial office, and no politician should seek to interfere with its operation, such as telling the Coroner which cases to investigate. For the information of the member for Greatorex, the case was referred to the Coroner. The Coroner, the CEO of the Health Department and I all received the same advice from the hospital at the time of the incident: that bed block was not implicated in the death. The Coroner is now reviewing his findings on the basis of the information contained in the newly completed root cause analysis.
Madam Speaker, our hospitals are safe. Unfortunately, the inaccurate public claims by the member for Greatorex and others do not assist in addressing issues of safety and quality of care. Instead, they undermine public confidence in our health services and in our hospital staff. I do not intend to stand by and allow the reputation of our hospital to be attacked in this misleading and false manner. Territorians can continue to have every confidence in our hospitals.
Dr LIM (Greatorex): Madam Speaker, I am pleased to hear the minister correct some of the so-called inaccurate statements made about the health system. I believe all professionals in the Territory have high regard for our health system and for the professionals within our hospitals and also in private practice. Nobody would dispute that our doctors, nurses and other allied staff work very hard. What is accurate is that this minister has been asleep at the wheel.
That is what is accurate. That is what the AMA said about this minister: that for years they have been trying to get this government to wake this minister up so that the health portfolio, the health system, can be properly managed. The public needs to know that the government has their health as the first thing on their minds. Every Territorian deserves good health, good education and good law and order. This government, through this minister who has been asleep at the wheel all this time, has failed. There is a litany of problems in our hospital system because of the poor management of this portfolio by this minister.
When there is a hue and cry, he hides behind a public servant. He puts the public servant right in front of the television cameras and says: ‘You respond to all the criticism about the issue’. He should have been there but, no, he hides behind the skirts of a public servant. That is terrible. This minister has been asleep for so long that he does not know what is happening. When is he going to wake up? If he is not, then it is time for the Chief Minister to shift him and put somebody who is a bit more awake in the job.
Madam Speaker, you were rolled for lesser crimes than this guy has committed, yet he is still sitting there as the Health minister. He should be ashamed that he has failed Territorians so severely that our waiting lists have just exploded out of control.
Dr TOYNE (Health): Madam Speaker, despite the member for Greatorex’s huffing and puffing, I will continue to focus on building the capacity of the Royal Darwin Hospital and other areas of our health system. I can assure him that his views are not held by the vast majority of health professionals with whom I meet on a very regular basis, including those at the Royal Darwin Hospital.
I believe that, on any fair assessment, there is absolutely no comparison in the capacity that has been brought into the areas of the hospitals and other delivery sites around the Territory in the safety and the quality of the services that are provided to Territorians now compared to five years ago. We are getting on with building the health system in a sustainable and safe way and we will continue to do so. If the member for Greatorex wants to huff and puff and score political points let him do it; it does not worry me in the least.
Reports noted.
ASSEMBLY MEMBERS AND STATUTORY OFFICERS (REMUNERATION AND
OTHER ENTITLEMENTS) BILL
(Serial 35)
OTHER ENTITLEMENTS) BILL
(Serial 35)
Continued from 15 February 2006.
Ms CARNEY (Opposition Leader): Madam Speaker, the bill is supported.
Ms MARTIN (Chief Minister): Madam Speaker, I know this is a non-controversial bill but it does have aspects of how we actually determine remuneration and other important aspects of statutory bodies, and incorporates two pieces of legislation into one new piece; that is, the Remuneration Tribunal Act and the Remuneration (Statutory Bodies) Act. It includes how we, as members of parliament, get paid. Therefore, I was surprised to see such a quick response from the Leader of the Opposition.
There are some important aspects of this bill that affect the workings of this parliament and our statutory bodies which make an important contribution to the Territory. The bill, essentially, introduces some new aspects but also modernises the structure of tribunals and the way that they are classified and remunerated. It also updates the terminology of previous legislation, which is important.
Aspects we have dealt with in here include when tribunal determinations are made public. That is something that we have had dealings with over the last 12 months. This clarifies that. It also deals with tenures of members of the Remuneration Tribunal. Previously, it was just an ongoing appointment; now it is going to be a five-year appointment.
Another aspect that is part of the transparency that we are constantly determined to achieve in our legislation is that, previously, I had the ability to make a determination about entitlements that were not covered in the RTD. I could make that determination but I did not have to actually make it public.
What this piece of legislation does is to say that if I do make any additional determination outside the RTD then I have to table it in this House. It is really hard to think of anything that I might do. The only thing we could think of is if I make a specific determination for something like a member travelling with a first class air fare. I would have to state the reasons for that and table it in here. There used to be an entitlement for first class air travel. I do not believe that is warranted, and I do not think anyone in here agrees that that is warranted. If you are travelling overseas in business class, it is quite adequate. However, if I did make that determination for some particular reason, seeming to offer a special and secret advantage to a member, the reasons would have to be tabled in here.
This is an important piece of legislation. It might not be particularly controversial. However …
A member interjecting.
Ms MARTIN: Yes, that is all right, you can travel business class.
It is an important piece of legislation. I thank all those who have contributed. I especially record our thanks to Otto Alder for all the work he does in our Remuneration Tribunal. One point I would like to make is that we have now established tenure for members of that tribunal and we can have a one-member, two-member or three-member tribunal. We currently have a one-member tribunal. When I first met Otto Alder of the Remuneration Tribunal, I asked: ‘How can you have a tribunal that only has one member?’ He said: ‘It does not mean three, Chief Minister, it means you can have one, two or three’.
Because we are introducing a tenure component into this legislation, we have had some discussions, quite properly, with Otto Alder. Otto turns 70 next year, so age does creep up on us all. He has announced that he would like to continue, and we are very happy to have him continue as the tribunal until that date. He will be continuing until November next year when we will be looking to appoint a new tribunal member in his place. However, until that time, we look forward to more of his work and thank him for all the effort he has put in so far.
Madam Speaker, with those few words, I hope this amendment bill has the support of the House.
Motion agreed to; bill read a second time.
Ms MARTIN (Chief Minister)(by leave): Madam Speaker, I move that the bill be now read a third time.
Motion agreed to; bill read a third time.
WORK HEALTH AMENDMENT
(ADVISORY COUNCIL) BILL
(Serial 36)
(ADVISORY COUNCIL) BILL
(Serial 36)
Continued from 16 February 2006.
Mr MILLS (Blain): Madam Speaker, my speech will be shorter than my colleague in responding to the previous passage of legislation. This bill is supported. It is necessary, however, to make some comments and an inquiry - which is not necessarily sitting within the parameters or the mechanics of the legislation, but to reflect on whether progress has been made. If we talk about putting things together to produce an outcome, we want to see that there has been an improvement. I looked at a previous statement by the minister in May 2002, and it raised a couple of questions for me which I hope the minister can clarify by way of answer.
In recent times, we have had some concerns about health and safety, particularly most recently when reference was made in the last sittings of this parliament. In that case, we are talking about the appointment of an independent chair, a concept fully supported. However, I would like to quote from the minister’s own words from 2002:
- Occupational health and safety in our Territory workplaces is a major concern to this government.
Yes, it is a concern for all of us:
- Measured against other states and territories … accident and injury rates are okay, but they are not reducing at the same trend rate as the Australian average.
Therefore, following through from that, you would say they are going to do something about that. Further on in the statement one of the things that the minister said he would do was:
- I also intend to reconvene the Work Health Ministerial Advisory Council ...
He went on to explain why that is such a good idea. Quoting the minister’s own statement, this council has not met for almost two years – and that was in 2002. I would like to know how many times the Work Health Ministerial Advisory Council has met since that statement was made in 2002? It is a very important question. I am happy to support bills that are presented by government, provided I can be sure that the intent and the desire to do the right thing is there and we have the accompanying grunt to make it happen and produce the outcome and address the needs which were once of great concern. I have a suspicion that the Work Health Ministerial Advisory Council has met infrequently. At the time of this statement, 2002, it had not met for two years. We have evidence of great concerns in work health in recent times, as already mentioned.
I ask the minister to assist me and the CLP in wholeheartedly supporting your bill by answering that question. How many times has the Work Health Ministerial Advisory Council met since you made that statement in 2002?
Mr STIRLING (Employment, Education and Training): Madam Speaker, I thank the shadow minister with responsibility for WorkSafe and the opposition for their support of the bill. It is a pretty simple mechanical change. It is a philosophical bet that we have, and we have done it with a number of advisory boards that we think ought to be chaired by someone independent from the community, rather than the permanent department head, if we are truly seeking independent advice.
That has been the case here, as I have sought to do with other advisory boards and mechanisms within the ministerial responsibilities that I have. The recommendation for this came out of the Lord report in about 2003. It has taken some time to get through, but the advisory council has been reconstituted with new membership. We will have to seek an independent chairperson now and have it up and running.
My advice is that it probably has not met in the last 12 months but was meeting before that. However, I will check that advice so that I am not misleading parliament. I will get back to the member in relation to that. I thank you for your support of this; it is a pretty straightforward mechanical change. I believe we will get a better result in work health.
We do keep the spotlight on it in regard to work and safety in the construction industry, and it still does cause concern from time to time. We have a number of areas of real concern, most notably around electrical accidents over the last couple of years. There is work going on between two departments - the department that currently holds electrical safety and WorkSafe – with a fairly major campaign along the lines of the asbestos awareness campaign. There is also consideration of some suggestions around devices that ought to be fitted to new buildings and the question of whether they ought to go to existing buildings in reducing the incidences of electrical accidents as far as possible. We know electrical accidents are often fatal. There is no second chance for the person who suffers an electrical accident at work.
Madam Speaker, there are still concerns and we monitor them closely. However, I will check my understanding of when it last met and I will advise the member accordingly.
Motion agreed to; bill read a second time.
Mr STIRLING (Employment, Education and Training)(by leave): Madam Speaker, I move that the bill be now read a third time.
Motion agreed to; bill read a third time.
PARTNERSHIP AMENDMENT (VENTURE CAPITAL FUNDS) BILL
(Serial 42)
(Serial 42)
Continued from 22 February 2006.
Ms CARNEY (Opposition Leader): Madam Speaker, I will be a little longer on this one. We take the view that if you can say something briefly and succinctly then that is what should be done. All politicians are accused of being oxygen thieves. Both sides throw it at each other on a not infrequent basis. If there is legislation that comes to us then we will be a responsible opposition. We will get stuck into legislation and have our say in relation to it where it is appropriate for us to do so. At the same time, if it is appropriate for us to support a piece of legislation then the words ‘the legislation is supported’ should be warmly embraced, I would have thought, by members of the government. In any case, I note with a …
Dr Toyne: I am prepared to accept them right now actually.
Ms CARNEY: Thanks, minister, but I just need to make a couple of observations for the purposes of Hansard in relation to this bill. Members on the government’s side should not be, with respect, surprised, or for that matter indignant, when we say we support legislation. If you want us to take up space we are happy to do it, but we have other priorities. That takes me to the current bill, the Partnership Amendment (Venture Capital Funds) Bill.
Minister, I can assure I you I really will not be long and the bill is supported. However, it is important to make a couple of observations and I am not sure that you will find it necessary to reply. It is really for the purposes of Hansard that I want to get my comments on the record.
You may recall in the election campaign in June 2005 that the CLP announced a policy in relation to venture capital because it was seen as incredibly important to the Territory’s future. It was announced, as I understand it, by my predecessor at a Chamber of Commerce luncheon that was held either just before or during the election campaign, and it was warmly received. It was warmly received for good reason. You will find that our support becomes abundantly clear because it is, in fact, a policy of my party. We are thrilled that you have taken it - perhaps not holus-bolus - but that you have got stuck into it.
I note that on 19 July 2005 in a written question, we asked the Minister for Business and Economic Development about this issue of venture capital - the number I have is 119 and I quote:
- One of the CLP’s policies at the election was to establish a capital innovation fund, a venture capital body designed to provide funding to innovative companies looking to expand new technologies – and was very warmly received by many businesses:
- 1. Why has your government not introduced a similar venture capital proposal?
2. Is it true that a similar proposal was taken to Cabinet for submission but not approved?
3. Why has your government not taken steps to back these local, innovative businesses?
The answer delivered on 31 October 2005 was:
- The government continues to monitor the finance environment and will consider how to encourage the establishment of a venture capital fund when it is considered appropriate.
These changes of government are very broad and refer to a number of Commonwealth acts and are, by their very nature, more legislative from a mechanical point of view at this stage - which is why I think the Attorney-General has introduced the bill as opposed to the minister for Business. The fact is that both parties in the Northern Territory are at one when it comes to identifying and creating opportunities for future investment in the Northern Territory. Even the Attorney-General or the minister for Business will say: ‘The written question in July 2005 does not have much to do with this’. I believe it does.
We are delighted that government has finally seen its way clear to support and promote opportunities for Territory business, as the Attorney-General said in his second reading speech:
- The amendments contained in this bill are essential if the Northern Territory is to facilitate the possibility of venture capital investment firms located in the Northern Territory, and firms located in other jurisdictions to invest in the Northern Territory.
- I do not expect that these provisions will have a profound short-term effect on the Northern Territory, but they do assist in settling in place a consistent national regime that facilitates investment in Australia.
These changes go to the very issues that businesses were lobbying us about more than a year or so ago. Therefore, minister, I am sure you will appreciate why I found it necessary to put these comments on the Parliamentary Record. The long and short of it is that we are very supportive of these changes. We think, clearly, that they are timely. We welcome your comments made in your second reading speech about the importance of this legislation in conjunction with other legislation around the country that will go to supporting future investment in the Northern Territory. That is why we are all here. We play politics all of the time, but this is a good result and we are very pleased with it. Thank you. It is for those reasons, Madam Speaker, that the bill is supported
Mr HENDERSON (Business and Economic Development): Madam Speaker, as minister for Business I strongly support this bill in the House today. I will pick up, initially, comments from the Leader of the Opposition in regards to the CLP proposal in the election campaign to establish a capital innovation fund. I know where that proposal came from. I can say that, as minister for Business, we looked very closely, along with Treasury officers going back some years ago now, at a proposal that had various variations on the theme of establishing a discrete fund - whether it was a venture capital fund or a capital innovation fund - in the Northern Territory. There was a proposal floating around and there was much work done in assessing and evaluating the appropriateness of the Territory government, via the taxpayer, committing taxpayers’ money to such a fund.
It was considered. However, I say again to the Leader of the Opposition that no formal proposal ended up going to Cabinet. In a nutshell, the concerns that we had at the time - and we are always prepared to consider a further evolution of the theme - is that we have to be very careful committing taxpayers’ money to investing specifically and directly in commercial enterprises. Previous governments had, I suppose when you look at it, a pretty sorry history of trying to pick winners and contribute directly to the capital raising of a number of SMEs, start-up businesses and bright ideas around the place at the time. Regarding the research that was done in accessing investment capital, there is little evidence of specific market failure for proposals that are well thought through, or well structured and appropriately presented to various financial institutions.
The conclusion we came to on the issue of venture capital funding was not so much that there was discrete market failure. On the part of established venture capital funds that exist around Australia, there was very little knowledge, awareness or understanding regarding the structure of our economy or the capacity of local businesses of the Northern Territory. Work to be done in that area - and I know some work has been done - is to actually promote the Northern Territory to those funds as a place that they should look to in seeking to deploy some of the capital that they have available for investing in enterprises.
I know where that proposal came from which was considered. At the time, it was determined that to risk taxpayers’ money specifically into such a fund was not appropriate. However, to the people who contributed to that debate at the time, if they are reading this debate, I always have an open door to look at ways where we can further promote the venture capital industry in the Northern Territory. This bill is a good start. I commend the minister for Justice for bringing it to the House because we have to maintain our competitive environment in the Northern Territory on a legislative base.
The competition for the investment dollar is now global and we compete on a global basis for investment in the Northern Territory economy. Our legislation and our fiscal and taxation regimes have to keep pace with what is happening with the competition. It is a good time for this change to come about. The Northern Territory economy is moving ahead in leaps and bounds. As Access Economics has said: ‘The current economic climate in the Territory is turbocharged’. Access Economics is forecasting growth of around 4.5% in GSP rates for the next four to five years.
The type of competitive environment we are seeing at the moment is seeing unprecedented amounts of investment capital coming to the Northern Territory across a range of our economic sectors. That is one of the reasons why the government is proposing the Defence support hub, for example, trying to attract the Through Life Support for the Army for the Abrams tanks and the ASLAVs to the Territory. There would be significant investment capital if that initiative started, as well as ongoing investment and jobs in the Northern Territory.
With the development of the ConocoPhillips Darwin LNG plant - I am sure members are aware that, last year, ConocoPhillips made a decision to relocate their operations base from Perth to Darwin - I had a couple of people from the real estate industry saying to me that those people had started to arrive. We are talking about 40 positions - people with their families coming. Those people are not looking to rent or lease houses, but are looking to buy property in the Northern Territory. We have to maintain our competitive position and this type of legislation will assist us in doing that.
What underlines this legislation is now going to allow for a new type of business structure in the Northern Territory, an incorporated limited partnership. Currently, there is no provision in our existing legislation for a partnership where the liability of a partner for the debts of the partnership in its entirety can be limited. I suppose these are complex company legal structures. However, this issue has already been recognised by most other jurisdictions. They have moved to remove this impediment, and if we want to be competitive for this type of investment capital it is good to see the move happening here in the Northern Territory.
The legislation also ensures that such investors based or operating in the Northern Territory can access tax benefits under the current Commonwealth taxation regime. I am pleased, as minister for Business, to support this initiative. It is as, I have said, all about maintaining our competitive position amongst the rest of the states and internationally.
For the opposition, the issue of venture capital was considered but the request was, in part, for the Northern Territory government to expose the taxpayer to investing specifically and directly in individual businesses. That was not a position we could take at the time.
Madam Speaker, to people in the industry, I am committed to do whatever I can as minister for Business to encourage established funds that operate in the Northern Territory to look away from the east coast to the north and see the potential of them investing here in the Northern Territory.
Dr TOYNE (Justice and Attorney-General): Madam Speaker, I thank the opposition for their support and for the contributions to this debate. The purpose of this bill is fairly clear and it has been ably re-summarised by the Minister for Business and Economic Development. It is just an important underpinning of the current development of the Northern Territory economy where we want to attract venture capital to open up new areas of economic development, in particular to this part of Australia. With the current strength of our economic development this is a good time to give venture capitalists a good structure to invest into our economy.
I do not think I need deal with any other issue at this stage. The second reading speech is fairly self-explanatory, so we will move on.
Motion agreed to; bill read a second time.
Dr TOYNE (Justice and Attorney-General)(by leave): Madam Speaker, I move that the bill be now read a third time. I thank the departmental people who put this legislation together. Work started on this early last year. It is a very important step forward for our economic development.
Motion agreed to; bill read a third time.
TERRITORY PARKS AND WILDLIFE CONSERVATION AMENDMENT BILL
(Serial 40)
(Serial 40)
Continued from 21 February 2006.
Mr MILLS (Blain): Madam Speaker, in making a few comments on the bill before us, I state at the outset that we do not have an issue with the intent of the bill. I understand that people who manage our soon-to-be-given-away parks want to do their best and try to protect the parks by having the process of prosecuting offences made easier for them. In the case of most of the offences outlined in the amendments, there is no problem.
However, I want to express my concern about section 67D and the amendments to make that a regulatory offence. Sadly, in recent times, it has become the fashion to create increasing numbers of offences that have been declared regulatory. This is convenient because it allows for easier prosecution. The problem is that there are now more offences than ever before that carry a prison sentence and have been declared regulatory.
I remind members that a regulatory offence is an offence that is minor and absolute in nature. It is absolute because it removes the defences that are normally available for people charged with committing offences. These offences are those such as speeding, failing to obey a road sign, etcetera. These are offences that carry little social stigma. If an offence is of a more serious nature the normal defences should apply.
In the proposed bill there is an attempt by the minister to make section 67D a regulatory offence. The reason given in a briefing to the staff of the Leader of the Opposition’s office the other day was because it will make prosecution easier because there will not be the need to put together a prosecution file; a simple on-the-spot fine could be issued. If an on-the-spot fine can be issued for a simple offence and all the defences available under the Criminal Code are still available for a person charged in such a fashion, the issue of such notices under the Summary Offences Act are a case in point.
I remind members of how the Criminal Code operates with regards with regulatory offences. Section 22 it states:
- Except for sections 26(1)(c) and (d) (and sections 23 and 24 to the extent necessary to give effect to section 26(1)(c) and (d)), 30(3) and 38, this Part does not apply to regulatory offences.
A quick check of the legislation reveals that the defences of immature age and ignorance of law caused by unpublished legislation apply. All of the other defences available such as unwilled act or accident, mistake of facts, sudden or extraordinary emergency, provocation and duress, are not available to a person who could end up serving time.
If a person is convicted of an offence for which they may go to gaol, then the CLP has reservations about the operation of the legislation. As much as we understand the need for an ability to effectively prosecute on the behalf of authorities, prosecutorial evidence should not be an excuse to remove a person’s right when they face the possibility of a prison sentence. The minister will offer two comments in relation to this, I suspect.
The first comment will be that there are already offences that are regulatory that carry prison offences. True, but two wrongs do not make a right. The second comment is most likely that a person will be given an on-the-spot fine and will never go to gaol for this. The problem is that when a person pays an on-the-spot fine, they have effectively pleaded guilty and the matter ends. The penalty for the fine has already been set; that is how a speeding ticket works. However, a person may want to fight the allegations made in an on-the-spot fine and so they do not pay the fine and a summons is issued. As an aside, it is worth noting that a prosecution for a person intending to plead not guilty for an on-the-spot fine is just as difficult as any other prosecution because the matter still has to go to court.
When a person who is accused of something and issued with an on-the-spot fine, and they are expecting that they can rely on defences under the Criminal Code because they want to explain to the court that they were acting in an environment of a sudden or extraordinary emergency when they breached section 67D, they will discover that the defence is not available because the government made it a regulatory offence. They will be convicted, as the defence has been removed by the parliament. Once a conviction is secure, the court will then turn to the act and see that the fine is $5500 or up to six months in the slammer. Very unlikely that the courts will send someone away for the offence, especially when there is strong negation. Thank goodness for the independence of the courts in spite of our attempts here today to limit their independence.
However, at some point when this person who was convicted of an offence that carries a term of imprisonment wants to apply for a job and that requires a criminal history check, then they will be horrified to discover that they may lose their opportunity to work in that area when the prospective employer discovers that their new possible employee once faced gaol for an offence. I said earlier that prosecutorial convenience is not a ground for limiting people’s rights. We do this far too casually and I know that this issue is neither new nor high in the minds of government because it is too hard. The problem will come when there really will be a miscarriage of justice caused by our attempts to make prosecution easier.
Madam Speaker, we do not support this bill because it has the capacity to be a bad law and to remove rights from people charged with offences that, in the most extreme cases, end up in gaol. We on this side of the House believe in due process for offences that put people in gaol. We hope that this government has the capacity to understand that due process sits in the heart of our civil system. To tamper with it is to invite peril.
Mr WARREN (Goyder): Madam Speaker, about a month ago, I was sitting at one of my shopping centre stalls and one of my constituents came up to me claiming that, during last year’s goose shooting season, there were two occasions when shooting occurred in the Fogg Dam Nature Reserve within my electorate. I was quite taken aback by what he claimed. I thought, surely, this could not have happened. However, since then I have spoken to several of my constituents who claim irresponsible people are giving scant regard to our wildlife and our parks. Moreover, there is a good chance that their illegal activities will not be able to be brought to prosecution.
After reading the background to these amendments to the act, I now understand why. At the moment, we rely on enforcement by prosecution only and to get a successful prosecution you have to prove intent. This takes much legal preparation. It is time-consuming and is quite often difficult to proceed through to prosecution. It is an administrative burden to our wildlife officers. Too often, these hoons get away, only to re-offend again. Unfortunately, it is our native wildlife which suffers. This was not what was intended and this is definitely not what any of us want.
Our parks and reserves and, most importantly, our native flora and fauna, must be preserved. If it means that we need to make appropriate amendments to our act, then so be it. By moving to a regulatory enforcement system, we are being consistent with other Australian jurisdictions. This is a system that is working well in other states, and gives real bite to law enforcement by our wildlife officers. These officers will now be able to better regulate the activities that occur in our parks and reserves. Infringement notices will be issued on the spot for appropriate offences, negating the need for cumbersome legal processes where there is a clear breach of the wildlife regulations. The issue of on-the-spot fines will streamline the enforcement process and allow for immediate punishment of offences in our parks and reserves. It will definitely send a clear message to would-be offenders and encourage future compliance.
It will also mean that minor breaches of the act will not need to proceed to prosecution through the existing rigid and cumbersome legal processes. They can, quite rightly, be dealt with by infringement notices. It will mean that, where a minor breach of the act has occurred, no longer will a prosecution automatically result in an offender being unable to gain a new permit for five years. A more equitable system, based on the severity of the offence, will apply. Permits will be issued which clearly and precisely inform the holders of what their obligations are and the conditions of the permit. This will further help with the regulatory compliance.
I am very pleased the condition of the waterfowl hunting permit will require hunters to submit a return advising how many waterfowl species were hunted. This will help ensure our waterfowl numbers are sustainable, particularly for protected species like the magpie geese. Part of these amendments will ensure that there is consistency in the retention period for forfeited or seized articles, which will be set at 60 days. Currently, it can vary from 30 to 60 days, depending on whether they were seized under the act or under the by-laws.
Despite what the member for Blain said, it is important to note that regulatory processes are operated effectively in other jurisdictions. It is not a case of two wrongs, or any wrongs; in fact, it is a matter of right following right, and I stand by that.
Our parks and reserves are too valuable to put at risk. Our current reliance on outdated and cumbersome legal processes for the full enforcement of the Territory Parks and Wildlife Conservation Act and its by-laws is clearly not serving the purpose. That purpose is to protect our native flora and fauna. These amendments will ensure our native fauna and flora are protected through streamlined and efficient regulatory enforcement. Not before time, because we have to get serious on this issue.
I can now confidently go back to my constituents and tell them that this government is listening to what they are reporting to us. I will tell them that this government is in touch with what is happening and what is needed in the Territory. Most importantly, I will tell them that this government is prepared to act decisively in the interests of Territorians and the Territory’s irreplaceable flora and fauna.
Madam Speaker, I commend this bill.
Debate suspended.
DISTINGUISHED VISITORS
Rev S Orme and Mrs Orme
Rev S Orme and Mrs Orme
Madam SPEAKER: Honourable members, I draw your attention to the presence in the Speaker's Gallery of the Moderator of the Northern Synod of the Uniting Church in Australia, Rev Steve Orme, and Mrs Judith Orme. On behalf of all honourable members, I extend a warm welcome.
Members: Hear, hear!
VISITORS
Madam SPEAKER: Honourable members, I also draw your attention to visitors in the public galleries who are here as part of the parliamentary education tour. On behalf of all honourable members, I extend to you a warm welcome.
Members: Hear, hear!
TERRITORY PARKS AND WILDLIFE CONSERVATION AMENDMENT BILL
(Serial 40)
(Serial 40)
Continued from earlier this day.
Mr WOOD (Nelson): Madam Speaker, I contribute to the debate on the Territory Parks and Wildlife Conservation Act. I understand why the government has introduced these changes; obviously, it is to make life easier for parks and wildlife rangers to enforce by-laws. For that, the government should be congratulated.
However, I also have concerns about section 67D, and am interested in the minister giving some clarification on this matter. If this clause becomes a regulatory offence and, if the penalty as prescribed under section 67D of 50 penalty units or imprisonment for six months is part of the regulatory offence, does that mean a person could go to gaol without trial and without the ability to argue a defence?
In relation to non-compliance of a permit, I raised the issue previously about filling out a survey form about the number of geese shot. Minister, your predecessor, Dr Burns, said in response to a question in relation to this matter:
- I do not want to see hunters penalised, and I have arranged meetings with peak bodies on this issue. I hope to progress on this issue and report back to the House. I certainly do not want to see people banned and I agree there should be incentives rather than the big stick approach.
On 5 July in the Estimates Committee, the minister said: ‘There are other ways of obtaining numbers and sustainability of geese’. Minister, in your second reading, you said that:
- … under the current section 56(3) of the act, a person who has been successfully prosecuted for a breach of permit conditions cannot be granted a new permit for five years. This penalty is additional to any imposed by the court, and applies irrespective of the nature or severity of the breach. For minor breaches, this is manifestly unfair and could result in instances of hardship and injustice.
I agree with what the minister has said and that is why I raised this issue in parliament with the previous minister.
You also said in your second reading:
- This bill makes non-compliance of a permit condition a regulatory offence that may be subject to an infringement notice, and will provide an effective and proportionate enforcement regime during the waterfowl hunting season. A condition of the waterfowl hunting permit is that returns are submitted indicating the number of waterfowl species hunted. For example, this enables Parks and Wildlife to monitor sustainable use of magpie goose which is a protected species. The biodiversity of Territory parks may be harmed if permit conditions are not adhered to, and breaches may threaten protected wildlife. The ability to issue infringement notices will enable minor offences to be dealt with on the spot and should encourage all hunters to do the right thing.
Madam Speaker, I therefore hope the minister can clarify the difference between what her predecessor said:
- I do not want to see hunters penalised, and I have had arranged meetings with peak bodies on this issue.
This is related to the issue of the surveys. The minister also said that there are other ways of obtaining numbers in the sustainability of geese. As I read it, that has not happened and people will be penalised for not filling out the permit survey form relating to the number of wild waterfowl they have shot. I certainly agree, if we are looking at sustainable use of our wildlife, that we need to have some idea of the numbers of animals that are being shot. I have asked why we cannot look at other ways of approaching these issues - instead of using the big stick - to have incentives to get people to fill in the forms. I imagine, if you get a percentage of people who filled in their forms, from those forms you can at least make a valued assessment of the total number of wildlife shot. You do not need everybody to fill in every form if you are really looking for a ballpark figure on how many animals have been shot.
The other issue I have besides that is, if section 67D has now become a regulatory offence - in that you can now be subject to imprisonment for six months - does that mean you have gone from a condition or a penalty of not being able to hold a shooting licence for five years to the possibility that you could go to gaol for up to six months for not filling in a survey form? That was the issue that we were originally debating in parliament, to try to remove what we thought was a heavy-handed approach to not filling in a survey form.
One might say that that might be reading too much into it, but section 67D certainly says compliance with a permit: ‘50 penalty units or imprisonment for six months’. If you are now changing that to a regulatory offence, and there is the possibility that someone could go to gaol for not filling out a survey form, does the government think that is a little over the top?
That is why I had some concerns about the amendments to this act. I do not disagree with what the government is trying to do overall; that is, make it easier for rangers to enforce some of their laws. However, I do have some concerns about the regulatory offences especially where a person can go to gaol. I certainly have concerns that the previous minister has said that he did not want to see hunters penalised, and that he would rather see incentives rather than the big stick approach. That does not appear to have happened.
I would like to know from the minister why she has not gone down the path of her predecessor, and what dangers she sees - or are there any dangers - in turning section 67D into a regulatory offence.
Mr KNIGHT (Daly): Madam Speaker, I add my support to the Territory Parks and Wildlife Conservation Amendment Bill. I congratulate the minister for her amendments. They are a measured and prudent step in the ongoing responsible management of the Northern Territory Parks estates, including conservation areas as well. These estates are for the enjoyment of all Territorians, Australians and visitors from overseas. They are a physical example of what makes the Northern Territory different from other parts of Australia and what we, as a government, must also protect and enhance.
I am fortunate to have a number of these parks in my electorate, including the Keep River National Park, Gregory National Park, Flora River Nature Park, Elsey, Litchfield, Nitmiluk, and conservation areas such as the Douglas Daly. I regularly travel throughout my electorate and visit these places. I speak to the park staff who work on the ground, and also see what infrastructure we have out there, what sort of road networks, and the size of these parks. We are fortunate to have these parks. However, they are becoming so popular they are bringing more and more visitors to them and that is bringing added responsibility. We have to protect the integrity of this land and also provide better visitor facilities.
The changes to this bill highlighted by the minister has resonance in these parks with the work of the staff employed in them. Parks and Wildlife staff have a challenging job and a huge workload because of the large distances they have to cover. Under the current arrangements, if park staff find someone who is committing an offence, they must charge this person and then go through quite a lengthy and complicated court process. Obviously, people have the due process of justice. However, for offences which are fairly straightforward and are of a minor nature, this exercise is cumbersome and a bit of overkill. Park staff are very diligent and must decide on what is the best course of action: to go through a lengthy legal process for a minor offence, or let it go so that they can continue to do their valuable work out in the parks.
The members for Blain and Nelson, in their remarks relating to section 67D, were questioning the ability of the park staff to use their judgment. I defend the staff. These measures are designed to help them to protect the parks. They will be fully trained, and they will be fully accredited as conservation officers to issue these permits. I hope people realise that these park staff are there to do the right thing. If they do the wrong thing by these amendments, it will be counterproductive for them and for the value that they try to do within these parks. Therefore, although the members for Blain and Nelson were highlighting the worst-case scenario, I hope they trust these parks officers to do the right thing. It is designed so that they can do a more effective job and the parks can be maintained in a better way.
The member for Goyder highlighted some of the areas where the permit system is issued. I understand that much consultation has been undertaken with various interest groups - those being the firearms group, the animal welfare area and the pet industry - so this has not come out of left field. There has been some consultation carried out; a report was done several years ago.
It is something that will be more effective for the park staff to implement. The effect of these changes to the rules and the restrictions is that we will have more effective management of the parks and the park staff will be able to get on with the core business of looking after the flora and fauna in those areas, rather than sitting in court or writing up lengthy reports on what has happened. In the end, visitors will be very conscious of adhering to the rules within the parks and to the permit system. Staff will be able to effectively enforce these offences and spend more time in their parks.
Madam Speaker, I congratulate the minister for tackling this issue. I understand she, obviously, has a number of parks in her electorate and feels very responsible for those. I commend the bill to the House.
Ms SCRYMGOUR (Parks and Wildlife): Madam Speaker, I thank all members for their contributions. I will get to some of the issues that the members for Nelson and Blain pointed out in section 67D.
I pick up first the issues of the member for Blain who could only see problems with this timely legislation which – as the members for Goyder and Daly have indicated - enjoys widespread support in the community. From the department’s point of view, there has been quite widespread consultation, as the member for Daly just said, with the firearms council, with the animal welfare lobby, and tour operators. There are a number of people who have been consulted and informed about this new regime and some of the areas that are changing with the by-laws and regulations.
The potentially problematic consequences of taking an infringement matter to court are not common and are well understood by the regulators and policy makers. It is not a consequence specific to this legislation, and is not an unforeseen consequence. Regulatory offences will continue to be relatively minor offences.
To answer some of the member for Blain’s concerns – and I know that the member for Nelson also had some concerns with this – about an infringement notice which is issued in error. The recipient - I need to make this really clear - if they infringe, has 28 days in which to appeal the notice. The Director of Parks and Wildlife still has the ability, which has not been withdrawn or changed, to withdraw a notice at his discretion. If someone feels aggrieved, and is able to justify that the infringement notice they received was unfair, they have 28 days in which to appeal to the director, and he has the ability to withdraw that notice.
I need to make clear to members on the other side – they gave the impression that you would just have rangers, willy-nilly, issuing on-the-spot fines, which is a totally ridiculous suggestion. Only accredited conservation officers will have the power to issue infringement notices. It will not be a power indiscriminately given to each and every ranger. Surely, people on the other side know that not all rangers are conservation officers, and training and accreditation is an important element of enforcement and compliance.
An article in the paper today suggests that fines up to $500 for jumping off rocks at Wangi are on the cards. Jumping off the rocks at Wangi is already an offence - of failure to comply with a directive - and it does not attract a penalty of $500. There will be a range of maximum penalties for the offences, as with most legislation.
The simple basis of the amendments is that our current capacity to enforce the Territory Parks and Wildlife Conservation Act is hindered by cumbersome procedures for enforcement and compliance. It is outdated and, compared with other jurisdictions, inflexible and not cost-effective. Non-compliance with minor offences under the act will be much better dealt with by means of infringement notices which can only assist in the protection of the Territory’s plants, animals and parks estate as, currently, many offences go un-prosecuted. The bill provides us with the mechanism to penalise offenders where necessary. It is not draconian as some members pointed out. Not all offences will be regulatory. I believe people selectively went through this bill, the regulations and by-laws, and just picked out certain areas and tried to make mischief with some of those areas.
It has wide support in the community ...
Mr Wood: That is our job.
Ms SCRYMGOUR: Section 67D, member for Nelson, depends on the level of infringement. We are talking about making sure that our flora and fauna get the best protection. This is about our parks estate and making sure that our officers have a system in place to be able to make sure that there is greater compliance. People have to be accountable. To make sure that that compliance is there, we are providing this mechanism to penalise offenders where necessary. As I said, it is not draconian. Not all offences will be regulatory, and we are not introducing any new offences. It is what is currently there; there are no new offences added.
I said earlier it has wide support in the community. The vast majority of our park users have absolutely nothing to fear from its introduction. This will bring about greater compliance. It is about the protection of our biodiversity. Available enforcement tools need to be proportionate to a breach.
Madam Speaker, I thank all members. The member for Blain contradicted himself, as there was a philosophical difference in his support. One minute he said, ‘yes’, he gave an in-principle approach in support, and then he said: ‘No, we are not supporting the bill’.
The member for Nelson, in supporting the bill, raised questions regarding section 67D. I acknowledge that, member for Nelson. In that regulatory offence and the amount in that penalty, that is dependent on the infringement and the level of that infringement. If someone does something really bad within those parks estates, Parks and Wildlife conservation officers - and as I said, the training and the accreditation will be there, so there will not be any young over-enthusiastic rangers running out there and just doing this willy-nilly - there is the protection. As I have said, the Director of Parks and Wildlife does have that discretion. If people feel aggrieved, they have 28 days in which to put that appeal through.
Motion agreed to; bill read a second time.
Ms SCRYMGOUR (Parks and Wildlife)(by leave): Madam Speaker, I move that the bill be now read a third time.
Motion agreed to; bill read a third time.
MINISTERIAL STATEMENT
Middle Years Education in the
Northern Territory
Middle Years Education in the
Northern Territory
Mr STIRLING (Employment, Education and Training): Madam Speaker, I deliver a ministerial statement on middle years’ education in the Northern Territory.
In 2006, the average Northern Territory student receiving his or her Year 12 tertiary entrance result can expect that they will be around five points behind those of their equivalent counterpart in South Australia. They can also expect that they will lag significantly further behind fellow students across the rest of Australia. They can expect those results to, potentially, affect them for the rest of their lives. That is the reality today. This government is not prepared to accept that reality any longer, and nor should any person in this House, or any parent throughout the Northern Territory and, most of all, nor should any student.
The question this House must ask itself today is: what can we do to change this outcome; what can we do to fix this problem? Doing nothing is not an option, as doing nothing will perpetuate an education system that is not providing our children with the best opportunities it can. The government has put forward its solution.
Today is the time for the opposition and Independent members of parliament to put forward their plan. How would they change that reality? Sniping from the sidelines or picking at small parts of the model will not do, and it is not the time for that. That attitude will let down the students of the Northern Territory.
The government’s solution has been developed through extensive research, alongside extensive public consultation. At its very core, it is focused 100% on students and I make no apology for this. I recognise that there are times to focus on teachers and times to focus on administration. On this occasion, our core concern must be and is students, their results and their future. The government’s approach is underpinned by this concern and several key beliefs, such as:
to achieve better results in secondary schooling we must provide more focus on the middle years of a child’s education;
Instead of having up to eight teachers a day, they need to be taught by a core group of teachers, two or three, with the remaining subjects taught by specialist teachers.
To support students, we need to provide greater pastoral care with a focus on nurturing students through those difficult middle years. Parents will form an integral and welcome part of the school. Currently, parental involvement is encouraged at primary school, less successfully encouraged during the secondary years.
We will ensure that schools are not required to divert resources from their middle years to supplement teaching resources at the senior years. We will introduce throughout the education system innovative teaching practices - for example, team teaching - as a means of providing a new approach to students and to assist with discipline issues.
The government believes the best way to achieve these important changes, involves restructuring the current school system. That restructuring involves both the stages of schooling and the infrastructure of our schools. As a result, we have placed before Territorians models for structural change and asked for feedback. We are listening to that feedback. These models were not just made up. They have key criteria underpinning each one. The criteria are:
must allow the policy and principles of the middle years approach to be implemented. The model must be able
to achieve the goals of the middle years approach. That consideration also requires the model to provide improved
choice and pathways for senior secondary years;
access – the model must support the concept that families want to have primary education as local as possible;
will tolerate a smaller distance for middle years education and show a preparedness to accept more distance in
senior secondary;
capacity – the ability of the infrastructure to meet the needs of middle years; and
the best investment and use of resources.
The feedback received from extensive meetings, both public and internal, is currently being finalised and a report is to be provided to me very soon. This information will inform the Cabinet in its final decision making.
I believe it is important for the House to understand how the government arrived at this point today. The evidence of significant problems in the secondary education system was first made available to the government and Territorians in 2003. This was the conclusion of a comprehensive secondary education review undertaken by a professional team led by the highly respected Dr Gregor Ramsey. They listened and heard a strong sense of community disquiet over the secondary education system. That team, made up of experts from across the Northern Territory, received 113 submissions, visited 129 sites, including 40 remote communities, and spent from February to August of that year analysing the Territory situation. Visits to places of best practice interstate also occurred and public forums were held in each urban centre. The government initiated the review in 2002 because we had received numerous representations from various groups concerned about secondary education. We listened to what they said.
The review confirmed those concerns. It told us clearly about the difference between the Territory and other parts of Australia, and identified areas needing immediate work to change those results. The review made 52 recommendations across the full gamut of issues associated with secondary education. At its very core, the secondary review identified a need for greater focus and attention on what is called the middle years. It argued that while secondary schools, DEET and staff work with a high degree of commitment and expertise to meet the diverse and changing needs of young Territorians, particularly of those in middle years, much of what goes on in secondary schooling was still not meeting those needs.
The report proposed that young people in all parts of the Territory need greater support and understanding in their transition from primary school to secondary school, and from junior secondary to senior secondary. A regular comment expressed by parents and students themselves was that primary schools teach children and secondary schools teach subjects. The report pinpoints these transition issues as a key reason for the failure to achieve better results.
The government knew immediately that to turn around secondary education in the Territory this core issue had to be addressed. Despite the extensive public consultation undertaken by Dr Ramsey’s team, the government felt the proposals were of such breadth and dimension that further public engagement and listening was required. We contracted Socom to undertake that engagement. We were criticised for the second round of consultation. We were told to get on with the job.
Further public consultation occurred in 2004 from April to August with focus groups held in November of that year. A steering committee with members from the Australian Education Union, the Council of Government School Organisations, the business sector, schools, the Association of Northern Territory School Education Leaders (ANTSEL), and the DEET executive was appointed to guide and monitor the consultation and subsequent report.
Parents, educators, professional associations, youth workers, business and industry participated in workshops held in the Territory’s regional centres. Over 148 people representing 109 stakeholder groups participated in phase one, with 20 remote communities being represented. Public forums and meetings were held with over 100 people attending the Darwin information meeting, along with approximately 60 people attending the evening in Alice Springs. In addition, approximately 250 educators attended the remote schools conference in Alice Springs at the end of July at which they spent a significant proportion of time providing feedback on the secondary education report. The student forum was hosted by the then DEET Chief Executive, Peter Plummer. Consultation visits to a number of remote and indigenous communities were also conducted.
Members of the public were able to complete individual response sheets which formed part of the community’s feedback. All of this resulted in the report to Cabinet. The report showed the public’s concern regarding some of the recommendations, in particular, those relating to the implementation of school precincts, and the Northern Territory Open Education Centre. It showed overwhelming support for the introduction of a middle years approach. It also showed that there were regional differences regarding changes to the stages of schooling.
In Alice Springs and Tennant Creek, Year 7s have been in high school for a long time. In the rest of regional Territory, this also did not raise significant concern. However, some concern regarding the move of Year 7s was expressed in the Darwin area. Opposition by Casuarina Senior College to Year 10 entering the college was also expressed, but general support was expressed everywhere else.
Cabinet considered both the Ramsey report and the Socom report and announced our Building Better Schools package of initiatives in February 2005. That decision injected an additional $42m over four years into secondary education - the single largest investment made in secondary education in many years. At the time I said:
- The government has accepted most of the review’s recommendations, with implementation of some initiatives to begin immediately. We have rejected the recommendation to close the NT Open Education Centre. Nor will we be implementing Learning Precincts or a Quality Service Agency, both of which would lead to more administration instead of putting funds towards students. We have agreed with the report’s recommendations that we need to better engage 11 to 14 year olds in their education. How we do that will be the subject of extensive community discussion throughout 2005.
That was 7 February 2005. We heard the concerns; we opted for more discussion; that discussion has been extensively conducted throughout 2005-06.
The Building Better Schools package has been the subject of two ministerial statements to this House since its introduction in February 2005. In August 2005 the House discussed the indigenous education package. In February this year, I updated the House on the implementation of other more general aspects of the package.
The package was divided into four key areas:
students and learning - providing more subject choices, expanded vocational eduction options, qualified
counsellors and career advisers in each secondary school, and funds for the implementation of the
middle years approach;
the resources available to them, a new teaching and learning framework giving them more support, and a
new staffing formula;
opportunities for parents and schools to work together.
I said at the time that the introduction of the Building Better Schools package was to be accompanied by further extensive public consultation that began in early September 2005.
Once again, following a public tender, we contracted Socom to do two further phases of consultation. The first phase was to determine what people see as middle years. The second phase and the one that has just ended is to assist the government in determining what is the best structure suited to teaching and learning for those middle years. The first round of extensive community consultation, backed by advertising on television, radio and in the print media, occurred from early 7 September 2005 to 17 October 2005. That resulted in a report to Cabinet showing that the community overwhelmingly decided middle years were the ages of 11 to 14 or Years 7 to 9. Also, the overwhelming public view was that senior years are from Years 10 to 12.
In addition to identifying those years, Territorians also endorsed overwhelmingly, government proceeding with the implementation of a middle years policy. In December 2005, Cabinet did just that. Having begun in 2002 with the request by government to Dr Ramsey to investigate our secondary eduction system at the start of 2006, we are ready to talk implementation of a new system.
The second round of consultation began in January 2006, when educational leaders in the agency engaged in discussion around how implementation could occur. At that meeting, those leaders were advised that models best suited to delivering middle years would be released. However, those models were not to be the only ones considered and principals were invited to begin the discussion with their school communities about what middle years should look like in their own community.
In Katherine, educational leaders took up the call, as they have done since the first Ramsey forum was held in that community. Many of those speakers in their school community started to examine what needed to be done to improve student outcomes. At Katherine High School, composite Year 8 classes were put in place, team teaching was developed and students are being taught numerous subjects across key ideas. The school began to discuss how to implement a middle years approach that might include Year 7s in secondary education.
By the time the second round of consultation got under way in January this year, those schools were ready to seriously decide their future. Yes, there are still disagreements, but none of the issues are seen as irreconcilable or unachievable. They are waiting for us to push the green light.
In March 2006, Socom launched the now well-known models and extensive community discussion has ensued. Let me make it clear that the government is very happy with a public discussion on education. We agree that the education of children should be at the forefront of everyone’s mind. We do not run from that; we welcome it. It should also be understood that the consultation process undertaken over the last couple of months has not just been limited to the very public forums held in key centres. There have been school councils, meetings of principals and teachers, staff meetings, meetings with the Aboriginal Islander education workers, meetings with the Defence Community Organisation, the Bagot Community, and school visits from Building Better Schools representatives for parents, staff and student meetings.
Socom held a series of meetings in Darwin, Nhulunbuy, Katherine, Tennant Creek and Alice Springs. These meetings included: principals’ workshops, including remote schools for secondary provision – CECs; combined principal and middle years teacher workshop; open teacher forums; group school, area school and distance education workshops; interactive distance learning; session for School of the Air, and remote schools; and the teleconference with distance education receivers. A report is being prepared for Cabinet. That report will contain no-holds-barred feedback from all of these meetings.
That is the long path undertaken to get us to this point today. At every point, we have consulted and listened. To say the process has been rushed is simply not true. Since the Chief Minister and I decided to launch the secondary review in 2002 until today, 2006, almost four years have elapsed. That is not a rush. No final decisions have yet been made so I will not enter today into a discussion of one model over another. However, there are general points which I believe need to be aired.
I wish to say to the Year 10 students in our community that the government has rejected the view that they are not old enough to be considered in the senior secondary years. We believe they are mature enough to handle a senior years’ environment. That is why, for two days a week, the Year 10 students of ANZAC Hill High School already attend Centralian College. It is also why the South Australian government has adopted a report that recommends the compulsory teaching of Stage 1 preparatory subjects in Year 10. I also believe that overwhelming evidence now exists which supports the contention of Dr Ramsey and his team that Year 7 is old enough, mature enough, and intellectually ready for middle year schooling in a secondary context.
I also wish to put to rest the myth regarding professional development for teachers. This important work was commenced in 2001. Since that time, Curriculum Services Division within DEET has allocated resources to the middle years of schooling. Activities included ongoing professional development for individual teachers and whole schools; implementation of middle years teaching and learning programs and curriculum materials for teachers in schools; annual teacher forums in regional centres to provide an opportunity for schools to share, discuss, question, clarify and celebrate middle approaches to teaching and learning; and formation of a team of curriculum officers with extensive experience and expertise in using middle years approaches which includes three ET2s, one ET3 and one ET5. Total funding allocated for the period of 2001 to 2004 for middle years professional development has been $4.15m.
Since the adoption of the middle years policy in December 2005, the department has upped the ante on professional development further. There has been the commencement of four professional learning communities to build capacity of schools to be ready for commencement in 2007. Also, community forums have been held in Darwin and Alice Springs to enable teachers and school leaders to discuss, share and identify effective middle years’ approaches already being implemented in Territory schools. Total funding allocated to 2005 outside salaries was $849 000, with a similar amount this year.
During 2006, DEET is undertaking the following programs of professional development: support for individual schools to plan for commencement of middle years approaches for teaching and learning in 2007; training to help teachers to use the Northern Territory curriculum framework for effective teaching and learning in the middle years; grants to schools to enable them to work together to identify ways to improve teaching and learning in middle years; leadership training for school and classroom leaders; implementing middle years approaches to teaching and learning, resource allocation and school organisation; teachers’ and leaders’ forums; award study scholarships for individual teachers and school leaders wishing to enhance their skills and knowledge through research and postgraduate studies; and grants for teacher attendance at key national conferences regarding the middle years of schooling.
Infrastructure is another issue that has arisen. I have been listening hard to these concerns. I have said that infrastructure will be a factor in timing. For example, if the Palmerston model is accepted - and it has been widely accepted by Palmerston schools and parents - we will not have middle schools infrastructure in place by 2007. In that case, the middle years practices would commence in 2007 and the children would move in 2008. The department is working hard determining and resolving all possible infrastructure issues. When Cabinet makes its decision, it will do so with a full infrastructure picture before it.
I also wish to comment on some of the public statements made regarding indigenous students, particularly in Alice Springs. Government holds the same expectations for indigenous students as we hold for all students across the Territory. I will not accept a lower bar for these children. I believe all children must be stretched and challenged. I believe indigenous students are as capable as any other student of facing those challenges. I reject the comments coming from some quarters that middle schooling is inappropriate for these students, and questions regarding their ability to cope with senior years.
There are other issues of public debate and discussion which could be mentioned and, undoubtedly, will be during the course of this debate. I have highlighted a few, but I return in conclusion to my first point: doing nothing is not an option. Whatever is to be done must be done in the best interests of students. The government is determined to tackle those problems head-on, and a middle years educational focus is the best solution. We owe the students of the Northern Territory nothing less than our best and fullest efforts on their behalf. That is what I intend to do. Mr Deputy Speaker, I move that the Assembly take note of the statement.
Mr MILLS (Blain): Mr Deputy Speaker, to commence a response, it is important to separate two core elements to this issue. It has, unfortunately, had to be stated and restated: no one is happy with the levels of academic achievement across the Northern Territory on average. If you ask anyone within this country or this Territory whether there could be improved delivery to 11- and 14-year-olds, no one will disagree. There needs to be a focus on those years. Everyone agrees our structure of primary and secondary creates those ones in the middle who are undergoing significant change in their own development and need to have greater recognition. For those of us who have raised children, we know that when children are at that age they require a different approach. The systems we establish must be more responsive to the needs of those we are endeavouring to serve. No one disagrees with any of that. I suspect that this minister has taken all of that goodwill and translated it into a plan to make a colossal change in 2007.
That is what we need to raise, so that the minister can understand why there is concern and questions asked. He used the phrase ‘opportunistic’ about the opposition: ‘How dare they criticise this. They are just taking the opportunity to score a political point’. I resent that response and accusation. I resent it, not so much for myself, as a slight on me as a politician, or the CLP or Independent members, but on behalf of all those people within our community who have inquired, protested, or questioned. People who have served long in the profession have wanted to raise more weighty issues and have them properly addressed. They need the respect and the time to do so.
That is why I and the CLP cannot support the minister’s plan to implement middle years of schooling and create a new structure in 2007. Let me say again that there is a clear difference, a division in this argument. Yes, we support an approach for the middle years, but implementing it in 2007 by discussing where the kids will go to school and sort out the other stuff later, is inappropriate and risky. I do not understand why on earth the minister would be going down that path.
He will counsel himself and give himself some encouragement: ‘Do not be misled by these claims that there has been little work on professional development’. There has been professional development, and yes, there has been some work on the curriculum. However, you cannot help but ask, if the work on curriculum and the work on professional development is already in place, and that actually feeds the decision that was already made right at the beginning, then why the community consultation?
My primary concerns with the community consultation - and I will depart from this for a time to reflect on the words ‘community consultation’. It is a phrase used frequently by the Labor Party when they were in opposition, and now it is used extensively, passionately, sincerely apparently, whilst they are in government: to consult the community. I sat in on the community consultation. I believe it was the third phase of community consultation. As a politician, I felt it wiser not to contribute but to sit back and hear what the community had to say. The community had a lot to say and, if the minister had been there, he would have learnt that it was not just words that were being spoken - there was passion, feeling, anger, and concern. It was not about whether these years of schooling should receive special focus from the government - not at all. It is your plans to implement in 2007. Not because they were frightened of change - not at all. They want to do it in a respectful and timely manner, just like other states; just like other civilised communities that are able to implement and phase in change in a progressive and respectful way.
In order to get to a destination you need to be agreed with the principal stakeholders. This is not government business. This is government delivering for the community. This is not a political game. This is building something significant, something new; it must be done very carefully. If there is even a hint of an idea that you are going to have your name on a plaque as a great achievement then you should dismiss yourself immediately. It is not about the government, their agenda, or their timetable. It is about putting something in place for the generations to come. It is going to be very difficult to fix the rushed approach. The risk there is inherent in your approach, minister.
You will, of course, come back and say: ‘Ah yes, but we have not really made our decision yet’. If you had been to any of those community consultations you would have been left with no doubt that there was very real concern.
Going back to Palmerston, as I said, I wanted to hold my comments out of respect for the community that had turned up - and in significant numbers, I might say. Unlike the previous one, where the community had just about grown weary of being consulted over ‘Do you think we should do something special with the 11- and 14-year-olds?’ ‘Yes’, they all said. ‘Okay then, we are in a holding pattern until after the election because we do not want to actually make any strong decisions or anything that might ruffle the feathers of the community. Just that general proposition, do you think?’ ‘Yes, yes, yes’.
So we pay Sheila O’Sullivan significant amounts of money. I must say she is an outstanding and very clever operator. Twice there was community consultation; the second phase of it just before the election. There were not very many people there because they did not know what you were actually wanting. Yes, yes, yes, it is good that government is caring enough to think about the 11- to 14-year-olds. However, what people wanted, particularly those who are really interested in education: ‘Give us something substantial to talk about. Can we talk about the curriculum; does it have to be like this? Can we reorganise the curriculum so it delivers more appropriately to the needs of 11- to 14-year-olds or the 15-year-olds?’ Everyone knew it was the Year 7s. The consultation that Gregor Ramsey carried out did not bring up as strongly the concern about Year 10s. That seems an issue of tidiness.
There is discussion and debate. We need to have serious debates on that matter with people who have credibility in this issue - people with experience from the non-government sector who have been there a long time with the Department of Education right around the country. Look at other countries; what is the best way? We were not able to have that debate. What we had was: ‘Do you think we should have a special focus?’ ‘Yes’.
Then the election passed. Now the game was on. In came the political minders and said: ‘If you are going to make significant change, do it early’. ‘Okay, that is the tip. Do it early, imbed it, ride through the storm and then we will probably get into some good sailing weather just before the election, and we will be able to show that we have achieved something. Just sit in the chair and wait for the ride’. There is more to come.
That is an analysis of the approach. It is inherently risky and dishonest at its core because it does not have as its primary interest the improving of educational outcomes for the target group. It has been muddled, first by confusing strengthening delivery of service to 11- and 14-year-olds. You do not even have to change the structure to do that. It is already occurring, as you well know, in many schools. Alice Springs has led the way in many ways with this approach. Many schools through the northern suburbs and in Palmerston are focusing on a middle years approach. You can actually do what other places have done without changing the structure. Can we have that debate? Is that one of the models that we are asked to respond to?
‘Here are all the models you can respond to, members of the community. You can pick this one, this one, this one or this one’. Is there another model to have no change? ‘No, sorry, that is not a model; you have to change. Because we have decided to change, we are consulting you. Whatever you say, we will do it anyway’. That is offensive to those who have a genuine, deeper concern about issues of education.
I want to talk about the curriculum. I want to talk about the issues that have been raised again and again in parliamentary reports about delivery of education to boys. There are better ways we can do it, and there are other states showing different ways of doing it. Our senior secondary models can be different. We could go down a different path altogether; we do not have to stay within the safe confines. There are enough quality people out there who can come up with robust ideas that are Territory owned and driven, for the primary purpose of improving that which is our lot. We can do it; I am confident we can do it. But not with this slick approach which has not weighed the details, or cared enough to slow down and walk in step with the community to deliver a real, structural improvement we can all be satisfied with.
For the minister to suggest that we are, therefore, saying ‘do nothing’, could not be further from the truth. I am saying something of real substance. It is not about politics; it is about making structural change in a careful and considered way. One way to do it is to not employ someone from interstate. ‘Oh, no, you do not like people from interstate’. No, I do not mind people from interstate at all; I married one. In fact, I am one. What I am concerned about is, if you check on Sheila O’Sullivan you will find that she is a highly-regarded Labor Party member from Victoria. Speak to people around the country and discover she is the lady they wheel in when you want to sell something. She is an expert. You could not get a better gun for hire. I reckon if we had enough money - although I do not think we have $600 000 to throw around in the Leader of the Opposition’s office?
Ms Carney: No.
Mr MILLS: No, we do not. If you had $600 000 and you were able to employ Sheila, she could have run our case. I do not seem to have a problem doing that; just have to pay her. Gun for hire; she would run our case. However, government got there first. They have the money and they have awarded Socom $600 000 in contracts over the time of this Labor government. She is not a Liberal Party member – no, she is a highly regarded and influential Labor Party member from Victoria. People can smell it. Territorians know what is going on. They can spot con and spin.
However, going back to Palmerston, I said I would be quiet but, in the midst of it, my pulse went up. When the community was asked: ‘What do you think?’ Do you think all the Year 7s should turn up to Palmerston High School next year?’ The community looked back blankly and said: ‘Should they all turn up? The school is currently full, and we have been asked to advise you whether that would be sensible. No, you would have 350 kids standing out the front of Palmerston High School and no room’. ‘Well, if that is the case we honestly ask is there another way? Is there perhaps another way?’ We were being guided in this. I know what Sheila had in mind because I had information from the previous round of consultations earlier in the day: ‘There are some vacant buildings in Palmerston, perhaps - nudge, nudge - they could go there so that this government can put this new system in place’. People can spy manipulation. No, the bottom line was: ‘Do you mind, government? You have put us in this situation where you are asking us to solve a problem of your own creation’.
There were representatives from Bakewell Primary School which opened in 1999, and has had demountable upon demountable and, even to this day, still has students - maybe as soon as the next intake of Transition students - on the stage. They have had students being taught on the school stage probably for about four years on and off. The only way to accommodate that huge growth is to plonk another demountable at the back. I believe there are about 15 demountables there.
Woodroofe Primary School is also represented. They have no withdrawal space at all in any of their classrooms. They have even taken over some of the room the preschool operates from. The preschool is also at capacity. The high school is at capacity. There was a plan put before the Palmerston community that we were going to have a senior secondary facility, and a lot of good work went into that. Then, last year, it was turned off – a $10m commitment that had been committed again and again was thrown away. ‘Do not worry, we will buy you two schools and a couple of demountables’. Oh goody! The community there is thinking: ‘How offensive is this? You are asking us to solve your problem - the problem you have created, when you should have built a primary school in the first place in Palmerston four years ago, and continued with your commitment to the senior secondary facility in Palmerston’. Instead, you turn back on both of those and have the audacity to ask the community: ‘How do you think we should implement this plan in 2007?’
It was grossly unfair to put the community in that position. That is where the hostility comes from. They are not being respected. What happens between now and the time that Cabinet meets and announces their decision? There may be some change. I hope there is.
The CLP supports a focused approach on middle years of schooling. You know that to be the case, no matter what sort of argument you might want to run, or attack me personally - you find somewhere I have said this or that, then you attack the person. In principle, we agree with it. We have always said that. How could I not support it? As someone who implemented a middle schools program, how could I not support it? Anyone who thinks about these things would support it. However, it is the way in which it is implemented. I tell you, any school that has implemented a middle years program has done it this way. That is from the non-government sector. Have a listen. I know you have an ideological rankle with that which is independent, judging by your decisions. Your real decisions …
Mr Stirling: They got more support from me than they have had from you blokes.
Mr MILLS: The real reason behind your decision to make a move on Irrkerlantye is, I believe, your position on Catholic Education and your plans to move them from the bush. Anyway, I digress.
Going to how it is implemented, you can easily have community consultation to ask if the 11- to 14-year-olds should have a better approach. Yes, that has been done in a number of communities here in the Northern Territory. You can agree on that in a matter of two or three meetings. Now comes the serious business of implementing that, and phasing that period in. The next part of it is that you decide on what would be - and use the appropriate experts - the most appropriate curriculum to put in place to do that. You can think outside the square, but you create that appropriate curriculum. You do that over a period and present that. You then prepare teachers so that they have the capacity then to deliver that …
Mr Stirling: You have not prosecuted what is wrong with the curriculum framework we have now.
Mr MILLS: I will get to that.
Once you have established the capacity of teachers to work on that curriculum framework, then you move to the discussion of what kind of facilities you put in place. Once you have the plans committed to how you will then house the students and this new approach of education, then you phase it in. That is the process that any organisation that has implemented the middle years of schooling has done. They have done it that way. That is why the community is concerned. You say you walk down the street and everyone says: ‘Go for it, Sydney, go for it, you are on the right track’. You are on the right track in a very general sense but, when it comes down to the detail of implementation, maybe that bloke was not at the community consultation. You are probably getting all your feedback from all those who never went to the community consultation. They think it is a big general idea that you are …
A member: I went.
Mr MILLS: Good boy, good boy.
Obviously, the heat is on and you are a seasoned campaigner, minister. However, anyone knows that the best method of defence is to attack. You have let your guard down to attack too many times. You need to have the confidence of the community. To abuse students at Casuarina Senior College publicly is, to me, a sign of weakness and a demonstration of your defensiveness on this issue. To abuse teachers in Alice Springs on 8HA and to criticise them for their performance is a sign of weakness and of your own defensive position. You choose to attack, which is your nature. To then abuse callers on 8HA in Alice Springs and hang up …
Mr Stirling: That is a lie. I went back on air and corrected that.
Dr LIM: A point of order, Mr Deputy Speaker! I believe the minister should withdraw calling the member for Blain a liar.
Mr Stirling: I am just pointing out that it is a lie that is being repeated.
Dr Lim: Then withdraw it.
Mr DEPUTY SPEAKER: Minister, please withdraw.
Mr STIRLING: I withdraw in terms of sensitivity, Mr Deputy Speaker. I said the statement about hanging up on 8HA is an untruth. I said it is a lie. The member for Blain is repeating something that is untrue. I simply pointed that out. I withdraw the ‘lie’, but it is untrue.
Mr MILLS: All right. I listened to the broadcast and there was …
Dr Toyne: Very unfairly presented.
Mr MILLS: I have seen this member in operation. When the buttons were pressed for the third time, a third caller came in from Alice Springs High School and pressed the same buttons. There was a rise of temperature. I have seen the veins stick out on the side of your neck in this Chamber, and I could sense the heat coming across and then, all of a sudden, click, you were off the air. I may be wrong, but what I imagined then was, ‘I could not take any more’, and he is puffing and panting and kicking a few things. He might have kicked his little Essendon footy around the place. His minder came along and said: ‘I think you had better get back on the air. ‘Oh sorry, there was a poor connection there, and here I am again, sorry’. The veins had just gone down a bit after the colour had gone out of the face, as you are want to do. He had a very good minder there to assist. That is what I read into it.
To move to where I would like to see this debate go - though it is not really my position to talk about the sort of things that the CLP will do. There will be a time and place for that. However, I will indicate the direction the CLP would like to go and the reasons for that, but there will be a time and place to throw up a clear difference.
This time, you are in the spotlight and the issue is for you and your Cabinet colleagues to slow down and listen. One of the positive outcomes of this whole issue is that the community is now engaged in debate on education as a topical issue. People are talking about it, and that is good news. It is the time when we can start to talk about aspects of education that would result, hopefully, in improved outcomes. That has not happened for a while. Why you exempt yourself from leadership at this time mystifies me. It is a time when you could engage with the community and go to those forums and present to people what it is you passionately believe about education, rather than leave it to an expert of spin. However, you have not done that; instead you create the impression the decision has already been made.
Mr Stirling: A year ago you said leadership was taking action. Now we should be talking more. You cannot have it both ways.
Mr MILLS: I do not think you understand, and I am not going to go further down this track. You are deliberately misunderstanding - deliberately.
Mr Stirling: A year ago, you said show some leadership, and make a decision. Show leadership, go and make decisions. I am hearing different stories.
Mr MILLS: Leadership is having the courage of your convictions to stand before the community you are endeavouring to manipulate. Have the courage of your convictions to stand before the people on whose behalf you have made a decision - and you have the audacity to ask them to solve a problem of your own creation. If you really had the best interests of students at heart you would have been there and copped it, and led them. They would have been impressed with that courage. Instead, they were offended by throwing in someone who is a master of spin to sell something that you have already quietly decided on. I only hope the community maintains its rage and exerts pressure on this Cabinet to ensure they slow this process down so that it goes through the stages that have been detailed.
In terms of the curriculum, it would be a good thing if we could stop and talk about different curriculum approaches. I am not a supporter of the curriculum framework. I believe that the outcomes-based education approach over the past number of years in this country has shown much to be criticised for. We could do something different. In South Australia, they have carried out a review which decided the Year 10s should now be included in the SACE. We do not have to swallow that. I would like to hear what the minister has to say about his views on the recommendations that have been raised in the South Australian review. Are we just going to go along that line? Are we going to have a curriculum in place where no one ever fails, where there are no clear standards? It is vague, it is abstract and we have continuous movement through the education system with no sense of direction or purpose. Those are the sorts of directions coming out of the SACE review I would like the minister to comment on.
We need more rigour in the curriculum. We need clearer standards. We need a defined structure in education so kids know exactly how they are going and we know how to report on their performance. We need a defined body of knowledge so that kids will know exactly what it is they are expected to learn and can be reported on whether they are actually achieving that. We need to strengthen our approaches in curriculum. Much has happened around our country and internationally in curriculum development. It is time we opened up our eyes and had a look around to see what is happening if we really care about our kids or the structure of our education system, if it is just rhetoric that we are worried about boys leaving the education system and having no engagement with meaningful employment. Is there a different approach? Have a look at Victoria. They have a different approach. They have two levels of certificates. I reckon you, minister, should have a look at what they are doing down there. There is one level of certificate that is particularly attracting boys. It is more practical and technical in its focus, and it is for the senior secondary component. That is the sort of thing we need to do; get rigour there and make sure that we have the capacity to engage our students in a meaningful way, particularly boys.
There are many opportunities to come in regard to the outcomes-based approach and how we can improve our curriculum framework. Sadly, this government has not permitted this debate to be conducted within those realms. It is, basically, this: ‘We will now talk about where the kids will go to school next year, not so much about what they will do when they get there. Communities, tell us what you think’.
Once those thoughts have been analysed and dissected by Cabinet with their crowd of minders and political spin doctors around them to manipulate the position so that it is politically advantageous, we will probably have an announcement. I only hope that the will of Territorians who have voiced their concern will be listened to.
To go back to your interjection, minister, that I said speed up, and am now saying slow down. I am asking you to phase in, to put the structure in place properly and move to the new equation. You do not necessarily have to change the structure. You have not raised that as a model for the community to respond to. You have given them a clear set of guidelines with which to operate their decision-making process. You have not included the alternative of keeping the system as it is and just strengthening delivery to the middle years of schooling within our current structure. That is something I support.
Ms CARNEY: Madam Speaker, I move that the member for Blain be granted an extension of time pursuant to Standing Order 77.
Motion agreed to.
Mr MILLS: Thank you. With those working plans there is more to say on this issue. However, the fact is that we are being asked to focus on an issue that is the creation of this minister and this government, and their decision to implement in 2007 a proposition that I and the CLP wholeheartedly reject. I ask the minister to do this in a timely way, not for the sake of being cautious about making decisions, but doing it properly.
We are building a new structure, we are putting a new system in place and, as the minister has said on many occasions, nothing happens in education until it happens in the classroom to a student. If we take it from that perspective, I have not heard much of that. There has been a bit of rhetoric, but I have not heard of that being demonstrated in the consultation that has occurred, nor the care that has been taken in the managing of this process of change. Why is it that other states have taken up to seven years to phase in a change like this and this government has chosen to do it in just months?
It is beyond me; it is reckless in the extreme. I urge members of Cabinet to take great heed of what the community is saying. Do not dismiss them. Do not go out there and listen to the bloke in the street who says: ‘Yes, go for it’. Inquire if they really understand what is happening. Is there a separation between these two issues? Yes, fine, improve and strengthen the approach that is already occurring to change the system in nine months time - no, that is not the way to go. Coming ready or not is too risky.
Mr HENDERSON (Business and Economic Development): Madam Speaker, I am pleased to support the minister for Education in his statement. I will preface my comments by saying I contribute to this debate as an elected member of this parliament and a minister in this government. I contribute my own views and conclusions in regards to what is being proposed here as a father of three children, one of whom is currently in Year 7 at Nightcliff Primary School. He is going to be caught up in this, as is my 8-year-old and 5-year-old in whatever change takes place next year. I contribute to this debate considering my responsibilities as a member of parliament and also as a parent who is passionately involved in my children’s education.
When you initially read through everything the member for Blain, the shadow spokesperson for education, said in 30 minutes and boil it all down, I think this is where the debate is coming to: everyone agrees that better focus on Years 7 to 9 is something we should be doing. There is a debate about the time and the implementation of the change. I agree with the member for Blain that it is a good thing that we do have our community engaged in a debate about education. That is a very positive thing that is happening right now.
I say at the outset - and I am sure other people on the government side will comment in their contributions to the debate - the policy motivation for the government in going down this road is to get better outcomes for our students. First and foremost, that is the policy motivation of the government - to get better outcomes for our students through the education system. It is not about individual schools, individual teachers or groups of teachers; it is about a systemic change that is going to see better outcomes for our students in the Northern Territory. When we have seen the benchmarks as to how our secondary schools are performing compared to South Australia - and I take the Education minister’s comments that South Australia is under-performing in relation to the other states - then all the evidence we have seen is that our secondary schools do not even perform to the average of South Australia, and South Australia is beneath the average performance of the other states.
There is no doubt in my mind that we can and should do better. That is the motivation of the government in going down this path. The allegation was made that we are driven by some blind ideology to some unnamed structure imported from - heaven forbid - those terrible Australians who happen to live outside of the Northern Territory’s borders and what the heck would they know about anything because they do not live here in the Territory. There is no blind adherence to a particular model that we are seeking to import from elsewhere. What we are seeking to do is get better outcomes for our students in the Northern Territory.
We are talking about investing in our education system. Already, this is a government that has seen significant investment in our education system. It is - and I stand corrected - about a 28% increase in the DEET budget. We have spent tens of millions of dollars in capital to upgrade our schools across the Northern Territory. We met our election commitment from 2001 to employ an additional 100 teachers throughout the Northern Territory to get better outcomes. We have invested significantly in enterprise agreements to ensure that our teachers are amongst the best paid in Australia. In February 2005, the minister announced a $42m plan over four years to improve secondary education in the Territory. Therefore, this is not about blind ideology to some structure and process that is being imported from somewhere else with a motivation to close schools; this is about a government that is absolutely, seriously committed to investing in our secondary education system and seeing better outcomes from our students.
Of that $42m the government is committing to secondary education over the next four years, $15.37m is going to improving secondary students’ learning. All of these documents are on the web site: more funding for vocational education and training to expand career choices; providing assistance to schools to resource students’ learning needs so we get specific monitoring of students as they go through the system; and qualified counsellors and career advisors in all secondary schools that had been ripped out years ago, vital to support our students in determining the pathways they are going to take in their post-secondary schooling.
There is another $15.84m invested over four years in the bush to ensure indigenous people are better able to access a quality secondary education. The crocodile tears from the CLP, who put their hands on their hearts and say: ‘We are passionate about education’ – that was a government that had a policy agenda for many years not to provide secondary education to indigenous students who lived in the bush. You could have a primary education but if you wanted a secondary education you had to come to town.
Dr Lim: You just came out of the woodwork.
Mr HENDERSON: The legacy of that is going to hang around the Territory’s neck for many years, and it is an absolute shame. It will be interesting to hear the comments from the member for Greatorex if he is going to speak in this debate. Regarding educating the Territory’s population, why did the CLP have a policy position not to provide secondary education to indigenous students who lived in the bush? You say you are passionate about education. There is much history that tells how passionate you were about educating indigenous students in the bush.
There is an extra $15.8m over the next four years. There is an extra $5.4m to provide professional support to teachers. I have been around; I have spoken to all of my schools. I have met with a delegation from Casuarina Senior College and anybody who has wanted to speak with me about these issues. I am totally engaged with the schools in my electorate. I believe our teachers and our education system do a fabulous job; they deserve our support. There is additional funding to provide additional professional support to our teachers who are going to have to carry the change in whatever form it eventuates.
An extra $3.19m goes to get better links between schools and their communities. It is absolutely vital that, as we move forward, we do have better links between schools, communities and, very importantly, parents of children in our schools. There is an extra $1.87m into improving the Distance Education service. So, we are not on some blind ideological crusade here. We are actually seeking to significantly invest in our secondary education system to obtain better outcomes.
We also know that, whichever of the models is determined, there is going to be a significant capital component required, but it is hard to put your finger on that until you make a decision in regards to the model. That is the motivation for government. I have had representation. I have also sought out opinion from leaders in my electorate, and can say that there is a wide diversity of opinions out there. There are people who are opposed to structural change, who believe that the principles of middle schooling can be applied within the existing structures of keeping the Year 7s in primary schools, and Year 8 and 9s with Year 10, 11, 12s, essentially maintaining the status quo. Their argument is you provide better focus on those students. I can understand that, but I can also comprehend that if you bring those groups of students together with specific teaching programs and methodologies and really focus on those kids, it makes sense to me as a parent. There is no doubt there is a group of people out there with that view.
Similarly, there is another strong group of people out there who believe that those students in Years 7, 8 and 9 should be brought together in a group, either specifically on discrete campuses, or campuses within high school structures. Amongst the teaching community in my electorate - and I have primary schools and also Dripstone High, which I will not steal from the member for Casuarina; it is actually in his electorate - and, talking to teachers, there are people on both sides of the debate who are very committed to their point of view.
Within any debate on significant cultural and structural change within any organisation, I go back to my management theory training: there is 20% of any group within an organisation that is facing significant change - and particularly cultural change - who will champion that change and be change agents and leaders and very supportive. There are 20% of people in any organisation who are very resistant to change and look for any reason whatsoever to argue against change because they are comfortable with the status quo. That is not to say that their view is wrong. That is just how organisations work. There are about 60% of people in the middle who will go along with change, who are influenced by the debate, but are not passionately committed one way or the other.
People who are opposing this change are out there loud and strong. However, I see in my electorate and the people I talk to, there is also a large group of people who are very supportive of this change but have many questions about it. That is fine, as I have confidence in the minister that when decisions are made those issues will be sorted through.
The middle years approach - looking at teaching and learning, school leadership, relationships and community partnerships, organisational structures and resource allocation - is a complex web to work through. I am confident that our community is supportive in the plan to focus on these students.
I will take the indulgence in debate here tonight to look at it as a parent. Looking at my children and their performance in the system, I have absolutely no fear of my 11-year-old next year moving to a middle school structure. I believe, as a parent, in any systemic change that provides greater focus on a cohort of students in better supporting them and getting better outcomes from them as they progress through that stage of schooling. Any systemic change that looks to better support those students in a structural and professional teaching way, to me, as a parent, has to be a good thing. I do not see what the fear is in that. I certainly respect other people to hold another point of view but, as a parent, I can only see that this is going to be a good thing for my kids as they move through the public education system. Some people might say I am nave, but I have an entitlement to my point of view as a parent, and I have no fear of the change that is being proposed.
When you boil all this down, the opposition is seeing a political opportunity - and good luck to them - to get out there and say this all needs to be slowed down and we are rushing this change through. As the minister said, this debate started in 2002. We are four years into it now. If we do not start making change soon, how long are we going to wait? Another one, two, three years? That is another group of kids who come through who do not achieve to the extent that they should achieve and we owe our students better.
All of us here have recognised that change is required. If we keep this focus on those students then we have a responsibility as leaders and community to ensure that those kids achieve to the best of their ability. Delaying change for a significant period of time, when everybody in this debate recognises that the status quo is not providing for our students, is time wasted with further students who slip through the net not achieving to the extent that they could achieve.
No decisions have been made on those structures. I have every confidence in my colleague, the minister, to bring back the full range of sentiment that has come from our community. I thank each and every one of those Territorians who have taken the time to attend public meetings, make representation to their MLAs, or who have made submissions to the web site. We will be considering all of those issues that have been proposed. I also say to everybody who has taken the time to attend meetings and make submissions, whether it is through school councils or other profession groups, they will all be considered. I have given a commitment to the schools in my electorate that I will take their decisions and their resolutions into the Cabinet room and put them forcefully with the sentiments that are behind those resolutions.
Madam Speaker, at the end of the day, whatever the decision is, I can assure all Territorians who are looking to this debate and who might read what I am saying here in this parliament: the only motivation that we have as a government, passionately supported by the minister for Education, is to get better outcomes for our students. That is what is driving us in making these changes. I support the minister in his statement.
Ms CARNEY (Opposition Leader): Madam Speaker, picking up on something the member for Wanguri said about political opportunity. Yes, there is a political opportunity here and it is one that I would have thought the Labor Party would embrace wholeheartedly. The political opportunity is to be receptive to the electorate. The opportunity for the minister and his colleagues is to slow down.
We all know, as the member for Wanguri said, that there is a certain percentage of people in pretty much any group who are resistant to change. The question has to be asked: how do you work with that? What you do is you take people along with you. The minister has said on a number of occasions that the consultation has been going on for some time, either from 2002 or 2003. Indeed, some consultation has been going on from that time. The consultation has been in relation to middle schooling. It is disappointing to say the least that the minister is confusing middle schooling with the middle schools models. You can still have middle schooling without causing massive disruption to students, particularly in Darwin. You can still have middle schooling without doing that. You can still even have middle schooling and middle schools but only over or after a period of time, and only with the support of parents, teachers and students. I would have thought with all of the resources on the fifth floor of Parliament House that the government would have to be receptive to what the community is saying.
Yes, we all know that middle schooling has support. What does not have support is so many of the models. That is why other schools have come up with their own models. Also what does not have support is the way in which it is being rushed through. The minister for Education is on the public record when he said in this House last sittings that the changes would be implemented across the board in the Territory in 2007 - his words, not mine. The decision at that stage appeared to have been well and truly made. We heard from the contributions this afternoon that they would listen to what the community was saying. I hope for the community’s sake that the government does listen. I note that the member for Wanguri said that he would go into the Cabinet room and put forward the issues raised by the school councils in his electorate. You would have to say that, on the basis of that and that alone, we would expect Cabinet to slow down, so as not to immediately implement all of these models at the beginning of the school year in 2007.
In typical fashion, we saw the Education minister back pedal just a little recently when he mumbled something along the lines of: ‘Well, there are some infrastructure difficulties and they probably would not need to be done in 2007’. There is a reason for that. It is because the government has just about run out of money. It is noteworthy that when we are looking at these changes, we need to be very mindful of the person driving them. Many people I have spoken to, teachers and parents in particular - Labor members and supporters, and I do not mean members of this parliament but Labor Party members - have told me that they believe it is not the department who is driving this, it is the minister. They genuinely believe this, and I was somewhat astonished when a number of people said it to me. People who know the minister very well on a personal basis believe that the minister does want to leave his mark on education. I suppose if you are a minister of the Crown, you have a fantastic opportunity to make your mark for good in the Northern Territory. However, there is a difference between making your mark for the benefit of the community and making your mark just for the sake of making your mark before you knock off and go fishing.
It is particularly noteworthy that this is the same minister who is the Treasurer, who is taking us toward unprecedented debt in the Northern Territory - the same bloke who thinks that a $4bn debt for Territorians is a good thing and who will not be able to deliver on so many of the promises because he has blown the money he has already received. This is the same man who wanted to sell the Territory Insurance Office. This is a minister who has form. Also, in relation to the middle schools proposal, the details are similar to the TIO decision - not a word. Not a word before the election however many months ago it was. He was very quiet on the proposed sale of the TIO, and on the details which he must have known then on middle schools, but he elected not to say anything. This minister has been disingenuous with the Territory community. In typical Labor fashion, they make sure they win and win at any cost and then say words to the effect of: ‘Oh, we forgot to tell you that we wanted to do this and we wanted to do that’. If the minister is going to do the decent thing and listen - and he has assured us today that he will - then there can only be one thing: he must slow down. He must front the Territory community and say it does not all need to happen in 2007.
It will happen in 2007, in my view, because there is a series of electoral factors driving this decision. That is to have it bedded down, done and dusted, well before the Northern Territory election in 2009. Given that this minister has form, I would like to think that he would be somewhat reflective in the way he has conducted himself in the last eight to 10 months, and that he may have learnt a lesson or two. It is appalling that the minister continues to come into the parliament - and, indeed, outside the parliament as well - and deliberately confuses the issue of community support for middle schooling with his plan to install middle schools across the board in 2007. People are not that stupid, minister; they know what you are doing. I regard your conduct as contemptuous of teenage students. You are further contemptuous of them if you think that they have not picked the difference between middle schooling and middle schools.
As I have said, there is no doubt that there is community support for middle schooling and, partly, that is because the government consulted the hell out of pretty much everyone from 2003. Therefore, you would say there is widespread support for middle schooling. It was interesting during Question Time today when the minister said that he did not go to the community forums because he thought he would be a target. I believe that government ministers are paid handsomely to take a bit of heat on occasion. It is the height of cowardice not to have the guts to turn up and present yourself front and centre at a community forum which is being driven by you, and take the heat. The minister for Education will be measured, and is being measured, by many people for his conduct and his inability to bring himself to front a few hundred angry people. People have said: ‘Where is the minister?’ I note with interest that the member for Sanderson, in a radio interview 10 days or so ago, said: ‘At the same meeting I was at, members and ministers were all there’. No, they were not, Madam Speaker.
Mr Kiely: No, that is untrue, read the transcript. You are doing it again.
Ms CARNEY: No, they were not. There were only two politicians there. One was the member for Sanderson and the other one was the member for Araluen. It typifies the dishonest and disingenuous way this is being packaged by the Australian Labor Party and their spin support team.
I am, and I know a number of people are, particularly troubled about the fact that no mention of any of the details were mentioned before the election. Perhaps, at the next election …
Mr Stirling: We have only talked about it for three years.
Ms CARNEY: The minister is scoffing, but I defy him to show me or any other Territorian details of the proposals that were circulated to anyone outside this building about the very models he calls his own, that he wants to thrust upon the school system in the Northern Territory.
The fact is - and I say it again - that he has been disingenuous in the extreme. I also say again that this is a man who has form. By way of a digression, but an important one nevertheless, he has form when it comes to closing the Irrkerlantye school in Alice Springs - and weren’t the people there taken for a ride? And don’t they believe that they were taken for a ride! I have met with them. I do not know whether the minister has. I know he is very good at sending out little emissaries on his behalf. There is palpable anger in Alice Springs about Irrkerlantye. There is also palpable anger in Alice Springs about some politician from Darwin coming up with a ‘one size fits all’ model and imposing it from Darwin on Alice Springs.
I have one of the two affected schools in my electorate: Alice Springs High School commonly known as ASHS, there is also ANZAC Hill High School. I have had representations from people there as well. It is fair to say that my phone has been ringing hot. Bells are ringing in terms of the campaign that preceded the minister doing a backflip with pike on TIO. We all know the issues because we all receive e-mails and look at our faxes and take our phone calls. You know when something is hitting.
For the member for Wanguri to say this is political opportunism, surely he does not suggest that we, as politicians, do not respond and represent those around us? If that is what he is suggesting then we should all pack up and go home. What on earth are we here for? Absolutely, we represent the people around us. When I have constituents coming to me with an issue, I do not hide under the desk like the minister does. I am prepared to stand up, earn my money - every cracker of it - to say in this House and outside what those people want me to say. As long as people want me to say things that are not offensive or absurd, I will continue to do my job, and happily so.
In relation to Alice Springs High School - and people are saying that this seems to have escaped the minister’s attention - the fact is ASHS implemented middle schooling many years ago - for about the past seven years. As a result, they have developed a very effective way of dealing with the many social and student welfare issues which have affected the way in which students engage in schooling and in their school generally. Attendance figures are good, results are good, when you look at the aims of some of the programs - and if the minister does not know the details of ASHS, then he should. There is not enough time to go into all the details; however the outcomes for students at ASHS for a couple of years are worth quoting.
In 2005, 17 students were enrolled in a Year 12 program: four completed NTCE; two are continuing; two students transferred to Centralian College; five were helped into employment; three of those into apprenticeships; and one moved to Darwin and did not complete. That is a pretty good outcome for Year 10 students at Alice Springs High School. In 2004, 16 students enrolled in the Year 12 program: six received their NTCE; seven commenced full-time employment, including four apprenticeships; two left the Northern Territory; and one is a proud mum.
Therefore, for the minister to assert both here and elsewhere that things are just not working in Alice Springs shows a lack of understanding of what it is that school aims to do. Not every school can be focused on university studies, for instance. Some schools - and ASHS is one of them - have a holistic program and a series of initiatives that cater to their students. The minister, some time ago publicly, had a go at the teachers, calling them selfish, and some other word I have forgotten now. He got stuck into the teachers …
Dr Lim: Mean-spirited.
Ms CARNEY: Mean-spirited, thank you, member for Greatorex. The teachers were none too impressed, and rightly so, because it shows the lack of understanding by not just a member of parliament, not just an ordinary punter, but the minister for Education in the Northern Territory - the same bloke who wants to impose massive changes on these people. I believe that is the height of bad manners and rudeness.
I also think in relation to ANZAC Hill High School - which is not in my electorate, as some of us take the view that there are no electoral boundaries that really exist in Alice Springs – that it is the height of arrogance and shows the lack of knowledge by the minister for Education, demonstrated by his indication 10 or so days ago that, yes, he should probably visit - a request, as I understand it, that has been made for nearly 12 months. He has demonstrated a failure to understand what that school is about and the magnificent services it provides, not just to students and parents, but to the people of Alice Springs. I will quote from some minutes of a school council meeting:
- ANZAC Hill High School is a bicultural school with a significant portion of students with very difficult backgrounds that is rarely acknowledged by government …
Their words not mine:
- … and we have never been inundated with resources or support for the teachers to assist with this situation. The one advantage we do have is the small size of our school.
They go on to say that it means that their deputy principal and other teachers probably know the name of every student in the school. There is very little chance of students getting lost or falling through the net. In relation to Year 10s, they say that it is an area where, in light of the minister’s comments, they cannot help but feel insulted on behalf of the school or the staff, which has put enormous effort into Year 10 as a transition to employment or higher education. That speaks volumes, minister. These teachers and, in particular, the members of the school council, are insulted by what you have dished up to them in recent months.
At ANZAC Hill High School, students already access VET and Year 11 subjects at Centralian College. It is very successful. I take the view, minister, that when the teachers, parents and members of the school council say this is very successful, that I should actually listen to them. I suggest that you should do the same. The staff at ANZAC Hill High School believe that if students are pushed into senior college in Year 10 many will simply drop out. Surely …
Mr Stirling: You just told me they go to Centralian now.
Ms CARNEY: What an interesting admission. The minister still does not understand. They go over to Centralian College to do some of their subjects. What an amazing admission and, by golly, I will send it to the people at ANZAC Hill High School. The minister does not even understand that they just go over to Centralian College to do some subjects. They are based at ANZAC Hill school; that is their school at the bottom of Anzac Hill in Alice Springs. I am sure one of your minders will be able to find the address to take you there when your arrival - which is anxiously anticipated - will be received with a wide range of feelings. Some will be anger, some will be frustration, some people will be chuffed that you actually bothered to turn up, unlike the community forums.
In any event, the staff at ANZAC Hill High School believe that if students are pushed into senior college in Year 10 many will simply drop out. This is not a good outcome. The school council goes on to say Year 10 students are 15 and 16 years old, some are very mature and some are not. The confident, the academic and the mature will survive and move to Centralian College. If you need a lesson on what Centralian College does, I will be happy to explain it to you later. Their concern is that kids will drop out. I would have thought for a bloke who says that he cares about achieving better outcomes in education, that he would actually be concerned about the prospect of people dropping out. I take the view that members of the school council of ANZAC Hill High and others actually know what they are talking about. Clearly, you have a different view.
The students in Alice Springs have, at this stage, a choice in terms of government education. We know that there is St Phillip’s and OLSH, and there are two public schools. I have seen members of the Australian Labor Party on the other side of this Chamber change their views somewhat on just about everything since they have come to office. If there was one thing I did not think they would change their personal and collective views on was that it is important to have choices in education. It is something that the CLP believes in. The way members of the Australian Labor Party wear their hearts on their sleeves, I know some of you do feel very strongly about having choices in education. If you close ANZAC Hill High there will be, for the non-private sector, no choice as to a government school. Do members of the Labor Party sanction that as a good outcome? How can you possibly sanction that? I bet that is not in your Labor Party platform and I bet it was not in your minds before you got elected only a few months ago. You should be ashamed.
Madam SPEAKER: Leader of the Opposition your time has expired.
Mrs BRAHAM (Braitling): Madam Speaker, I will be talking mainly to the situation in Alice Springs because that is what I know best. Let me say right from the start that, yes, I do support middle schooling. I have seen it implemented in Victoria and other states quite successfully and, obviously, in Alice Springs. However, I remind the minister that any change needs to be dealt with, with careful planning and good communication. Change management is a skill and I am sure the minister understands that, particularly being a former teacher himself.
I am not quite sure why the minister has taken the approach he has. It is almost as though he has taken it very personally that there has been some criticism of the proposals. The consultant went around and put forward models and, if people reacted to those models, surely that was the intent of the consultation. The minister should realise that it is not a personal attack on him. It is just people’s emotional reaction to something that they think is going to disrupt their children’s schooling.
I was surprised when he reacted to my press release which, in fact, was quite innocuous, basically stating a few concerns. I will tell the House what happened in Alice Springs. In 1987, we split into two junior high schools and Sadadeen Secondary was established for Years 11 and 12. We had Years 8, 9 and 10 from 1987. In 1994, the Year 7s from the primary school went into the junior high schools.
Possibly at that time, there should have been a change Territory-wide, but it did not occur. I think it occurred in Alice Springs partly based on accommodation reasons, rather than educational, but it was probably a good move. When these Year 7s went into the middle school or the junior highs as we called them, the teachers found they had to change their teaching styles. They found they had to change the way they treated these young Year 7s. However, it worked, and the two junior high schools – small though they are – have tried very hard to give their students the education that they required.
In my press release, I said I am concerned about the Year 10s going to Centralian College and that I did not think it was the best option. I also said that I did not think it was a good option to combine the two junior high schools into one because it has always been my personal belief and my experience that small is better because it brings back that more personal relationship. When Alice Springs High School had over 1000 students, we had problems. We had discipline and gang problems. Students tend to become a number and you can be in a school that size and hardly any teachers will even know where you are.
Therefore, minister, I was a bit surprised when you reacted the way you did. That is what caused a lot of angst within Alice Springs because your press release said that my release was incorrect and irresponsible: ‘Alice Springs Senior School results are poor. The system has not worked for 20 years. The system is failing local students and families. The two high schools are operating on less than half their capacity’ and so on. You received a very strong reaction to that because, as an educational leader, one thing you should not do is keep putting your schools down. If you want to build up their self-esteem and confidence, you try to concentrate on the good things. I thought it was highly unprofessional for the minister to turn around and bag them publicly.
In February, you said it is all very well for me to stand up and tell you to listen and asked why I don’t listen myself. Well, I have and I have been to numerous meetings, on talkback radio, and received letters - the usual things we all get within our electoral office. We have created a bit of a monster by looking as though we are not going to give people a choice, because choice is probably the one thing parents really want for their children. It is amazing the way they choose between even the two junior high schools or the private upper secondary and the public upper secondary. Being a small town - and we are geographically much smaller than Darwin - we do tend to know each other much more than, perhaps, people in Darwin. Because of that close community, it is pretty easy to get ideas running across the community.
I notice the member for Araluen has spoken about what happens at ASHS. Year 10s from ANZAC Hill High School go across to Centralian College. The minister might say: ‘If they are going across, why don’t they stay there?’ There are about 60 students from ANZAC Hill who go to Centralian College. Some do Year 11 SACE subjects, others do the VET course. It is the VET courses which introduce them to hairdressing, tourism and hospitality, metal fabrication, the motor mechanics’ course, etcetera. This is a great way to do that transition, to ease them in to those types of end points that they may have in their life.
It is interesting that the Year 10s go in two groups: one group go from 8 am to 10.30 am; another group go from 1 pm to 4 pm. Centralian College runs an 8 am to 5 pm timetable. Even the Year 11s and 12s find that difficult at times. As one mum said to me the other day: ‘My child is not starting until 11 am’. I said: ‘What is he doing?’ She said: ‘He is home watching telly’. Another mum said: ‘My child has two free periods in the middle of day. I do not know what he does during that time’. Therefore, the length of that timetable creates difficulties even for the Year 11s and 12s until they really get motivated. For Year 10s that, to me, could be quite a difficult transition. The fact that some of the Year 10s are going to 4 pm means they are doing things within their own time already. That is great, because it is giving them that easing in to this particular type of timetable that the school runs.
However, I heard an interesting story the other day that the bus had not arrived to pick them up to take them back to the school. One of the Year 10s was asked: ‘Why didn’t you go into the office and get them to ring the school?’ They said: ‘We do not know these people in the office’. It just shows a little of their insecurity and immaturity when you take them out of a closed environment and put them in something new. Pastoral care has been the strength of the two junior high schools and the kids know each other so well.
We harp continuously about the lack of skilled people. If you try to get an electrician, we just do not have them. It was partly due, I suppose, to the fact that, for a couple of generations, we all wanted our kids to go to university. We all wanted them to have Year 10. We had that shift away from the trades over a couple of generations, and we are suffering because of it at the moment. I have no problems with a child doing a VET course in Year 10 and then leaving school at Year 10 or 11 and going into an apprenticeship.
The young girl in the hairdressing salon I go to started her hairdressing as a VET subject. By the time she started her apprenticeship, she was well on the way; she had that background knowledge. She had made her decision, that this is what she wanted to do. Therefore, let us not get hung up that every child needs Year 12. Let us offer them VET - Victoria has done it; they have gone into the manual arts. Let us encourage them to do that. However, it is not also necessary to change the system that is working well; that is producing the results we want in that VET area at the moment, just for the sake of change.
I am pleased the minister is going to Alice Springs. I believe you are going to be meeting with people on Sunday and you are visiting a school on Monday. That is good to hear. It is what people have been asking for, for a long time. I want you to have a really good look at the way the curriculum works in both those schools and see how they cater for the wide diversity of young children in our schools. It is also interesting that the philosophy of these two schools says they want to give the kids better literacy skills, and they concentrate fairly hard on doing that.
If you look at the model of the Restart initiative which started in Victoria in 2002, it was to employ additional teachers to raise the literacy levels of Year 7 students and upward. We are not the only place that says our Year 7s are coming into high school without the required literacy levels. It found that this Restart program reduced the disparity in the literacy achievements, and that students did catch up. They concentrated on boys and on the Koori students who had quite lower levels of literacy. When you know that many people and schools around Australia are experiencing a low level of literacy, and there are good programs to tackle this issue, let us put the resources in these programs to make them work, rather than make huge changes that we really do not know are the right thing to do.
There is much corporate knowledge lost in Alice Springs. I was talking to an ex-principal of Alice Springs High School when the high school was a comprehensive school. I know you have heard about the families in Alice Springs saying they want to have choice. We had a bad experience in those days with riots and gangs. Parents were saying very clearly that they wanted to have a choice, to be able to be kept separate. I know it sounds emotive and a bit of an inane argument, why should we bother listening to these parents who think this? However, to be honest, it is a very valid argument. Just a couple of weeks ago, I had to contact the police because we had a family feud going on in Alice Springs. Everybody here knows that if a family feud escalates, it does not just stay with two people fighting; it is the extended families fighting. That is what has happened. You can often see it at the bus interchange in Alice Springs. You have to be careful. Do not dismiss what might only seem to be an emotional argument about Aboriginal families saying, ‘keep us separate’. It is quite a valid point in Alice Springs and it is something we should really be thinking about.
Minister, you said in your statement that we were sniping. We are not sniping; we are trying to ease people’s concerns at the moment, to try to make them understand that we are pleased that you are suddenly saying this is a good school. I believe the fact that it has brought that out in parents and students is probably a plus for the few students concerned. I do not think they realised they had such huge support for what they are doing for the students until this rattled along and made them feel uncomfortable.
However, if you are logical, you will say: ‘Yes, middle schooling, we will do it. Any changes we will make, we will make in cooperation and consultation with the schools concerned and with the parents’. We need to think of the consequences of any actions we take, and the consequences in Alice Springs may be a shift to the private schools. For a town our size, it is incredible that we have had the options we have for parents. I believe it is great, and they do a good job. However, we must also look at the consequences of any changes that we are making. We need to get teachers on side to do that. We have some brilliant teachers in Alice Springs, I have to admit that. We have a couple of very dedicated principals who love their schools dearly. When you look around the Territory, many of those experienced principals, unfortunately, are retiring. We have certainly seen it in Alice Springs. We do not have that breadth of experience there any more. You must also make sure you take the schools with you.
I do not know, minister, why you have taken this abrupt approach. It is not like you. You are an old campaigner from way back …
Mr Stirling: I have been misrepresented, Loraine.
Mrs BRAHAM: Very true.
We know that you have a wise head, but I reckon somewhere you are getting the wrong advice. It is as simple as that. I reckon someone has given you the wrong advice. Even the member beside you will probably tell you that his children had troubles at time coping with that wide curriculum at Centralian College.
Minister, I want you to visit Alice Springs. I am glad you are going, and that is good. I want you to listen carefully and weigh up what the good things are. Do not only talk about outcomes because they are receiving outcomes, but the social benefits for our town. Social benefits are often just as great for us; things we do not want to avoid. Have a look at Centralian College. Is it equipped to take Year 10s? Will they really consider the needs of those Year 10 students, or will they just continue the way they are? Is it really resource-efficient to combine the two junior highs when they seem to be coping very well as they are? Will it cause them more problems? Do not forget the diversity of the children going to that school. It is probably the same in many other schools around the Territory; however, it is the closeness of the population and the fact we know each other so well that often brings us special problems.
My final point to you, minister, is that I know you are doing a review on truancy. People still ask me why we see many school-age students on our streets and in our shopping centres. This is something you should address. However, what worries me is if the Year 10s go racing off to Centralian College and they have free periods in the middle of the day, then they may wander off to the shopping centres and they never go back to school. You are putting on them a huge responsibility to change the way they attend school at the moment.
Let us say to our schools in Alice Springs that, yes, they are doing a good job. The results you are getting are, perhaps, not as good as we would like; however, they are not bad for the material you have. Remember, everyone is never meant to be this high in achievement. We have an average group of people in the middle; we have the high achievers; and we have the low achievers. That is the mix of the population; it is probably the mix of this House. We have to be realistic in what we can do. Please do not send the message that everyone has to do Year 12. Let us send the message that we would rather have everyone have a job at the end of the day.
Dr TOYNE (Justice and Attorney-General): Madam Speaker, from the outset I strongly support the middle school initiatives which have been put forward by our government. They are based on good evidence and experience right around the country and elsewhere. I commend the minister on his stand on the educational outcomes for the students.
Good public policy must always stand on an honest appraisal of what we are getting out of our system. If we do not start with some sticking point to which the reforms are addressed, then it turns into a very ill-directed process which we may launch ourselves into. What better sticking point to take than the guarantee of a better level of educational outcomes for our students in the secondary education system?
The current debate is, of itself, beneficial to our community. How much better is it for an honest and a robust debate to occur which starts by confronting the facts of the performance of our education system and, in particular, our secondary programs, than the ill-founded apathy that has often presided over recent times in education in the Northern Territory? The comfort zone that people have often lived in, whether they be parents or commentators on our educational system, and some of the teachers who speak about the schools, has served our community well. We have had to pull up and take a good hard look at what is actually coming out of our education programs and be honest about it.
It is not a case of offering criticism of individual teachers or schools; it is about acknowledging the facts of what the programs are producing. In my entire career in education, both here and in Victoria, it was always most important in professional practice to be very honest and objective about what the programs were producing; the programs to which you are contributing in professional practice. Without that, the rigour can drop away, and you have to face up to a legacy where you have not served the community or the students you are responsible for to the fullest ability and effect.
That, to me, is what is so important about this middle school process. We are pushing back on to the community a strong picture of what is coming out of our programs and we are collectively saying: what do we do about it? Is there a better way forward and, if there is, then what sort of details do we have to deal with together?
One of the things I would like to foreshadow is that I will be focusing on the consultations and issues that have emerged in Central Australia because that can be my particular contribution to this debate. From the outset, I would like to reiterate what the minister has already said in that there has to be a consistent target on this debate. I absolutely support what he is saying; that the target for this debate and the reforms that will follow it is to improve the educational outcomes of the students we have responsibility for, both as a government and the professional people who work in our education system.
It is not about who is yelling the loudest, or about opportunism and political gain; it is about which actions can be taken that have some evidence behind them that says that that action is likely to improve the educational outcomes. That is where we are trying to go with this. If we lose that focus in this process then we find that it does not have the ability to improve these outcomes that we all want.
In talking about the consultations and issues in Central Australia, I want to make it very clear that I do not want to pre-empt the final decisions that will be made. As other members of government have already said, this is still a work in progress. We have gone out to the communities to look at the detail of issues and opinions that the various schools, parents, and students have wanted to put forward to this process. Obviously, they will all be taken consideration in presenting the final options to government. There are those who will stand on a full analysis of those views. There have been other undertakings made earlier in this debate that we will be listening to everyone, we will be taking into account all of the issues that have been brought forward by teachers, by parents, by other community members who have a major interest in education.
The one thing that is set around this debate is that government has expressed its commitment to the middle schools model as the vehicle for reform. We are at a stage now where we have to take that general reform and start to put all the context around it for each part of the Northern Territory - and they are all different. On the face of it, you would have thought Alice Springs and Central Australia might have been closer to having already achieved the middle school model in the way that the schools are already operating there. However, there are issues and they have come to the fore and will be dealt with. However, we have the basis of our middle schools and the senior secondary programs already existing in the schools in Alice Springs.
Let us look at the context that this reform will have to address in Central Australia, as a means of identifying the issues that need to be put together if we are to finally shape reform in that area of the Territory. We have a very large participation of secondary age students in the private schools. It is pretty much 50:50 in the town; St Philip’s College and the Catholic high school take a very large proportion of the age group into their programs. They are choices that families and parents have made over a considerable period of time. I guess you could include Yirrara College in that for the indigenous students. There are questions about that. Is that just simply an acceptable evolution of where parents put their kids to receive their secondary education, or are there some issues in there in the context of this reform? Why has that happened and what can we do to make the government schools more attractive to more families?
All schools have the requirement that they attract a viable cohort of students from within the region, so it is crucial to us what drawing power the government schools have to be viable into the future, in competition with the private schools.
There are two high schools which are operating close to a middle school model, one of which extends student course work up to Year 12. The other, as we have heard earlier in this debate, sends their Year 10s to Centralian College to do some of their course work two days a week, and are operating very close to a middle school model with a good, existing relationship to the senior high school at Centralian College. That relationship is one that could be built on. Those two schools have taken two different strategies in catering to the needs of the students they are currently responsible for. What needs to be thought about is what led to those two different approaches and what that says about the reform process that we are going into.
Both ASHS and the ANZAC Hill High School have relatively small student numbers. It has some positives, as we heard from the member for Braitling, but it also has negatives in the diversity of subjects and teachers available to teach that student body. There are many studies around the world as to what constitutes a viable student and teacher population in a school. As I said, you have to balance the ability of the school to cater individually for the students’ background and needs, but you also have to provide an adequate range of subjects to student numbers that are not going to get beyond the teachers’ ability to teach effectively. Those issues still surround both ANZAC Hill High and ASHS, and will need to be part of the solution that may be adopted by government. Centralian College, the senior high school, hosts Year 10 students from ANZAC Hill High School.
It is a bit strange, the high level of concern being expressed by that school, and particularly the campus as a whole through the Charles Darwin University, as to what impact the Year 10 students would have on the school and their degree of maturity in handling learning in that particular environment. The fact is that it is already happening on a fairly wide basis. There are, obviously, lessons or evidence there that could inform the final decision on how students are going to be placed within the three campuses. Again, to have a measured and informed debate, we have to take those current arrangements as a starting point, because they all provide very strong and important evidence about the potential effect of different ways in which you could organise the schools into the future.
We also have to keep in mind the existence of hundreds - literally hundreds - of primary and secondary indigenous children and secondary-aged teenagers in Central Australia who do not attend a school program right now - whether they be in town or out bush. This group is one that we have already indicated we are going to give a very high priority to their re-engagement in education. That raises a series of capacity issues about what sort of secondary capacity we need, both in Alice Springs and the Central Australia region, to accommodate the full cohort of available students in the age groups, both primary and secondary. It is very important, particularly in making the decision about how many campuses we want to continue to operate in Alice Springs, according to the different options that have been suggested, as to how many students we are going to have to cater for into the medium-term future - certainly to the future which would give us enough time to address this non-attending school population of kids and teenagers which are of very significant proportions. We have a huge amount of work to do, both out bush and in town, to engage those kids in a meaningful way into the school programs, and to, obviously, subsequently accommodate them, both in the physical facilities and the teachers who are providing the programs.
Another factor that we need to be thinking about is the emergence of remote-based secondary programs in places such as Laramba, Yuelamu, Yuendumu and Ti Tree. There are some very strong programs starting to emerge in response to the encouragement that our government has given to the development of secondary programs catering to remote-based students. I believe that is something our government can take great credit for. There is no doubt, having organised and run secondary programs in the 1980s and early 1990s at Yuendumu, that the previous government, through the Education Department at that stage, was actively discouraging and holding back the development of remote secondary programs.
That is to their lasting shame, Madam Speaker. I know many of the young adults now who have gone into the community with a total denial of the skills and the employable skills that they should have as a basis to their lives. That is the legacy of not allowing, or actively discouraging and wiping out attempts by good teachers around many of our remote communities, to cater for the real needs of their students. That is not going to happen any more. These are factors that we need to keep very much in mind if we are talking about what sort of directions of reform we should be taking in secondary education in Central Australia.
There is a wide variety of diversity of needs amongst the students and potential students that secondary education will have to address in Central Australia. These are everything from differences in cultural backgrounds to the wide differences in existing academic skills - from almost non-existent skills through to able and talented students who should be getting accelerated programs to fully realise their potential. All of that exists within the student cohort and potential cohort within Central Australia. All of that has to be capable of being accommodated within these future arrangements for secondary education.
There is a very worrying low level of direct connection from school to work, and from school to tertiary education in Central Australia. I do not believe that it is unique to there. While the numbers the Leader of the Opposition quoted - I am very happy to hear that that group of kids have found apprenticeships or found placements within tertiary education - have a look three years before that. What was the cohort that led to 17 Year 12 students, or the number of students that moved from school into the apprenticeships, as she was quoting? The drop-out rate is absolutely unacceptable in students not going either into some serious vocational training with some real employable skills and employable future, or into tertiary education. What we are seeing is many of those students drop out very early and go into non-career jobs that are simply not leading sequentially anywhere over the course of their adult employment. We have much work to do to get allowable or acceptable levels of engagement into employment and into further education beyond what we are achieving at the moment.
There are quite a number of geographical and logistical issues about connecting up these different programs, one to the other. That is not only within the urban area of Alice Springs, but also to give some connection between the remote-based secondary programs and their urban counterparts. I do not think we can go on treating remote and urban educations as if they are two different systems. We have to make sure that remote-based secondary students can transition in a constructive way into taking up employment and other engagement within our urban centres, if that is their choice. I do not believe that it is properly respecting their future to only give them a future where all they know is the remote community lifestyle. Like many young adults out there, they give up on it. There is nothing there for them. There are no real education prospects and they do not have the skills to take up those prospects anyway.
I believe that is the past history of remote education. We have to get beyond that and start building this into a very powerful secondary delivery network leading very strongly into education and further education. If we do not get that out of these reforms, then we have fallen short of what needs to happen.
All of the options are on the table. The options were put in full to the Centralian community. I understand, from a document I saw a couple of days ago, that there has been further options proposed building on the current situation with the secondary programs in Alice Springs and Central Australia. That is a great sign that people have embraced it in a constructive way and they are putting forward additional ideas beyond the models that were suggested for discussion. I look forward to joining with the Centralian community in pursuing this debate through to finality and, even more importantly, to work constructively on the initiatives.
Madam Speaker, I commend the minister for bringing these very important reforms forward to the community. Unlike the opposition, I cannot wait to get on with it.
Mr VATSKALIS (Primary Industry and Fisheries): Madam Speaker, I state from the very beginning that I support the minister. Let me describe to you my experience with education. I grew up in another culture; another country. I recall that primary school was Year 1 to Year 6, followed by high school from Year 7 to Year 12. In the last two years of primary school, we spent an enormous amount of time learning to write essays and to conduct a mathematics exercise, memorising history and geography. At 11 years old, you had to sit exams to enter high school - exams in mathematics, geography, history, religious studies and essays. That was an enormous pressure for a young 11-year-old. If you did not sit the exams, you could not go to any school. You had to become an apprentice at the age of 11 years old.
I remember very well when I walked into the high school on the first day and realised we were going from a system where we had one teacher throughout the year all the time and, all of a sudden, we had a different teacher every lesson. Every day, we had about seven different teachers and that was a shock to the system. However, the system changed in Greece. They introduced the system of middle schools, and then they went further with senior high schools. If you were an academic person and you wanted to go to university, you could follow an academic stream at senior high school.
Not everybody is the same, as the member for Braitling said. Some people are academic, some are better with their hands or with the way they are thinking; they want to become tradesmen. You could follow a trade. There was a senior high school like a TAFE, and others could continue to have a vocation at tertiary school.
When I came to Australia, and to the Territory in particular, we were surprised the Territory had this peculiar system of Year 1 to 7 at primary school, then comprehensive high schools, and a senior college, Year 11 and 12 only. In Western Australia and other states, there was nothing like that; it was totally different.
I come from a family of teachers. My wife is a high school teacher; her father was a primary school principal; and her mother was a teacher. Many times we discussed elements of education and how well or badly kids do. I was especially surprised when my wife came back from school shaking her head, trying to teach science in Year 8 or Year 9 when they could not even write their names, or read, or finish a mathematical equation. I was very surprised. What was the level of education we provide for our kids? Were we giving the best education?
I was not surprised when this secondary education review came back and said that things are not as good as they should be and we have to do something quickly. I was very supportive of the secondary education review. I recall sitting in Cabinet and talking with my colleagues about having to do something. There was no option to sit down and do a little today and a little tomorrow; we have had to do something radical. Of course, some people may say a courageous decision, minister. However, I am really pleased that my colleague, the minister for Education, has taken that courageous decision to go down that path because, by taking that courageous decision, he has put in a benchmark for a really comprehensive education for future Territorians who will be running this Territory or state in the future - Territorians who will probably be sitting at the same desks we are sitting at today who will become the leaders of the community.
I know people are afraid of change. I have been to many forums in my electorate, to primary schools and high schools and many people express fear of the unknown: ‘What is going to happen to my children?’ Also: ‘I do not like my child changing school. I do not like my child going from what it is now, which served me and the older two children really well, to go to a junior high school or a middle school’.
However, the reason that the human race has survived and colonised the planet for so many thousands of years is because we are highly adaptable. We adapt to the change in the environment around us; not only the physical change, but also the emotional, the climatic, the political, and the economic changes. Today, if we are going to survive, we have to adapt to a changing world around us. We have to adapt to a new reality. We are talking about paradigms. We are trying to create a paradigm shift. We have had a system working for many years but, obviously, now it does not serve as well. We have to do something different, and the middle school approach is the way to go.
In my electorate, I have spoken to teachers, parents, and to principals. In my primary schools, there is support for middle schools and some primary schools already have started applying the principles of mid-schooling in Year 6 and 7. In other primary schools, teachers are looking forward to becoming teachers for middle schools because they can see there is a career pathway there, and also because they are dedicated teachers who love what they are doing - teaching children. They have realised the best way to serve those growing children is moving from the current situation to a new situation, and they think they are able to provide the teaching environment, a disciplined grounding, the emotional and teaching support to those children which is very important.
After the secondary review, I recall discussing with my wife the possibility of changes in middle schools. She told me that teachers at Dripstone High School had already started talking about the possible models that could apply to this particular high school in order to sell the changes in the education system. There are some teachers who had not wanted it to become a junior high school; other teachers said it would be served better to be a senior high school. Within the education community, there was debate about possible models that could be implemented to serve the proposed change by the government.
The other question, of course, for the parents is: is it going to work? The minister said that we are going to see outcomes in five years; that is a typical example. If you start a health program today you are not going to get real outcomes until a certain period of time passes. You cannot say: ‘I am going to put fluoride in the water and within six months I will tell you if it is successful or there are no cavities in the teeth’. You cannot say: ‘I am going to do a mass immunisation and within one year come back and say everything is fine’. You have to give it time to progress and, after passing a period of time, evaluate the effects to find out if you have some real positive outcomes.
It is really unfortunate that the opposition has found a fertile ground to start a misinformation campaign and to scare the parents. I know very well that the opposition members attended many of these forums - and quite rightly so. We are politicians, as the Leader of the Opposition said. Our role is to listen to the community, and that is exactly what I did. I attended forums in our electorates with the member for Wanguri, and we made sure that we conveyed to the government all the information we obtained from these forums.
I had a look at the recent release by the opposition of their plan on reform in education and middle school for Years 7 to 10 and Years 11 and 12. A question regarding this was: is it a good idea? The response was that it was not a good idea. Mid-schooling is actually Years 7, 8, and 9. The reason for that is that this is the time that the kids are coming out of primary school, and they have to be supported emotionally and educationally to form the basis for moving to the senior high school and then to university. The example was given to me by my wife who said: ‘When our son was in school, if he was not in a senior high school as it was then, he would be unable to get some of the Year 11 units to study when he was in Year 10’. Therefore, Year 10 for him would be a lost year because he could not access some of the Year 11 units to study’.
The other question we heard from the parents was: ‘Is it working, will it work? There has been failure in other states; in America it did not work’. This may be true but, on having a look at some of the literature which is around, and a special report which was drafted by Rod Chadbourne from Edith Cowan University on behalf of the Australian Education Union in 2001 about mid-schooling for the middle years, in one of the chapters he posed the question: ‘What evidence is there that middle schooling works? He stated that Australia does not have a lot of evaluation results of mid-schooling. Some curricula programs applied in Western Australia, which incorporated middle schooling principles, have been quantitatively assessed:
- One such program is Stepping Out, a literary resource developed in Western Australia for middle and secondary schools. Trials of Stepping Out took place in 158 government schools over a five-year period. Evaluations of the program found that its strategies benefited all students, particularly low achievers, ESL/NESB students and students with learning difficulties ...
- … experience of other countries should not be ignored. In the USA, numerous longitudinal and quantitative studies have shown that middle schooling does improve student learning outcomes. For example:
‘Students scores on standardised tests of mathematics, language arts and reading achievement
increased significantly’ ...
The same program:
- … achieved improvement ‘well above the state norm in the use of effective instructional approaches, including the use of math manipulatives and extended writing assignments, and eight-grade students were taking algebra at a significant higher rate than the state average’ ...
gains in seventh-grade reading scores (+10 percent), and substantial gains in seventh-grade maths scores
(+6 percent) … on state tests’ ...
There is evidence around the world, and in Australia, which shows that middle schools are working. What he points out is that significant and sustaining improvement of student educational outcomes is difficult to achieve if schools introduce only some elements of middle schooling; that is, middle schooling should be produced comprehensively and holistically, rather than in half measures.
Middle schooling does work; however, it is how you apply it. Nobody from the other side would argue that mid-schooling is not a good program and it will have positive results. The concerns regarding how we do it - do we rush it all together, or do we do it slowly? - is something that the minister has considered. In his statement, he said that Palmerston will be unable to construct the infrastructure in 2007; however, we implement the program in 2007 and students will start moving in 2008.
The government has not made a decision yet about different models. We have looked at a number of models and have invited people to put their own models in place. They will be assessed and then the government will make a decision about the applicability of the most suitable model to implement a middle schooling program.
I am a strong supporter of mid-schooling, and a strong supporter of education - full stop. We have an obligation to provide comprehensive and good education to our young Australians. I always recall something which a friend of mind - who was a refugee - told me about the urban myth that the Vietnamese who came in boats were carrying with them a lot of gold; that is why they established so quickly in Australia. Of course, I asked him the same thing: ‘Did you carry money and gold with you when you came?’ He said: ‘No, Kon, I did not carry any gold. What I carried with me was my education. Gold can be lost, stolen, misplaced, or spent, but education is something that I will have with me forever’.
Madam Speaker, as I said before, we have to give the utmost to education, because education is something that will be with them forever.
Dr LIM (Greatorex): Madam Speaker, I join in this debate to share with the minister some of the community consultation that he missed. I have spoken many times on education, and indigenous education - issues that the member for Stuart says that the CLP never provided. I believe the CLP had nothing to be ashamed of in what we tried to do within the resources that we had in education.
However, the minister failed to attend any of the community consultations across the Territory, as it was so confronting for him, and so conflicting for him. Then he comes along and says: ‘Oh well, we are still consulting, we have not made up our minds’, but he is going to do this and do that. Where he is with it, I am not sure. It sounds like he has made up his mind already but, irrespective of that, he is going to tell everybody he is still consulting. If he is still consulting, then let me tell him what I heard when I attended the community consultation that was held at Centralian College a couple of weeks ago.
The meeting started with Socom introducing the topic, providing fairly motherhood-type statements on the screen, and asking: ‘Do you agree with those things?’ Obviously, nobody disagrees that we ought to have good outcomes for our kids; everybody agrees with that. Everybody says we have to get the best education that money can buy for our children. The minister said: ‘Oh, well, this is what we want to do’. So do we.
The member for Casuarina said the man tells him that he will carry his education with him because that is the one thing that nobody can take away from him. They can take his gold away and all sorts of things.
When the consultation opened at Centralian College, one of the first people who commented from the public was, in fact, Des Rogers. His opening question was: ‘Is this about cost saving, rather than educational outcomes?’ - shifting the deck chairs, he said. Des was very much interested in pushing for the preservation of ANZAC Hill High School, and says that ANZAC Hill High School has the best practice that he is aware of. There was concern that the government was rushing too fast in this process and not listening to people. A teacher from Centralian College said the staff were very apprehensive about what is happening; that there was no frame of reference. This is a teacher who, supposedly, was involved in the workshops that the minister said have been held across the Territory - professional development that he provided with lots of funding. Obviously, this teacher must have missed out. This same teacher said: ‘It seems like it is a fait accompli’, and that the infrastructure was not ready. How does the school try to timetable the classes using the whole day at Centralian College? Lessons are conducted from early morning around 8 am right through to evening time. How do you bring the Year 10s into that?
A mother said that ANZAC Hill High School provided good pastoral care. The students were well supported and, in fact, many of the students from ANZAC Hill High School were taken to Centralian College to do some classes that were not available at ANZAC Hill High School. If Year 10 was shoved to the ANZAC Hill High School, the programming would make it too long a day for children who could be as young as 14 years of age, and that would not be a good thing. The pastoral care provided by Centralian College is very different compared to that provided at ANZAC Hill High School. She felt that the current system was a more suitable system for her children, that it was a staged transition from Year 10 through to Years 11 and 12.
Another person who spoke on behalf of the Alice Springs High School asked what would be the cultural impact of mixing the school students from ANZAC High School with the students from Alice Springs High School. Socom just said: ‘I am not here to answer questions. I am here to provide you with what the government’s position is and you can give me the input’. The questions were opposed.
A mother from Katherine, who is now living in Alice Springs but had come down from Katherine said: ‘Where have you been hiding this wonderful secret? I love this system’ - meaning the current system of ANZAC High School which has Years 7 to 10, Alice Springs High School has Years 7 to 10 plus extension into Years 11 and 12, and Centralian College has Years 11 and 12. Why have we not told the rest of the Territory about this system? She also claims, having come from Katherine, the town that the minister spoke so highly about with its cooperative system, that: ‘Year 10 has to stay in ANZAC Hill High School and Alice Springs High School as it works. That system works in Alice Springs’.
A teacher from Alice Springs High School said that moving Year 10 is not on. The infrastructure at ANZAC and ASHS was already there to provide for Years 7 to 10 and should be utilised accordingly; that there is a need to retain the status quo but to establish closer liaison between the community of the two schools, the sharing of resources between the two schools, and also to dovetail some of the vertical timetabling of some subjects between ASHS, ANZAC and Centralian College.
A member of the ANZAC Hill school council asked: ‘To what extent is this about cost saving?’ There has been no infrastructure spending on ANZAC Hill High School for a long time - well, definitely not in the last five years of this government. Another student at Centralian College said that Year 10 students coming to Centralian College would jeopardize the senior focus. Year 10 students are in a compulsory education stage, whereas Centralian College students are in a post-compulsory stage of education. The majority of Centralian College students want to be there to study and they are treated as adults, plus there are adult-age students at Centralian College doing Years 11 and 12 also. She believes that in the current structure the minister described, Year 10 should stay in the middle school.
It is one of the very few meetings that I have been to in the Alice Springs community where there was a high representation of indigenous people at the meeting. It was also very pleasant to see that there were indigenous people taking a real interest in education and prepared to speak their minds. I sat amongst a group of them in the front rows and just about all of them put up their hands for a microphone to speak. They were putting their points across and they were equally adamant that the system that this government wants to introduce is not good for them.
This ANZAC Hill AIEW said: ‘Putting Year 10 into Centralian College is not good because the children will not be ready. Particularly indigenous students will not be able to cope’. She asked also: ‘What about bush education?’ Another indigenous person used the Students’ Representative Council as an example. Year 10 students are leaders at middle school. Displace them before they are ready, and they take a junior role in the senior college that the minister wants to introduce. He said that if those Year 10 students were sent to Centralian College on a full-time basis, they will not be able to cope. In fact, this first year of Year 10s going to Centralian College will lose that experience of leadership in their school where they would have been the leaders in Year 10. A Year 7 student put up her hand and asked for a microphone and asked why the government would not keep Year 10 in the middle school?
Another teacher from ANZAC Hill High School used to be a teacher at Centralian College for two years. She said: ‘Centralian College is a special place; a unique place and it is at capacity. It does many great things for a great many people including ANZAC Hill High School students. The ANZAC Hill High School Year 10 students are not ready for an environment that Centralian College provides’. This is a teacher who has been at Centralian College for two years previously and now teaches at ANZAC Hill High School, so she knows both environments very well and understands the cultures.
A father who had a child at each school - ANZAC Hill High School and Centralian College - asked a question: ‘How open and transparent is the Martin government and will they listen to the people who have all this to say?’ I was surprised to hear Socom say the minister is determined to shift Year 7 to secondary school. That was quite a firm comment on her part. I do not have any problems with that. Darwin has been quite distinct in its junior high school system compared to Alice Springs. Alice Springs, as the member for Braitling commented, has had Year 7 in secondary school for many years. It has taken a long time and much cooperation amongst the older schools, the primary as well as secondary, to introduce the system and the cooperative environment that has existed in Alice Springs. One of the supporting factors was that Alice Springs is much smaller than Darwin, and allowed a system with Year 7s in secondary school. It has occurred very well and has kept going for the last 15 years.
A mother asked why the minister was not there for the meeting, listening to the students, parents and teachers. She thought it was an insult to them.
A Centralian College student, a young man, said that the students did well at Centralian College; they were treated as adults. He appreciated that method of teaching. The curriculum that stretched between 8 am to 5 pm each day allowed him to exercise his discretion and he did it responsibly and derived a lot of benefit from that. He said he could come and go to school as he felt he needed to. He said: ‘Year 10s will not be able to cope with that and, in fact, it will be safer, better for Year 10s to be left where they are’.
An ANZAC Hill High School student then next said that Year 7s to 10s worked well for them at ANZAC Hill High School. That student wanted to be left alone and asked the minister to leave the school alone. He asked that the rest of the Northern Territory come on board. My comment was made about Irrkerlantye School also, but I will come back to that in a minute.
A mother said: ‘My children have always benefited from the supportive environment of ANZAC Hill High School’. The member for Braitling mentioned that the pastoral care at ANZAC Hill High School and Alice Springs High School is very different to that provided at Centralian College where students are treated much more as if they were in the early years of a university environment.
A Year 10 student from ANZAC Hill High School told a story that she travels to Centralian College twice a week to attend geography lessons. She said that she really found it difficult to cope at Centralian College as she gets lost at the college and feels quite bewildered by the environment. Previous to ANZAC Hill High School, she had studied at Katherine High School and she felt that the system in Alice Springs was a lot better; that she was now in a more cloistered environment in ANZAC Hill High School, supported very well but allowed to vertically integrate into a course in Centralian College. She says that she achieves much more benefit that way. She does not want to be at Centralian College full-time but, by being at ASHS full-time, spending part of her time at Centralian College was more beneficial.
A young student, very cynical in her young years, said that the prospect of closing down the ANZAC Hill High School is for the government to sell the land, a sign of desperation for money. Another ANZAC Hill High School student in Year 7 said that Year 10s should not be moved from ANZAC Hill High School: how can they cope within a bigger school?
Finally, after all those comments were made, John Cooper, the current Principal of ANZAC Hill High School - a man who has been in that role for a long time, who is very highly respected in Alice Springs, and is very learned and whose opinions I respect - then walked up to the front of the room and provided a history of what happened in Alice Springs and made a proposal. First of all, he felt that there was a need to pool the resources in Alice Springs to support secondary education for Years 10 to 12. What he is saying is that Year 10, while it is the peak of junior high school, is also a preparatory year for students moving into secondary college.
There needs to be some degree of training of these Year 10 students to move into the secondary college system. The thing to do is to make sure that, first of all, staffing ratios for Year 10 are equivalent to the staffing levels for Years 11 and 12. As you know, at the moment for primary schools, the teacher/student ratio is one teacher to 22 primary students; for junior secondary, it is one to 17; and for senior secondary, it is one in 14. What he is suggesting is that Year 10s will be started in the ratio of one to 14 as well. That will allow better support for Year 10 students in the secondary school system.
He believes that the location of Year 10 in their current locations should not pose a major stumbling block for the vertical integration of Years 10 to 12 in secondary education. What he proposed was that Year 10 remains in ANZAC Hill High School and Centralian College, but that there be a formalised relationship between Centralian College, ANZAC Hill High School and Alice Springs High School so that Year 10 students can formally move between their current location in Centralian College to a government supported system where they can be transported across if need be. That if they were to have their core Year 10 subjects taught at ANZAC or ASHS, that there will be enough teachers at those schools to provide those lessons. It is important to ensure that enough resources are being provided for ASHS in Alice Springs, otherwise the students will not be able to move across easily. Centralian College is chock-a-block, as we all know. The only way we can accommodate Year 10 in that college would be to put more demountables in, because I am sure you are not going to put money putting bricks and mortar up at this stage.
Minister, you have not listened to the community properly. You talk about consultation, but all the consultation is just a sham. All you have done is make up your mind, and then you used Socom to try to soften the impact that you are going to cop. If you were honest, you would speak to the people, listen to them and take heed.
Mr WOOD (Nelson): Mr Deputy Speaker, in the minister’s statement he said: ‘Today is the time for the opposition and Independent members of parliament to put forward their plan’. I appreciate that offer, but I would probably need a department to back me up if you wanted a full-scale plan of education in the Northern Territory. I welcome the chance to at least put forward some suggestions and comments.
I suppose what you might say is the bleeding obvious: we all know that education is one of the most important gifts we can have in life. Without a good education, you are very unlikely to get a good job in life. We know that many people who do not have a good education end up in a life of poverty or crime to some extent, and struggle through their lives because they have not had the opportunity that good education would give them.
I am going to make a number of statements, and I do so in a positive way. This whole debate revolves around the issue of middle schools. There is a presumption that middle schools will change a problem we have at the present time; that is, we believe we are not achieving the results that we should. I am not the person who can say: ‘I support middle schools wholeheartedly because it is going to do the job’. There are experts here and there saying that the proof of the pudding will be in 10 years time. The minister may not still be here in this parliament in 10 years time - although you never know.
Mr Stirling: Still be minister for Education.
Mr WOOD: That is very good. He will be able to come back to this parliament and say: ‘Told you so’. We really do not know.
The government is taking a gamble, you might say, to some extent by introducing a scheme occurring in other states of Australia that they have looked at, and saying: ‘That is the process, the type of schooling system we should have in the Northern Territory’. I say let us try it. If the system we have at the present time is not working, let us give it a go.
One thing that came out of the meeting at Taminmin - and I will get back to that meeting later – was a number of people said that we should have been looking at the whole school system in the Northern Territory; that is, primary and secondary. A number of people at that meeting at Taminmin said they felt that children were not having the literacy and numeracy skills from their primary schooling that would enable them to do well in secondary school. There were a number of comments about that. I wonder whether, by focusing purely on secondary, we have missed an opportunity to look at primary education because, as we know, there is a direct correlation between whether your years of primary school have been successful and given you a good grounding in education, as to whether you will be able to carry on in secondary school successfully, or you will always be struggling. That was an important comment and, regardless of this middle school process, at the same time we should be seriously looking to see whether the results that are coming out of primary schools are going to be of a high enough standard to make the middle school system work. I hope the minister will take that on board.
I want to talk about the meetings that were held regarding middle schools in the Taminmin and Palmerston area. Unfortunately, I could not get to the Palmerston meeting. As the member for Goyder would know, there was another interesting meeting on that night regarding the Humpty Doo landfill. We were caught between the devil and the deep blue sea.
The reports I had come back from Palmerston was that you probably did not miss much because it was mainly Palmerston people who attended. Those rural people who did go felt it was generally a Palmerston-orientated meeting. What it did highlight is that we should not always put Palmerston and the rural area in the one box. There needs to be meetings in the rural area because it is different - thank heavens – and it does give people in the rural area time to look at their high school which is different from many other high schools in the Northern Territory.
The meeting at Taminmin was, I think, co-chaired by Tony Considine, the new principal of Taminmin High School, and Annette Jamieson who was a principal of one of the schools in Alice Springs. That was a good move because Alice Springs has had the change of Year 7 in high schools for quite a long time, and that was an issue that a number of parents raised. They had concerns about their children moving into this new high school. They had concerns about Year 7 students mixing with Year 12 students. I suppose, from my point of view, that is no big deal.
I started what was Form 1 in Victoria at the age of 10 and I was so excited to get into secondary school because I could wear long trousers. It did not worry me because, if you are brought up with that system you do not see any concerns. However, for people who have lived in the Northern Territory – especially the Top End of the Northern Territory – all their lives, there is a genuine concern that this is a major change for their children. They feel they have missed things their children were looking forward to such as being the school captain next year or on the SRC.
It was good to hear one of the teachers say to those parents: ‘Yes, we understand those concerns and we will do our best to help those children, especially this first group of children who are coming through from primary. We will help them adjust’. The thing I liked about that is that you saw that they were not just teachers; they were people who understood the feelings of the parents and the concerns of the students, and that was good. That helped people get a better understanding of what was to occur. I felt that having the teachers attend that meeting, who will be the ones who will deal with these students, enabled parents to see that they just are not teachers teaching A, B, C; they are teachers who understand the needs of these children and will do something about it. They will help them when the transition occurs. That was very much appreciated.
The other issues from that meeting relate to an issue that I will get onto a little later. You said in your statement there are at least two things that we need to look at – the stages and the infrastructure. I would also add the timing. I have just mentioned Year 7 and the stages are covered pretty well. Year 10 has been an issue in many places. At one of the school council meetings, it was thought Year 10 at Taminmin could be a bit of a crossover. You start to do subjects for Year 11 whilst in Year 10 so, with a bit of clever manipulation, Year 10 is a grey part of the education where it is leaving the middle schools and moving into the senior, not as a cut-off but as a graduation.
I should comment on the Casuarina Secondary College process at this stage, because Year 10 is one of the issues raised there. I know you have a different point of view regarding Casuarina Secondary College. I suppose I am looking at it as an outsider. I go to the students’ awards and see that big list of students who achieve well in Year 11 and 12 at Casuarina Secondary College. All I can say is I hope the models are not that rigid that you cannot allow choice. Could Casuarina Secondary College exist as it is as a choice for parents? Some other models might be different. There might be Year 10, 11 and 12. Casuarina Secondary College is still Years 11 and 12 and the choice is there for parents whether they wanted to send their kids to that school or another model. If it is not broke, we do not need to fix it. I would be interested in the minister’s point of view on that.
Infrastructure is one of those areas that concern people at Taminmin. My understanding is that the infrastructure requirement for Taminmin - to have it ready by the year 2007 - would be five new classrooms, a major upgrade in the IT Services, and a power upgrade. I know there are people in the library who know that the library would need a major upgrade; it is too small at the present time. If we are to increase the numbers in that school, we would have to upgrade the library. You have to remember the library is also a community library which is not only the school, but the local rural area and also country borrowers use it. It is the area where the books go out throughout the Northern Territory.
Mr Stirling: Same as Nhulunbuy.
Mr WOOD: Same as Nhulunbuy. Like many facilities; we should share them.
If parents do not believe that you can have that infrastructure finished and the model running successfully by the year 2007, they will not send their kids to the school. They will either keep them back in primary school or they will send them somewhere else. What they would need to know from the government is whether they can have that infrastructure in place by the year 2007.
That leads me to timing. I would rather see this process go to 2008 if that is not the case. Do not rush it. We have gone this far, let us make sure it is right. One of the dangers is you could do more damage rushing it, and all the good work you have put into trying to get up a new concept in education could go out the door if people find the infrastructure is not in place nor properly set up when their children go to school. That is why there are important stages; the infrastructure and the timing are the key things. The timing at this stage – especially as my understanding is that the school council at Taminmin, parents and teachers are generally in support of the middle school process that you are trying to introduce. However, that will fail if it is rushed. I would rather see you provide five classrooms, upgrade the IT services, put in the power and upgrade the library properly at Taminmin by 2008. That would make the process much more successful and give parents confidence that everything is okay when they send their children to that school.
There are other issues as well. You are going to have to upgrade the bus service or, if you do not upgrade it, you are going to have to change it because more children will be going to a different school. The Minister for Planning and Lands loves issues about buses. There will have to be changes which have to be looked at. In the rural area that is not an easy process because, even though we are talking about Taminmin today, quite a number of students in the rural area already do Year 7 at secondary schools like Marrara, Kormilda, and St John’s which have a middle school concept and, I gather, O’Loughlin could move over to that any time it liked. There are a number or private schools already taking children from the rural area who are going through the middle school process.
I believe the member for Goyder might have received this letter as well, so he might have been going to refer to it. It is from Norma and Cliff Fowler. They used to be in my constituency but they are now in the member for Goyder’s constituency. I will read this letter from Cliff Fowler:
- As a retired educationist, I am extremely concerned that the NT education system is in danger of considerable unnecessary disruption. I am writing to you, as I think you will follow my reasoning and may be able to exert a moderating influence on the proposed course of events.
Firstly, I will briefly outline my credentials. My 40 years experience in education were gained in four different countries and seven different systems. I have worked at all levels from classroom teacher to inspector of schools. My final 10 years were spent as Chief Assessor to the NT Board of Studies when I was responsible for evaluation, research, assessment and certification. I played a major role in the creation of Casuarina Secondary College, the introduction of the Junior Secondary Study Certificate and the development of the Multi-level Assessment program. I have been the author of more than two dozen professional reports. My academic qualifications include a Batchelor of Ed, a Batchelor of Science Honours and a Masters of Ed. I mention this background merely to show that I can claim some knowledge of educational matters. Furthermore, being retired, I have no personal axe to grind in the present debate.
Perhaps this person and I could have got together and put forward my plans, minister:
- First may I make the point there is nothing fundamentally wrong with the existing NT education system, nor with the present structure of schooling. If you know where to look you can find arguments and evidence in the favour of many structures involving various combinations of primary schools, secondary schools, middle schools, junior high schools and senior colleges. Twenty years ago, senior colleges were all the rage and this resulted in Casuarina Secondary College with Dripstone, Nightcliff and Sanderson becoming junior high schools. A further modification then allowed these schools to reintroduce Year 11 and 12 courses.
Now, it seems middle schools are fashionable again. I say again because there was some experimentation with middle schools in some English counties in the 1970s. If we already had middle schools, I would say leave them alone as there is nothing fundamentally wrong with them either. However, since we do not have them I would argue that enforcing their hurried introduction is likely to cause a situation where the disruption and ill feelings will outweigh any supposed benefits.
- There are two points I would like to make in regard to the present situation. First, on a world scale, the most enduring arrangement of schooling has been that involving primary and secondary schools. Second, there is a clear break between the years of compulsory schooling up to Year 10 and voluntary attendances in Year 11 and 12. Concerns that Year 10 students have no clear goal to aim at need not have arisen if the JSSC …
That is the Junior Secondary Studies Certificate:
- … had been retained. This was a Year 10 certificate based upon exams in English and maths, and moderated school assessment in other subjects. Its reintroduction would be quite feasible, since the mechanism was well established and there would still be officers in the department familiar with its operation.
- Finally I would emphasise that what goes on in the classroom has far more impact on student achievement than any given structure of schooling. If there is any additional funding available, it should be used to improve the student/teacher ratios and provide additional help to students who need it. There is ample evidence that such provisions have a positive effect on learning outcomes. We will, of course, continue to need effective teachers, good principals and a suitable curriculum. Fortunately, we are already reasonably well served in terms of these requirements.
Best wishes,
Cliff Fowler.
I read that because he is a person who has had many years experience in teaching. He says, partly, what I was trying to say and what I have picked up from the Taminmin High School: let us not hurry it in case that causes disruption and ill feeling. Let us introduce it, but make sure that the parents, the teachers and the community are satisfied that it is time to, that all the infrastructure is there, and people have an understanding of exactly what is occurring. That way, in the end, we bring in a better system for all our children so that they are educated and have a much better future in the Northern Territory, especially trying to get employment and jobs which we all need.
Dr BURNS (Planning and Lands): Mr Deputy Speaker, I am very pleased to support the Education minister’s statement on middle years education in the Northern Territory. The Northern Territory faces unique challenges in the provision of education resulting from its size and scattered population. The issues confronting teachers and students in our major population centres such as Darwin and Alice Springs are different to those faced in communities such as Ramingining and Kalkarindji. One thing, however, is abundantly clear: our children are entitled to an education system that is at least equal to, if not better than, other jurisdictions in Australia. It is simply unacceptable that students in the Northern Territory are, on average, five points behind their South Australian counterparts in their tertiary entrance results. The educational outcomes are an indication that something is wrong with the system.
When this government came to office in 2001, one of its clear objectives was to turn the situation around. My colleague, the Minister for Employment, Education and Training, has outlined the work which has already been completed. The Martin government commissioned the Ramsey review in 2002. This comprehensive analysis of secondary education in the Northern Territory identified the problems within the existing system and recommended solutions. As the Education minister has detailed, the Ramsey review’s fundamental conclusion was that a greater focus on the middle years of education was the key to achieving better results and stemming the flow of students dropping out of high school.
There has been a growing awareness over the past decade of the specific learning needs of students in the middle years of schooling. This is as a result of significant research activity, both in Australia and overseas, and identifies the challenges in engaging these students in learning. If students are alienated rather than engaged in learning, then it is equally likely that they are alienated in developing the knowledge, skills and capabilities that allow them to participate in a meaningful way in academic, social and community life.
At the heart of the Ramsey review was an extensive process of community consultation. The success of this process is reflected in the fact that it received more than 100 submissions. The recommendations of the Ramsey review were again put out for public consultation. As parents, we appreciate the premium that people place on their children’s education. Let me reiterate: we are committed to public consultation and engagement in this process.
Like many MLAs, I regularly attend council meetings at schools within my electorate. In my case, I have been listening to the views of parents and teachers at Wagaman, Jingili and Moil Primary Schools, as well as Casuarina Senior College. In general, primary schools in my electorate are supportive of the concept and approach of middle schools. Nevertheless, parents have rightly raised questions and concerns about the process of moving to middle schooling, and I would expect nothing less of people concerned about their children’s education. I have sought to answer their questions and listen to their concerns. I can assure them that all the issues they have raised will be passed on to my colleagues within Caucus and Cabinet. This, after all, is what community consultation is all about.
Recently, I also met a delegation of teachers from Casuarina Senior College. I must say the meeting was very cordial. We canvassed a broad range of issues over the course of the meeting, which went on for over an hour-and-a-half. I respect the teachers input, as well as their professionalism. At that meeting, I was able to share with those teachers that I went to a selective school when I grew up in Brisbane – I went to the Brisbane State High School which was a school which selected students on the basis of their marks in what was known then as the ‘scholarship examination’ which was a public examination in Queensland in Year 8. On the basis of your marks, if they were good enough, you were accepted into the Brisbane State High School and into the selective class. If you came from the feeder area for that particular school, you could automatically attend that school.
That selective process continued throughout my secondary schooling in that, once you reached Year 10, there was another public examination which was called ‘the junior examination’, similar to what the member for Nelson was speaking about before. On the basis of those marks, you could then get into the senior class, which had all the best teachers and resources. It was a showcase of the public secondary system in Queensland. It was out of that class that quite a lot of the top marks in the Year 12 examination came from. I was not one of those. I did pretty well in that examination, but I did not get a place in the top 20. There was much competition within my class to see who could get the best marks.
Most people I went to secondary school with in Years 9 to 12 with whom I have kept in contact with have done pretty well in life. They have received a good education and a good foundation for their lives. I often wonder about the rest of the school. I suppose it did not have the attention or the teachers for the particular subjects that we did.
So it is with Casuarina Senior College. There is no doubt that, in the Northern Territory Certificate of Education, Casuarina Senior College does very well. Every year it gets at least 10 out of that top 20. However, as I discussed with the teachers that I met, from the spread of results that I could see, my analysis over the years of 2000 to 2004 is that there are actually two groups of students within Casuarina Senior College. There is that group of students who do very well and are represented in that top group of students. Then there are the students in another group who struggle to get their NTCE, particularly in the two-year period, and their marks are well behind. You can actually see in the distribution of marks there are two peaks that really represent those two groups of students.
I commend Casuarina Senior College for the work they do and the results they achieve every year in that NTCE. That is highly regarded and I am proud to be the local representative in that area where Casuarina Senior College is. It draws students not only from my electorate but from all over Darwin, and they do a fantastic job.
However, this is not just about any one school or any one group of students. This is about all our students; it is about all our schools. I have been really heartened by the debate this evening because members from all sides are taking this debate very seriously. I believe the community is taking this debate very seriously. I can assure them that, as a member of Cabinet and of the Caucus on this side of the House, all of us are listening very carefully to the feedback that we are getting from our communities. That will be an integral part of the consideration about the implementation of this model.
It is a very important debate that we are having. I have been a member of the Casuarina Senior College Council for a number of years now. Ever since I entered parliament and before, when I was a candidate, I started attending the Casuarina Senior College Council meetings. I have worked very constructively with the college and I have written to all new members of the college this year. I have said up-front that the middle schools issue is a very important issue that we have to work through. I have undertaken to work constructively with the college and the council to secure a positive result for all concerned.
The middle years of schooling encompasses the developmental stages of a child’s adolescence. Students who prosper in their middle years at school - whether it be emotionally, socially or educationally - have an excellent chance of success at senior secondary level and beyond. The opposite is true for students who become disengaged in their middle years. The quality of this phase of schooling is of crucial importance to the future lives and prospects of young Territorians.
I emphasise the middle schools approach is about how you teach and not so much about what you teach, although the member for Nelson made some good suggestions, I thought, about students in Year 10 taking on subjects and pointing them towards Years 11 and 12. I am assured that that is part of the approach as well.
The transition from primary school to secondary school can be a traumatic period for some students. At primary school, children develop closer relationships with their teachers, a bond of trust is developed and the child is accustomed to having a single teacher to teach all their lessons. On arrival at secondary school, the student is suddenly confronted with numerous teachers teaching numerous subjects. The middle years approach is a transition between the two, which is a move away from the single teacher concept, but not to the extent of having one teacher per subject. For example, teachers may group subjects teaching both maths and science or both English and social studies.
This has the effect of providing a more stable environment for the student, as well as allowing for greater pastoral care; a crucial element in any child’s education. The Education minister has spoken at length about the Building Better Schools package he launched last year. This $42m package reflects the Martin government’s commitment to improving standards of education in the Territory. It shows what can be achieved with responsible fiscal management and the delivery of three surplus budgets in a row. The package targets resources for both students and teachers - students through greater choices and options as well as providing access to counsellors and career advisers, and teachers through funding for professional development. This commitment to the professional development of our teachers deserves to be applauded.
Since 2001, the Martin government has allocated nearly $5m to this program. I was very pleased to hear the Education minister detail extensive programs of professional development and training that his department will conduct this year. This includes support for individual schools and teachers to prepare for the introduction of middle years approaches to teaching and learning, as well as leadership training, study scholarships and grants for teachers to attend conferences. Last year’s budget also focused on improving education infrastructure with the program of nearly $50m. This included $23.95m for capital works; $6m for minor new works and $19.5m for repairs and maintenance.
Mr Deputy Speaker, the Martin government is investing in Territory schools, teachers and students with greater funding for teaching and education resources, school upgrades and more classroom equipment. The minister began and concluded his statement with the message that ‘doing nothing is not an option’. I endorse that position and restate the government’s commitment to focusing on this crucial development phase for our students, their middle years of education.
Ms LAWRIE (Family and Community Services): Mr Deputy Speaker, I congratulate the minister for his important statement. You do not need to go past the start of his statement that ‘our students lag behind the rest of the nation’, to realise the importance of this statement to our society. As both a parent and a politician, I agree that we cannot sit back and do nothing. For too long, education was under-resourced and under-funded. The Martin Labor government has put additional resources into education. Importantly, we have employed an extra 100 teachers. Now that we have put more resources into the system, it is quite appropriate to look at the overall structure of our education system. This was the point of the secondary review of education, which has led to the debate that we are currently having in our community on middle schooling.
In regard to middle years, in talking to the primary schools and the secondary school in the community, I found overall support for middle years, as we have also seen in this Chamber through this debate. The concept of middle years has strong support. People appreciate that there is an intention to improve educational outcomes, and middle years is a proven method of improving educational outcomes.
There is a whole host of queries around what the implementation of the change will look like and what the changes will do to affect each person’s child or each person’s school or, indeed, each teacher’s career path. Quite legitimately, there has been some really robust and important debate around the detail of that. I see that as a really good service to the government, because it is exactly our intention in community consultation to tease out the issues of concern in the community and in our school system.
That has happened in the debate on middle years schooling. It is a very healthy thing for the Territory because, even though the government has been putting forward discussion around middle years for schools since 2003, it was really only a core of parents on the school councils, teachers and administrators in education who had even cottoned onto the debate at all. It took a time frame. It took a concerted effort and a bold step by the minister for Education to say: ‘We are introducing middle year school policy and this is the time frame in which we are looking at doing it’, to focus the community’s mind quite clearly on the debate that middle years of school deserves.
I congratulate the minister for Education for taking that bold step and, indeed, the government for supporting him in that step. In discussions I was having with school principals in my electorate late last year and into early this year, they were all of the view that it would take something bold from the government to get the community to actually focus on understanding middle schools; what the pedagogy of middle schools meant; understanding what potential structural changes would come about as a result of middle schools; understanding what opportunities were inherent within the middle school system; and that was only a bold announcement around time lines that would get people focused on it. That is exactly what we have seen.
I know that the shadow minister spent a fair amount of his contribution focusing on and disparaging the work and professionalism of Sheila O’Sullivan. However, it is extremely useful to have a skilled facilitator undertake community consultation. Through the secondary review consultation process, I saw the way Sheila O’Sullivan did everything, during debate at the community consultation, to try to tease out peoples’ suggestions, views, alternative ideas, and alternative proposals. It is sad when you get down to a level of debate that we have had in the Chamber this evening, attacking the professionalism of someone who, quite appropriately, is there to engage the community and tease out the community’s thinking on the issue.
I congratulate Sheila O’Sullivan and her Socom team. They have done that extremely well - so well, in fact, that we heard the Chief Minister in Question Time today say that there have been additional models brought forward as a result of the community consultation. That is all information that is quite legitimately put before government in the assessments that are going on at the moment around the community consultation, the response and feedback to the models, and any new suggested models that have come forward from the consultation.
For example, within the section of northern suburbs that I represent, Mr Deputy Speaker, along with yourself, there was a Pathways model put forward by Sanderson High School which involved Malak Primary School. I attended a meeting of parents at the Malak Primary School where the Pathways model was suggested to the parents by both Principals of Sanderson High School and Malak Primary School. People were shocked - absolutely shocked. Their reaction was: ‘We do not want Malak Primary School to change as a primary school. We think this is a primary school of excellence. We are delighted with what you are doing in the primary education of our children at this school’. To me, it was a really interesting debate where you had educators who said: ‘Here is a model’. They are enormously experienced educators. Those principals put a lot of effort and thought into what kind of a model could work as a Pathways model to meet a cohort of students in the northern suburbs. Yet, the parents responded and said: ‘No way. We will not accept that model’.
What it showed me is that, in looking at models, you have to be prepared to have a genuine debate and discussion with your parent, student and teacher communities. It might be uncomfortable and confronting at times, but it is a healthy process to go through. That is what I recognise by this middle years of school debate that is happening through the consultation process; we have teased out the concerns that people have. Those concerns are quite broad-ranging. The range of concerns is: ‘Is our school canteen going to continue to be viable? Is the transport system going to cater to my child’s needs? Will I be travelling in a direction away from work to drop my child off at school, or will I be travelling in a direction to work? Will my different aged children attending middle years of school and senior years of school be able to be catered for?’
For parents with many children in a household, if they have two or three kids straddling the years of primary to middle to senior, these are very legitimate issues that, as parents, they are quite appropriately grappling with - quite separate to the actual educational issues that, as a parent and not necessarily an educator, they would find more difficult to get their heads around. When people start to talk about middle years of school pedagogy, you literally see parents shift back in their seat, uncomfortable because it is taking them outside of an area of knowledge that they have. I really enjoyed participating in the discussions at my school communities around just what pedagogy means.
What I have been delighted to see in the debates, certainly in the electorate of Karama, is that people are prepared to embrace change if they understand the change. They are prepared to embrace change where they see the benefits to not just their children but the broader education system as well. It has been quite confronting for parents to say: ‘How does this affect my individual child but, importantly, how does this affect the education of children in the Northern Territory?’ I have been really very proud of the debate that I have heard in my community where people have taken the bigger picture as well as their own individual picture on board.
I can say that, whilst there have been logistical issues raised at each of my school communities, there is an underlying and broad support for middle years of school. I have been able to work through many of those logistical issues in discussion with the school communities, to the point where many people have become far more comfortable about a process of change that could be as early as January 2007.
Quite legitimately, teachers want to know what their professional development is. One of those areas where government, I understand, has done a lot of work through DEET is around the issue of professional development; around the issue of curriculum. Sometimes, when you are having a debate you cannot get to the level of detail to inform people of the legitimate questions they have around pedagogy, curriculum and the relevant human resources aspects that will confront the teaching profession through this change.
It has really shown the great leadership we have within our school communities, where the principals have embraced the need to engage their school community, both in terms of their own staff as well as the parents and, importantly in this picture, the students. Where principals have shown leadership and embraced their school community, I have seen a great deal less concern and anxiety than where people have not been as well informed or well attuned to the information that is available in our community.
I congratulate DEET, which has gone to a great deal of effort in producing easy as possible to understand literature and pamphlets that went home to all affected parents. I know that through the high schools it was directly mailed out, and in the primary schools it was distributed through the school system. The feedback I received from parents was that they were very appreciative of that information. I congratulate DEET for going to the effort to provide that level of information. There is a really good tool in the web site, to be able to access additional information regarding the middle years of school. Giving informed parents the triggers to find out more information has been an important aspect of the middle years schooling debate. I congratulate the minister for ensuring that his department has been geared to providing information for people who want to obtain it.
We should never have lost sight in this debate that it is so important for a kids that they get a good education in the Northern Territory. We are not going to be prepared to sit still and sell them short of what they justly deserve; that is, the best possible education, because a better education will lead to a more skilled work force. It will be great for our economy, will have good outcomes for health, for social cohesion and things such as crime reduction. The benefits that a good education underpins in the broader community are enormous.
I commend the government for being bold enough to say that we will do what we have to do in our role in government to improve education. It is interesting, when I am having debate at the local community level, I say: ‘There is one thing that you can rest assured about, there is not a single cost-saving measure involved in this middle years of school debate’. There is no saving to government budgets in middle years of school, in fact, quite the opposite. The government is committing to middle years of school, a far greater expenditure of resources, a far greater education budget. This is not paring down what we are providing in education; it is actually about enhancing our education system. When you can put it in that context, you can see people then start to engage. They have lost their fear and cynicism, and they start to get curious about improving education. For me, that has been a really engaging and enjoyable process to go through with my local community. I am not saying that there will be 100% agreement in our society about any ultimate decision of government.
I have to say that the aspects of the opposition’s contribution that I was disappointed in today were some presumptions that decisions had already been made by Cabinet. I am a member of Cabinet. I know that those presumptions are wrong. I know that this has been a genuine process in adopting a policy of middle years schooling, and taking an approach around that policy out to our community for consultation. A presumption that we have already made a decision on that outcome is absolutely wrong. I can say that, in all honesty, there is a genuine desire by this government to hear from our community about what they are interested in with the implementation of middle years of school. I have articulated only a few of them in my contribution to this debate in the Chamber.
I have not touched on the concerns that minister Burns, for example, commented on in regards to Year 10s joining Year 11 and 12 at Casuarina Senior College. One of the things that I found attractive in the debate and discussions I have had with my school communities last year and into this year, is the desire to see an improved pastoral care within our education system; to see an improved emphasis on caring for the student and the student’s overall wellbeing. If you do not care for their wellbeing, they tend to be the ones who drop out and contribute to the appalling retention rates that we have within the Territory. Whereas, if you support the wellbeing of the student, their wellbeing encourages an improved learning capacity and an improved learning capacity encourages retention and keeping them through school and skilling them up for their future, which is critically important to their overall wellbeing in their life.
One thing I have challenged people on in the Casuarina Senior College debate is that it is a school where the emphasis is on - and debate has been articulated around - teaching kids who want to be there in Years 11 and 12, and not wanting to take on the kids who have to be there. I challenge some of those urban myths. I have spoken to kids who have just come out of Casuarina Senior College. As a person who has been through the Territory education system myself, as a local, I have challenged them to show me any kid at their school who, irrespective of the law in regard to the compulsory age of schooling, stays in school if they do not want to stay in school. It is an absolute myth to think that a kid will stay in school because they think: ‘Oh, hang on, what is the legal compulsory age of schooling?’ That is an absolute nonsense. The kids stay in school because school is engaging them, caring for their wellbeing, and providing them with learning opportunities that they actually feel interested in and engaged about.
I have a great deal of regard for the teaching staff at Casuarina Senior College. I know some of them well. I have known past senior teaching staff of Casuarina Senior College extremely well. I do not undermine their professionalism when I say that I know students who have not survived the Casuarina Senior College ethos where it is up to you to turn up to school, to engage in these subjects, and to learn. The kids I have seen fall through a system like that are the disadvantaged kids in our society. They are the kids from a non-Anglo Saxon background. They are the children of my Thai, Filipino, Indonesian, and South-East Asian constituents. They are the indigenous kids in my electorate. I am sorry; if there is a way that we can improve pastoral care by putting Year 10s into Casuarina Senior College, then good. It is a good outcome as far as I am concerned. If you have to give a damn about whether or not a kid is attending school, is engaged in the school process or going to stay at school, that is an excellent outcome.
I encourage the minister for Education in the path he is taking. Does that deal with the relevant and quite appropriate issue of the Year 10 curriculum? No, it does not. However, I have absolute confidence in both the minister and his agency in looking at the SACE review and what it has raised in relation to Year 10 curriculum, and embracing as an aspect the next stage of our middle years at school debate, and ensuring we have a strong curriculum within our senior schools, which is Years 10, 11 and 12 under the model that the government is currently proposing. When middle years at school is resolved as a debate within our education community, the job is not finished there.
As the Minister for Family and Community Services, I know there is a great amount of work being done around early learning within our education system. I have always argued vehemently that if you wait until someone is 11 to 14 to deal with their fundamental education needs, you have waited too long; you have missed the boat. The most important time for learning is nought to eight. That is what the studies say; that is what the information shows. There is still a challenge there in the integration between the Family and Community Services aspects of government, which I have responsibility for, and the education for which the Education minister has responsibility. Is the government sitting idle on that? No, it is not. We have working groups between the two agencies which are developing and improving our early education from nought to eight within our Territory government system.
What I am doing in explaining this debate around middle years schooling is that this is part of an education reform. It is not the end; it is an important section of it and we need to get the middle section right. However, it does raise issues around the Year 10 curriculum which teachers have brought to me and said there has been a dumb down of our Year 10 curriculum over the years. Issues raised in the review said that there is a potential of a further dumb down of Year 10 curriculum which does not underpin the strength and veracity we need for Year 11 and 12. I have absolute faith in our minister and our agency to embrace and tackle those issues as part of putting to bed any implementation around the middle years of school, as we have a focus and debate in education reform that has been brought forward and driven by a government that has an absolute understanding of the need to improve education in the Territory.
Mr Deputy Speaker, I commend the minister for his statement. I urge all members of this House to enter into a healthy, non-divisive debate to improve the education of our children in the Territory.
Mr McADAM (Local Government): Mr Deputy Speaker, I support the statement by my colleague, the Minister for Employment, Education and Training. I know the minister has the best interests of Territory students and their families at heart. That is why he is showing the courage and determination to reform secondary education in the way he is. His essential point ‘that doing nothing is not an option’, cannot be argued.
Since this government came to power in 2001, education reform has been a priority. The minister and government recognised then, and even more so now, that change was necessary as the results were just not there. Our greatest resource in the Territory is our young people, but for our young people to participate in the fastest growing economy in Australia it is necessary for them to have the skills, education and knowledge. As the minister has outlined, the results secondary students achieve are considerably lower than their South Australian peers. Bearing in mind that the levels achieved in Darwin and Alice Springs are, on average, five units below that of South Australia - which, incidentally, is the worst jurisdiction in Australia - it asks the question: what the hell is happening to our people out in the bush? If our people who have reasonable opportunity to educational opportunities in the larger regions are five points below, who knows the situation with our people out in the bush. It is for that reason alone that it is very important that the minister has undertaken this particular task as, in the long term, it will provide some real impetus and outcomes for those people who live in the bush.
Much of the economic growth of the Territory is coming from the regions. Growth in the mining sector, continued development of the tourism industry, the continuous stability of the pastoral industry, and exciting new prospects in horticulture and agriculture means that employment prospects have never been better in the regions. However, such economic opportunities can only be realised by a work force with the skills and ability to participate to the maximum. Our secondary schools are a critical element in our society and our economy.
Allow me to outline some of the steps this government has made, or is making, that will advance secondary education in the regions. This government has made it compulsory for all schools, no matter how remote or how small, to cater for all students up to the age of 15 years. No longer will we see 13- or 14-year-olds turned away because there are no educational programs for them at their local school. The creation of a new improved Distance Education Centre will see it support middle year students who are living outside urban areas.
As well, small remote schools through the cluster system are exploring ways to aggregate middle year students so that visiting staff can service their educational needs. It is my understanding also that pools of secondary teachers have been created under Building Better Schools that will support small and remote schools and middle years education. In addition, collaborative school sites will see smaller remote schools work with larger regional schools to deliver middle years and senior secondary education.
I know that Borroloola Community Education Centre has begun planning to become a centre for secondary delivery in the Gulf region. This will enable middle schools to be approached and delivered there.
At this point, I find it a very sad indictment on the previous CLP government in regards to their policy whereby they determined that there would be no secondary education opportunities for those people who lived in the bush, or at least for those people who lived outside the major regional centres. One can only wonder at the lost opportunities, the denial of rights of individuals, the denial of human rights and, essentially, the denial of a person to be able to fully participate on an equal footing with the rest of our community. For this reason, I believe that the steps that the minister has taken today will automatically flow on to those regions out in the bush that have previously been denied opportunities so much cherished by people who live in the larger centres.
I now turn to Tennant Creek High School. Most members will be aware it has been taking Year 7 students for a number of years and is also thoroughly committed to this model. The minister has mentioned the full range of community consultations undertaken so far. I can report that the Tennant Creek consultations were very well received, and demonstrated a positive attitude to the concept of middle schooling. Indeed, there is a particular teacher at Tennant Creek who is a trained and experienced middle years teacher. He cannot wait to get his teeth into this new model.
Tennant Creek has long been a place where forward thinking ideas originate and thrive. It has to be on account of issues of size and distance that bedevil places such as my home town. It is also a town that is well aware of its cultural background and the need to work with the various communities that constitute its population. A successful alternative provision program has been running for the last few years, which includes many aspects of a successful middle schools approach. This alternative provision program has influenced the way the high school operates.
As I said earlier, Year 7 students have attended Tennant Creek High School for quite some time. We have learned from Tennant Creek High what may be successfully applied and what is required in a successful middle schools approach. Firstly, in the critical Years 7 to 9 cohort group, Tennant Creek has chosen to segregate indigenous boys and girls into separate classes. This is entirely in keeping with indigenous educational practices and seems to produce improved results and, obviously, a better learning environment. As well, students are placed in multi-age classes, enabling older students to assist in the education of their younger peers - once again, a method based upon traditional Aboriginal educational practice. School is run in such a way that the teachers come to the students - not the reverse – therefore, providing a stable learning environment for a student relatively new to the high school. It is envisaged that teams of teachers will be organised so that young, new teachers gain the benefit of working with more experienced teachers.
Not surprisingly, what we have learnt from Tennant Creek High School above all else, is that indigenous students need warm, friendly teachers with them for large blocks of their learning day. It is possibly close to an old-fashioned primary school model, based upon friendly faces and people learning together and respecting each other. What has also been learnt is that there needs to be a strenuous effort put into breaking down barriers between the bush and the town kids.
I am informed that the alternative secondary approach run in Tennant Creek has been very successful in that regard. As part of the approach, Years 7 to 9 do accredited training every day, as well as the more traditional academic programs such as maths, science, etcetera. Also included are units in beef cattle production conducted on the site of the old Juno Horse Centre, as well as units in construction and motor mechanics. At present, the alternative secondary education model in Tennant Creek is not linked with similar programs run in other parts of the Northern Territory. I would very much like the Department of Education, Employment and Training to look at how these linkages could be developed, because the teachers delivering the program in Tennant Creek are assuredly some of the most experienced teachers in the Northern Territory and they have made significant breakthroughs in delivering secondary education to indigenous students.
I believe, for the first time in the Territory’s history, we are well placed to take advantage of our geography. For most of our history, we have been vast distances from where the economic action has been occurring, but now, with the dynamic economies of China and India growing, the Territory is the right place at the right time, probably for the first time in our history. However, to take advantage of our geography, we need our people to be educated, trained and prepared. Reform of secondary education is essential if we are going to be smart enough to take advantage of our geography.
In conclusion, I am proud that the minister has the courage to take on the important job of reforming secondary education. I am confident that middle schooling is one of the ways that we will realise our potential as a smart state, with a population dynamically involved in the fastest growing region in the world. I do know that, by institution of these reforms, these efforts will flow to the bush automatically and allow the same opportunity for our young children who choose to live out there.
Ms McCARTHY (Arnhem): Mr Deputy Speaker, I support the Education minister’s statement on middle schools. I would like to focus largely on the bush schools and, in particular, the electorate of Arnhem, where we have at least 15 schools many of which have already been very much a part of secondary middle schooling.
On my visits, which have been quite regular in recent weeks, I have been able to discuss this with the teachers, parents and school councils in the region who are watching very closely the debate and all the information that is coming through in Darwin, Alice Springs and Katherine. As the Chief Minister said today, we are on track, there is no need to slow down. Those words are really encouraging because, of the work that has gone into middle schooling by the Education minister and people in his department. This work goes back to Dr Gregor Ramsey, who had a team of experts that travelled across the Northern Territory, receiving 113 submissions, visiting 129 areas, including 40 remote communities. On those visits, it was quite clear, and Aboriginal families in particular made it quite clear, that secondary school was failing indigenous children in our communities.
It was the driving force behind a lot of the things that Dr Ramsey made in his recommendations towards improving secondary schooling for children in remote areas. It is something that I commend the Education minister on for picking up quite early in the piece. As I have travelled around Arnhem, I have had the delight in seeing the increase in student numbers in our secondary component of our schools. We now have our children in schools like Bulman and Minyerri staying on, not going away to Darwin or Katherine because they are being offered opportunities right there in their communities.
I would like to just share a little information about some of the communities which are going very strongly. In May this year, it will be the first anniversary of the Minyerri School, the Stage 2 secondary building which was opened last year. That came about because the community wanted to have secondary education in their own community. They were worried about their children going away. Many of them would come back because they were homesick or because they could not keep up with the work or teasing – all sorts of reasons why kids going away to boarding school were just not succeeding.
Minyerri was able to have its own secondary school which opened in May last year. It has taken them quite some time to get to that point but, because the school is now there, it also has been able to maintain and hold on to those children who have left primary and continue on. Those age groups we lose from school of all our 11-, 12-, 13-, 14-years-old children - at those ages, they become disinterested, disengaged – Minyerri is holding onto them and saying: ‘Hey, stay here. Stay with us. Complete your education because we can do it right here in our community’.
The school at Minyerri has quite good facilities. It has a computer lab, administration office, storerooms, specialist classrooms for home economics and science, and three general classrooms and ablution facilities. I highlight Minyerri because it gave me a lot of hope as I travelled around Arnhem, to see that we already had something in place, albeit new, that was leading the way. Surrounding communities like Jilkminggan, Urapunga and Ngukurr are just down the road on the Roper Highway and they are seeing what is happening at Minyerri. There is great hope in those community schools that they can progress into something similar to what is happening at Minyerri.
Last week, I was at Bulman where Annette Miller is doing a great job, so much so that the secondary school students who are staying on at Bulman School and not going into Katherine or Darwin, have increased so much that the school now needs to use the local teachers’ staff room as an extra classroom. That is probably not a good thing in resourcing for our kids, but it is certainly a delight to see that the number of students staying there and continuing on. Students that we would have lost quite early in the piece, not going to school at all, are continuing on at Bulman primary/secondary school there. The next step, no doubt, which I will be working hard at, is to ensure that we do have extra classrooms for these children who are staying on in our communities.
At Ngukurr, the senior secondary is the same. We have a couple of classrooms there. It is really exciting. The teachers who have taken on the senior secondary at Ngukurr are teachers who have left Minyerri. They have been able to establish the senior secondary school at Minyerri, and now have kicked off at Ngukurr with such an increase in attendance of school-aged children from those ages of 13, 14, 15, the really vital ages where we know within our indigenous communities and where Dr Gregor Ramsey was told on numerous occasions, we were losing our children and their interest in any form of education. For indigenous children, in particular, the necessity to at least learn and understand the western way of life is absolutely crucial to their survival, as it is to all children.
When I talk about the schools in the remote areas, I also think of places like Bickerton Island. We have a teacher there who is working with children from the ages of five to 15 years, with the interest and enthusiasm of students wanting to stay on there. It is a pattern that we are seeing. The government and the Education minister is acutely aware that, because students are staying on, we know we need to resource all these areas, in particular out bush.
With the debate that is going on with middle schools in Darwin, Katherine, and Alice Springs, it is highlighting the exciting developments and the new road that we are going to go down. Yes, we have heard the word ‘risk’ but it is not something to be afraid of. I am absolutely confident that with all the debate that is going on people are feeling as though they are being heard. Students, teachers and parents are all being heard amidst this process and this debate about secondary or middle schools education.
In talking about the bush schools of the Arnhem electorate, I would also like to add how the teachers in those areas battle all sorts of things from the isolation to the weather. Just last week, our teachers in Beswick experienced concerns again with the nearby Waterhouse River. It is difficult to cope in those circumstances, and these are factors that our government is acutely aware of. We know that Beswick needs and would like to have a new school on higher ground. I am confident that it is going to happen and it is something that I know the Education minister is also familiar with. I am also pushing on behalf of the teachers and students in Beswick; conscious that every Wet Season we watch and wait to see whether they are going to make it through.
What makes it even more hopeful is that you can look up the road from Beswick and see Manyallaluk. Manyallaluk teachers and students are now housed in the most beautiful building where once they were in a small storeroom for quite some time, screaming for their own school building. This year, we are going to be opening a new school building at Manyallaluk which caters for children up to the ages of nine, 10, 11, and 12. I am sure the community there is thinking and talking about how to keep their children going to school. That middle school component is the area that we all know is the development of our youth, whatever their colour or their background. It is that age group we know we must keep engaged and interested, in an environment where they feel secure to learn, to grow, to be the people that they are here to be.
As I travel around the Arnhem electorate and see these things occurring and talk to the teachers and students and, in particular, the parents, I ask them: ‘How are you going? What is going on here that is encouraging? What more can we do?’ There is plenty more we can do.
One of the things that I find really discouraging when we talk about the need for teachers, families and children who work together in a collaborative situation, is that was supported under what was known as the ASSPA program which, for those who are unfamiliar with that term, is the Aboriginal Student Support Parental Awareness Program that no longer exists because the federal government axed that program over a year ago. For many Aboriginal students, the school would actually get up to $200 per student to be able to incorporate families into the school environment to put on activities in a way that encouraged school and community participation in a harmonious way, but also in a culturally appropriate way. For most schools, I know it worked really well. There were the occasional schools or committees where it did not work that well but, on the whole, the program was very good.
In places like Beswick now, where once they would have had $30 000 in ASSPA funding, they do not have anything. They now have to apply under what is called the PSPI program and compete for that funding. In most cases, they do not get it. Therefore, they have gone from $30 000 to absolutely nothing. If you are lucky, you might have $2000 to $3000 under the new program. The impact that this has had on the schools that I have been visiting in the last few weeks and over the last six months, is that the parental participation in the schools has dropped off. The encouragement does not seem to be as strong any more. This is of real concern. I am talking to families and parents again to see what we can do to overcome the fact that that bucket of money is gone.
However, the core issue still remains that our children need to be educated. How can we work together and come together on this? The bright light is what is happening out of the Northern Territory government with the building of schools like Minyerri, Manyallaluk, and with the support of schools like Bulman. I bring back to the Education minister that, yes, the middle schools process is so important out there in the bush schools. No doubt, the bush schools are watching what is happening. It is absolutely courageous that we are initiating this right across the Northern Territory. It is important that we always listen in every circumstance. I am confident that we are doing that. Indeed, the Education minister has been hearing today the thoughts that were coming from all members of parliament on what they see as some high points and some low points.
Madam Speaker, I commend the minister on his statement.
Mr BURKE (Brennan): Madam Speaker, in reply to the minister’s statement, my contribution is one of optimism, congratulations and thanks to the many stakeholders and contributors to this consultation. It is mainly focused on Palmerston, although I will make some wider personal observations.
First, let me make clear my interest is to see in place a better public education system than the one that currently exists. I have no doubt whatsoever that this is the key aim of the minister for Education and this government. How should we gauge what is better? Perhaps it is no surprise that I agree with the minister that ‘better’ must be measured in the outcomes our students are able to achieve. Students are the key stakeholders. Everybody else is important and necessary, but the interests of students are foremost. Education systems, teachers, and government departments all exist to assist students in gaining the skills they need to thrive in a continually evolving and more demanding world. We ought not to forget that our future wellbeing is very much dependent on our children.
I have heard many contributors to the discussions refer to our high achieving students as examples of our current system working. Their reference is to those who have achieved high marks and TER scores. We will take nothing away from these high achievers. However, we also recognise as high achievers those in rural and remote areas who successfully finish Year 12 where very few previously have. We must also recognise the significant achievement made by re-engaging a young person with education where, for a variety of reasons, they have disengaged. I would like to recognise the excellent work of the Alternative Education unit in Palmerston and elsewhere: Ross Macandrew, Brendan Cabry and others rightly view as significant the agreement of a young person to return to school where, previously, that person has been adamant that there is no point.
Some of the young people at the Alternative Educational Unit have not been in school since primary school. One of the hurdles such a young person encounters on their return is that everyone else is so far ahead. The commitment and fortitude of these young people simply to keep going deserves recognition as a great achievement. In my view, those of our students who already achieve high TER scores and NTCE scores are not the ones to evaluate our system by. The quality of our system certainly affects their performances, but their self-motivation, and most likely strong family support, will almost see them achieve high marks whatever obstacles are thrown their way.
The minister has referred to interstate averages for students, and the fact that our high schools uniformly fail, with one exception, to meet that average. Our best resourced public schools averages fail to meet the state-wide average of other jurisdictions. I am informed that, if we compare these particular schools individually to like schools interstate, the comparison is even less favourable to the Territory schools. I do not call this successful. I do not accept this shows the present system working well for a majority of students. I do not accept that our young people are less clever than those interstate. Nor do I accept that our teachers are any less skilled than their counterparts interstate. That leaves the public education system. The problem must be found here. Government, therefore, must act to fix it, and this is what the government is doing.
The key stakeholders are the students, which is why I and others made representations to the minister for the process to include student forums. I thank the minister for ensuring that a student forum was part of the process. I would like to thank the independent consultant engaged by government, Socom. I particularly recognise Ms Sheila O’Sullivan for her considerable efforts. It is no easy task to keep meetings of 100 people or more on track to discuss any topic. I also thank all those parents, students and those in the teaching profession who have been involved in the meetings. I know that there have been many discussions at many levels, both formal and informal, between friends, work colleagues, student bodies and student representative councils, parents and parent councils. The whole point of this process was to generate discussion and ideas. In this respect, the process has been a resounding success.
I particularly thank the principals and chairpersons of school councils of all the Palmerston primary schools and the Palmerston High School. The Palmerston principals and chairs have been extremely proactive. Most, if not all, attended the consultation forum in Palmerston. One message that was loud and clear was that the infrastructure at Palmerston High School could not be ready to accept the approximate 350 Year 7s by 2007. The member for Drysdale and I heard this, and we immediately beat a path to the minister’s door to ensure he heard it too. It was not very long after that public meeting that the minister announced that Year 7 students would not be moving to Palmerston High School until 2008, but other components of the transition would continue to go ahead, including the building of infrastructure at Palmerston High School. This is an example where the government clearly listened.
What has been put to me, particularly from various people involved with Bakewell Primary School, the Territory’s largest primary school, is that parents are prepared to work with school staff to manage overcrowding, as long as they know that there is a solution that will ease this pressure by 2008. The principals and chairs in Palmerston wasted no time in arranging meetings with each other, and I know that they have had at least two joint meetings, resulting in a couple of submissions to the minister. I would like to thank those people who have spoken to me candidly about their views and concerns.
The Palmerston School Councils and principals support the introduction of a middle years schooling program in Palmerston in an orderly planned and adequately resourced manner. They support the staged introduction of middle schools pedagogy in existing Palmerston schools from 2007. This they have said is subject to appropriate planning, teacher professional development, curriculum and supporting structures being in place.
I am aware also that Palmerston schools have been very proactive, ensuring their teachers have been able to participate in middle years training that has already been ongoing for some time now. The Palmerston councils and principals, as I previously said, are concerned that Palmerston students are not transferred until sufficient permanent infrastructure is in place to provide appropriate teaching accommodation for all students, in all schools, in recognised school facilities. As many people are well aware, the Palmerston High School and the Department of Education have already had discussions about the extra buildings that are required at the high school, and government has committed the funding to ensure it can happen.
The school councils and principals indicated that they want to be involved in further consultation, particularly in relation to which model or models might be adopted in Palmerston. I wholeheartedly support their request. The member for Drysdale and I are already working with the minister’s office on ways we can most effectively facilitate this. I understand that a further model has been put to government from Palmerston. I believe that this could be referred to as a collegiate model. I believe that this model is used in Queensland. This would see all public education facilities in Palmerston part of one entity: a multi-campus college of excellence. I ask you, minister, and your department to look seriously at this proposal. As you are aware, there are three primary schools that have overcrowding issues in Palmerston. Literally down the road from these are three other schools which have capacity. It has been put to me that this collegiate model has the ability to address this imbalance. That would be a great result for all Palmerston’s primary schools and students.
The council chairs believe that implementing middle schooling in Palmerston requires investment to transform existing teaching and learning facilities into middle schooling facilities. Certain chairs have indicated to me - and I understand as a group have advised the minister - that this is over and above the development of additional senior secondary facilities to cater for student numbers.
Minister, you will recall the member for Drysdale and I raised with your office the need to modify existing classrooms at Palmerston High School. Certainly, given the change in pedagogy, I can also see in principle that if one of the existing primary schools were converted to a middle school this, too, would require infrastructure work. I have had many discussions about the short and medium-term shape of education in Palmerston. One thing was clear from the meeting in Palmerston: many people felt there was not a choice available to them. Palmerston High School was the only secondary option. I do note, however, that there were voices present that argued a single entity was preferable because it meant the resources available could be focused on the one institution.
It is clear from the discussions that have happened since the public meeting that there is widespread support for an initial focus on Palmerston High School as a comprehensive Year 7 to 12 school. I note that the Palmerston chairs of the school councils have put their weight behind the notion that the development of additional senior secondary facilities in Palmerston is the first step. I take then, that this means the building of infrastructure at Palmerston High School. My understanding is based on discussions I have had with several individuals involved in the various schools. In the medium-term, the aim is to have a stand-alone senior campus of Years 10 to 12, either at the existing Palmerston High School site or another site, according to the chairpersons of the schools and the submission they have put together.
The council’s chairpersons have recommended that the process should include continued consultation with teachers, parents and other stakeholders. I would add students to this list as primary stakeholders. I fully endorse the recommendation which has come from the council chairpersons. The consultation process so far has yielded so much; I see consultation with the community as a very positive thing.
During Question Time the minister held up a newspaper article and made reference to 1986. He referred to the students’ strikes of 1985 and the unrest that the change to the entire secondary school system, except Darwin High, caused. I remember that period very well; I was a Year 10 student at Dripstone High School in 1985 and was one of the ones who went on strike. There is one distinct difference between how the changes were implemented then to what is happening now: in 1985 there was no consultation. We were not told until some time during the school year in 1985 that it was all happening in 1986. However, our views were not called for; there was no community consultation then. This is one of the reasons behind my strong support for community consultation and, especially, involvement by the student body.
The Palmerston Council chairpersons recommended that the development of facilities to cater for students with special needs should be an integral part of the implementation of a middle school model, and should be included in all future planning and funding commitments. I fully agree with this recommendation. The Palmerston High School has a special needs facility as part of its existing campus, and they do an excellent job. I have previously referred members to the web site the students have put together which includes information about cane toads. A number of Palmerston’s primary schools provide education for special needs students also. The rights of special needs students are equal to every other student, and I will do what I can to ensure that their needs are part of the planning and funding considerations.
I recently attended a Palmerston Regional Business Association dinner at which representatives of the Red Cross gave a presentation. During the presentation, it was said that 14.5% of Palmerston’s population is aged five years or younger. This is an extremely high proportion of the population, and anyone walking around the shopping centres in Palmerston would not doubt the figure. The council chairpersons from Palmerston, as part of their recommendations, have put to government that it acknowledge that the introduction of middle schooling in Palmerston would only briefly alleviate the capacity issues at primary schools, and that meaningful investment in developing more primary school facilities will be required in the near future.
Discussions I have had with the department indicate that this is accepted. I know from discussions with the minister that middle schools are not seen as a panacea for capacity issues at some of the primary schools in Palmerston. I understand the Rosebery school remains on the forward planning agenda for 2008. I give my commitment to Palmerston residents that I will continue to make sure this government remains aware of the importance of building this facility. I am not saying this should be a primary school or middle school; however, there is no doubt in my mind that the facility is needed.
Finally, the council chairs have put to government that there needs to be a master plan for school facilities in Palmerston. This sounds to me like a very sensible idea and I commend this recommendation to you, minister. I would like to thank the principals and council chairs for their considerable work putting alternative models to government and making the various recommendations. Their input has been extremely valuable and welcome. I also thank them personally for their discussions with me.
Mr STIRLING (Employment, Education and Training): Madam Speaker, I thank all members for their contribution this afternoon. It has been a quite wide-ranging debate, as you would expect, on quite a major reform. I pick up on some issues put forward by the member for Brennan. Why would I not be surprised that he was one of those students on strike in 1985-86? I do not know why I am not surprised; I expect that, as a person of quite strong principles, he would have been exhibiting those principles at a quite early age. I thank him and his colleague, the member for Drysdale, for their work and continued representation to me about educational matters in Palmerston. They stay close to their schools as good local members should, and they are not shy in coming forward and telling me current views and needs, and what ought to happen in their part of the world.
In relation to Rosebery, some thought that it ought to be from Transition all the way through to Year 9 so you would have a primary school plus middle school at the top. However, it was not locked in at all because that decision has to be made in order to advance the design work and bring that all forward. I have this very strong view that that school has to be commenced, construction-wise, well before the end of this current term of government.
The member for Arnhem recently did a quite extensive trip through her electorate. I was pleased to meet with her and Senator Crossin and her staffer, John Prior. John was a principal at Yirrkala and, of course, Trish was a teacher at Yirrkala in years past. Barbara was well served on that road trip through the schools, because she had two quite high-quality former educators with her. Those enthusiastic three are people who know this area and these schools. Senator Crossin could not believe the numbers of students that are in those schools compared to previous experiences. In effecting change in the bush, we are striking the right chord and are getting those students back to school. The challenge is to continue to roll out secondary schooling, which we have been doing.
To go back to the commencement of the debate with the shadow minister on education, he talked about the system regarding the 11- to 14-year-olds needing to be more responsive. That is accepted by parents, and we agree. However, he cannot accept the need to implement this by 2007 – that it is too risky and too inappropriate. We do not share that view, and let me be very clear about that. He asked why we conducted community consultation when the decision has already been made. No decision has been made around implementation. That report from Socom is still not with me. I expect it to come to me and the department within the week, then an analysis of all that feedback, and recommendations by way of a Cabinet submission.
The attacks on the consultant, Sheila O’Sullivan, from Socom, I thought were just uncalled for. She is an excellent facilitator. In fact, he made the comment himself that she is an excellent facilitator in the community engagement process and has done a fantastic job on behalf of government.
He is trying to pretend that there are still issues around the Palmerston High School infrastructure; that we might try to force the students in ahead of the infrastructure needs. Nothing could be further from the truth. As the member for Brennan commented, I have clearly made the statement several times at press conferences and in media releases that we will ensure infrastructure was right before Year 7s move. That is not to say a whole lot of things could not happen around establishing middle schools processes; albeit the Year 7s not making it there in 2007.
I pick up on this so-called alleged abuse of students and teachers on 8HA. I have a bit of a problem with this announcer from 8HA. I understand the member for Araluen has extensive radio time on 8HA, probably up to 30 minutes at a time. Any minister from government who has ever been on that show gets about eight minutes - maybe 10 minutes at best, myself included. I was asked to phone the 8HA studio for an interview with the particular announcer, and to be introduced and then put on line to an open call in. That is fine; that is the minister’s job. However, he ought to have the manners and the courtesy to tell you that you are going to have people from the public calling in rather than just an interview with the announcer, so you are prepared. That is all right, we got into that.
The second caller, presumably, said: ‘Well, thank you very much, minister. See you later’. From a long way away, I heard a voice, and I thought, ‘That is the announcer’, and I hung up. I said: ‘Thank you very much’, and hung up. I am sure that would be on the transcript; I have not bothered to check it: ‘Thank you very much, minister. See you later’. In fact, it was the caller. That gave the announcer a great opportunity to gleefully announce that I had hung up on him, which was far from the truth. When the Office of Central Australia said: ‘What is going on? He is claiming you hung up’, I rang back. The announcer took my call, and his invitation was: ‘Oh, there has been a bit of a misunderstanding. Let us go back on air and clear this up’. So we went back on air. I explained my case. I apologised. There was a view that I hung up deliberately, when it was clear it was the caller and not the announcer who said, ‘Thank you very much, see you later’. I found out over the next three or four days they ran a promo around the program that I had hung up. He invited me back on air to clear it. I will be having issues with this young announcer when I am in Alice Springs next week, and with Radio 8HA, which is not serving its listening public very well when it carries on in a very unprofessional manner such as that, and is absolutely biased.
On the issues around the slow down from the member for Blain said: ‘Slow down Syd’. The Leader of the Opposition said: ‘This is an opportunity for community engagement. You have to show leadership by furthering engaging and further talking’. Let us go back to 15 April 2004 to the big question from Terry Mills as to whether government has the political courage to follow through with the reform that is needed. On 8 June 2004, Richard Lim said: ‘Minister has to decide on senior education’. On 26 August 2004, Dr Lim: ‘Education - community needs certainty’. On 17 December 2004, Dr Lim: ‘Minister continues to procrastinate on secondary education’. On 9 December 2004: ‘The government and this minister do not have the courage to actually implement any of the recommendations’. I save the best for last, Madam Speaker. On 8 September 2005, the member for Blain said: ‘If you are elected, you are elected to lead, which means you make decisions’. Therefore, decision making out the door today, and leadership is about slowing down, engaging in further talking.
In September last year, it was about ‘enough of the talking’. On 30 June this year, on the Daryl Manzie show, Terry Mills said: ‘They will consult to death on an issue such as the education review, leaving no stone unturned’. He said: ‘We have done that, we have done that. We said that is what we would do and we have done it’. However, in September: ‘If you are elected, you are elected to lead, and that means you make decisions’. When we get around to decision-making time, it is all a bit too much for the member for Blain, and he says: ‘No, slow down, Syd. This is an opportunity for community engagement. Show leadership by further engaging’. Forget it, there is such hypocrisy in the captured comments here, they are on the record. He forgets what he said last week. He certainly forgets what he said in September last year and January 2006. On 17 December 2004, that is a fair while ago now, Dr Lim said: ‘Minister continues to procrastinate on secondary education’. He would have us procrastinate another 18 months.
I thank the member for Wanguri for his supportive comments. It is not easy for any of us as members, including me as a local member in Nhulunbuy, around some of these issues. I thank my colleagues for their support in relation to this.
The member for Araluen commented on the opportunity to be receptive. Well, we have been receptive and the fact that you disagree with a group of students saying ‘we are not having Year 10 at Casuarina High School’ does not mean you are not listening. Of course, I am listening because I disagree with them. I respect their right to have a view. They ought to respect the right of government and the minister to have an opposing view, which I do in relation to Year 10. The member for Araluen likes to muddy it all up. She talked about middle schools, middle schooling, and a ‘middling approach’, and it was actually in a press release. A ‘middling approach’ is very close to muddling, but it suggests a do-nothing. A ‘middling approach’ is suggesting a do-nothing approach to me, and nothing else to do with it.
In relation to every student becoming a university student, I do not subscribe to that theory at all. It is about every student achieving to their individual, maximum potential. Whether that is vocational education, apprenticeship, a traineeship, or straight into work, I do not care. Whether it is to Year 12 or university, then okay. I am in the Brendan Nelson school where he is as proud, which he said so publicly - in fact, years before it happened, when he was the first minister for Education - ‘I would be as proud of one of my children becoming an apprentice as I would be if they became a doctor like myself, a lawyer, a nuclear scientist or whatever’. Guess what? One of his boys is doing an apprenticeship, and he is every bit as proud of that lad as he would be if they were studying medicine as he himself did. I am of that school. As long as there is a successful outcome in meaningful employment or still on a path to employment, I am happy.
It is not solely about Year 12. I talked about various other measures of success. It is simply not all about the TER score for university. However, the system as it stands is not allowing our students to achieve to their full potential; otherwise we have to accept our kids are not as bright as the rest of Australia. I do not accept that. I do not accept that for one bit. We have to get behind and support this push.
I was greatly encouraged by the member for Braitling’s comments. I thought it was a terrific contribution and I do not mean to be patronising. I listened very closely to what you had to say. I appreciate your support of middle schools. I probably do not understand enough about change management skills. It is a difficult area. However, I understand the need for adaptive change and whatever change management skills we can bring to the picture.
You said ‘small is better’. I hear what you are saying in relation to a school of 1000 and gang fights and the rest, but small is not better when middle schools are robbed of their very necessary resources in order to feed the senior levels and provide a broader curriculum. Then you still struggle because you have small cohorts of students.
I do not intentionally - and I have never meant to anywhere in the debate - put schools down. That is not my game, but there is a case for honesty in this debate. I have seen claims about schools with excellence. Well, schools of excellence compared to what? They are certainly not schools of excellence compared to South Australia, which we know. Language is at the bottom of the education table in Australia, so they are not schools of excellence unless you are talking in the very narrow context of the Northern Territory.
Year 10 to Centralian College and the transition of Year 10 to senior college is one of those areas that need every bit of change management skill that we can employ. I accept the critical areas of our pastoral care, duty of care responsibilities, to be a part of that change management skill. I believe the stronger duty of care and pastoral care that we will have to bring in, in both Centralian and here at Casuarina Senior College, is as the member for Karama was saying: ‘It will benefit Year 11 and Year 12 students as well’. It will benefit them.
Regarding timetabling, so they do not have two-and-a-half hours free to duck off downtown, or go and do whatever they want, that is a timetabling mechanics issue, a change management issue – it is all of those things. School management will have to be aware of those concerns, given these Year 10s are a year younger. I am very confident the Year 10s, overall, will have the maturity to respond to this, provided we have all of those concerns, as well as those expressed by the member for Braitling, addressed in response to the question of choice touched on by the Leader of the Opposition and the member for Braitling, if you were to amalgamate these two schools to one Alice Springs High School as a middle school, you wipe out choice in a sense of a government school. You have to balance that against creating a middle school of excellence which you would want everyone to aspire to.
On the question of separation and the need for various groups to be kept separate because of family feuds to extended families, I do not dismiss these concerns at all; I take them very seriously, indeed. I know there are these issues within the Alice Springs community. However, I believe from the other side; that there is an opportunity to do something very meaningful in Alice Springs. It is an opportunity to bring the community together. Alice Springs is a relatively small community and there is an opportunity to build consensus and harmonious relationships within the community. It is a bigger question, I accept, than one of simply closing one school and amalgamating it with another; it goes outside the bounds of education. It goes, in some way, to the heart and core of the community of Alice Springs. However, I guess I am putting on the table: should we shy away from an opportunity for community building because we know there are issues between families? We have a role as government to lead. I would be interested - and I think the member for Greatorex touched on Des Rogers – to seek out those type of people. I will be talking again to the member for Braitling, and very closely to my colleague, the member for Stuart, on some of these key individuals to see if I am way out of line here with this thinking, and whether something quite important could be pulled off.
If we maintain separation on these boundaries and these lines, do we in fact perpetuate that separation forever; do we prolong those differences between people rather than bringing people together? They are the issues there: a strongly resourced middle school of excellence versus that loss of choice.
There are a lot of school-age children still on the street, as the member for Braitling informed us, and that is still a concern. I pick up her issue regarding if there are spare periods in the middle of the day would that put more students on the streets. The schools have to work those timetables out so that simply does not occur.
The member for Greatorex, I think, quoted Des Rogers saying this is about cost saving. If amalgamation was to occur - and I give this unequivocal commitment straight out - not one education dollar and cent that goes into the two schools, ANZAC Hill and Alice Springs High School, would be lost. I would make sure that the new middle school, if that is the decision that is taken, would have the opportunity that any savings from amalgamation would go into intensive resourcing, particularly around maintaining those current school programs of value and those student wellbeing counsellors, wellbeing officers, and so on. Des is certainly one of those whom I will be seeking out as to whether I am out on a limb or barking up the wrong tree here in relation to these issues. I do not dismiss those issues at all. While I recognise their critical importance, I ask myself whether there is an opportunity to work through them and bring them together.
Year 10s jeopardizing senior focus was put forward by the member for Greatorex who was feeding back issues he picked up. Some comprehensive high schools - Years 8 to 12 - we know have results up there with Casuarina Senior College, so it is not an educational argument I accept. If it was the case that Year 10s did seriously distract senior studies of Years 11 and 12, would not Casuarina Senior College have the outstanding best results of any school in the Northern Territory? Of course, they would. The evidence does not support that proposition at all.
The Year 10s being leaders of the middle, a suggestion again from the member for Greatorex. To me, that is a bit like Year 7s at the top of Year 6; they look back over their primary or, at Year 10, they look back over their middle. We want to challenge and focus them looking forward. We want Year 8s to be looking forward to middle school, end of middle school - primary school behind them and Year 8 and 9 ahead. We want Year 10s, in a very serious year of first year in the senior school, picking out their course - a mix of vocational education. Year 11 stage one subjects mandated into that Year 10 course puts them on to a good rigorous road for those senior years. We want them integrated with senior years looking ahead, rather than reflective looking back from where they have come from.
‘Will the government listen to the people’ is a common refrain. We have from day one of the process. We have continued to listen. In fact, if I disagree and have a disagreement with a view being put forward somewhere along the line, I would have thought that was further evidence that I am continuing to listen. We will scour all the feedback from the latest round of consultation to ensure all of those views are considered. When you go to a community consultation engagement process such as we have had, undoubtedly many of those views are going to be contradictory. Many of those views are going to undermine some of those others that are put forward. That does not mean that government cannot make decisions, nor does it mean that government has not listened to all of those views put forward. Somewhere along the line, you have to make decisions.
The culture of Centralian College not being appropriate for Year 10 is a similar argument around Casuarina Senior College. The cultural reality of both schools has to be challenged, and they have to adopt and strengthen that pastoral care and duty of care to accommodate Year 10 students. That is a cultural shift, as I said before ...
Mr HENDERSON: A point of order, Madam Speaker!
Mr Stirling: I am sorry. I was trying to be quick.
Mr HENDERSON: I move an extension of time to allow my colleague to conclude his remarks, pursuant to Standing Order 77.
Motion agreed to.
Mr STIRLING: Thank you for your indulgence; I will move as quickly as I can.
I would expect that that cultural shift and that strengthening of pastoral duty of care for Year 10s is, obviously, going to be of benefit because you are going to have better resourcing around that for Years 11 and 12 as well. That is going to be a beneficial effect for all those students.
Member for Nelson, you cannot disagree education is one of the most important gifts in life. The review of primary schooling - my God! Let us get through this one first. He wants to take another chunk before we have finished with secondary schooling. I do not have the concerns, as minister for Education, around primary that we certainly were beginning to have around secondary. That is not to say it ought not to be looked at over time - curriculum, resourcing all of those sorts of matters ought to be reviewed from time to time. However, let us get through this one first.
We do not put Palmerston and Taminmin in the one box. We value both schools, and we are looking to strengthen each of them as we are all schools. An interesting concern - and I have picked it up in my own electorate as well – is the concern around Year 7s and whether there be school SRC - are real issues for families and kids. Some may feel that they have missed out on some things.
I was pleased to hear the member for Nelson relay the efforts some of the teachers at the Palmerston meeting said they would make to ensure that those students were able to adjust through their supportive attitudes.
Taminmin talked about Year 10s as part of senior secondary – a forward looking school and always has been. He said of Casuarina Senior College: ‘If it is not broke, do not fix it’. I am on the record enough about that: it is broke and we are going to fix it. Taminmin has five new classes, IT upgrade, library upgrade, and infrastructure report. I do not have the infrastructure report to hand on just what the full extent of needs of Taminmin High School is but, if parents do not believe the infrastructure is ready, they will not send them there - fair call. We have the same view in Palmerston and in Nhulunbuy. There are going to be issues if the infrastructure is not there and we have to get these infrastructure reports in, in relation to how far we go in implementation.
There is a similar view in Katherine, in fact: the infrastructure has to be there. If it is not ready, parents will expect a delay in that particular school or part of the system until 2008. At the end of that, of course, I still say we have to do what we can in 2007 because, as soon as we make the shift, where possible we strengthen the system as much as we can. We continue to implement the middle years approach, and where infrastructure is problematic in time, move the Year 7s in 2008.
I was interested in the letter from Cliff Fowler which seemed to argue that either system is okay and it does not matter if you have a middle schools approach or you have not, just leave it alone. That is not an option for us. He seemed to, on the one hand argue a clear break from Year 10, 11 and 12, but also that there was a need to reintroduce the Year 10 certificate, the old JSC. I am a bit of a conservative in these things. It might surprise the member for Blain but, in fact, I always thought it was a retrograde step to take away the old junior school certificate. The question is worthy of consideration, albeit not just at the moment. I have little to think on in relation to education without saying we are going to reintroduce a Year 10 certificate. Would a Year 10 certificate be appropriate in the middle schools approach as the first year of senior year? What about a Year 9 certificate? How appropriate would that be at the end of middle schooling? What would it be worth? Would it be deemed worthy of note?
They are fair dinkum suggestions put forward by Cliff Fowler through the member for Nelson and well worthy of consideration. I do not dismiss them, but I do say that I am a little busy just at the moment without taking on that argument. But certainly, the Year 10, and there may still be a role for that into the future.
With those comments, thank you, all members for your contributions. I am pleased on balance to be able to wrap up by saying there is strong support. Everyone spoke about strong support for the middle schools approach, notwithstanding there are issues. I understand there are issues. Once we get into clear air, once decisions are made, then those anxieties and concerns become real, and then you are dealing with reality rather than boxing with shadows. I look forward to the opportunity of putting it out; saying this is where government’s going to go, and then being able to deal in a realistic fashion with those deemed deficiencies, shortcomings, problems coming forward after that.
Motion agreed to; statement noted.
ADJOURNMENT
Mr HENDERSON (Leader of Government Business): Madam Speaker, I move that the Assembly do now adjourn.
Dr LIM (Greatorex): Madam Speaker, tonight I will speak about a very well-known personality who passed away recently. Three years ago, I spoke about his wife, Frances. Today, I want to speak about Clarry Smith, or Clarence Smith. I am making this adjournment using information sent to me by his recent widow, Jo Scheppingen, who married Clarry some 12 months ago.
Clarry was born in Mulgildie, Queensland on 20 March 1936, where his parents owned and operated a bakery. The family then moved around Queensland a little, going to a property in Wallumbilla, and then eventually moving down to Geebung, where Clarry grew up. He attended Virginia State School, and then spent a year at Boondall during the war, and did a scholarship and went to a state school. It was then that he went to the Industrial State High School, before becoming an apprentice motor mechanic with the Department of Works.
In August 1957, Clarry moved to Alice Springs with the Department of Works and, subsequently, became a plant inspector, a job which took him to many parts of the Territory. Clarry and his mate, Dave Fietz, had Land Rovers and would take people out to Kings Canyon. I will come to David Fietz’s eulogy in a little while and tell you the stories of the two men in Central Australia. It was during the time that Clarry was with David, that he met Frances and they married. I will come back to that story before long too.
After Clarry’s marriage to Frances, they lived in Burke Street, which is a few hundred metres down from where I live and currently in the electorate of Greatorex. Clarry’s history is very strongly linked with Alice Springs, with the Olive Pink Botanical Gardens and also with the public service that he served.
David Fietz put this eulogy together, and I would like to read it as best I can with the limited time that I have. David said this:
- Clarry and I both love this country. We became friends when Clarry first arrived in Alice Springs. We were both working for the Department of Works, Clarry as a mechanic and me as a carpenter. We lived in the government hostel on Gap Road, and it was during this time we started exploring the country. Before we could afford our own Land Rovers, we had a standing booking of Jacko’s (that’s Allan Jackson) Land Rover every weekend. We headed out bush every Friday night with 10 passengers loaded in the back, standing room only. We often drove through the night to parts like the Rock and Kings Canyon. Usually, we rolled back into town in the early hours of Monday morning, just in time to turn up at work. In this way, we began our adventuring together.
At this time, sightseeing in the Centre was just opening up, but conditions were still rough, difficult and dangerous. The lack of roads and signposts led many people astray and still others found themselves in trouble in the desert conditions. Someone had to go out and look for those in trouble. This role invariably fell on Clarry and I. As we were often called on in the middle of the night we had our own keys to the butcher’s shop, the petrol bowsers, and the baker would be working. We often also managed to get into the post office to get the mail. We would then obtain our own supplies and provide personal deliveries to the stations en route. We got to know a hell of a lot about the bush and we were considered the local authorities on how to find places.
Clarry’s mechanical knowledge was also vitally recognised. I remember there was always a queue of blokes waiting outside his room at the hostel with broken down motor cars. Clarry would simply issue directions from his bed yelling out: ‘Turn this screw three times’, and so on. Together we cut the first set of wheel tracks to many significant Centralian locations. When we explored the Petermann Ranges together, we adopted the usual mode of travel while bouncing and bumping over the spinifex plains. We would sit on the roof of our Land Rover to catch the breeze with the throttle pulled out and second gear at 6 mph. When the Land Rover got too close to one side of the valley we would give the steering wheel a kick with the foot and hit it towards the other side. Our zig zagging wheel tracks were subsequently followed by others and later when the road was put in it was in exactly our original tracks.
The night before Clarry’s stroke, Clarry and I were recalling a particular rescue from Glen Helen. The message came that some tourists were badly bogged and a woman was seriously injured. We set out armed with a medical kit and a helpful sister to dispense it. We arrived late at night and retrieved both patient and vehicle. The return trip was slow and frequently broken as each bump and dip in the road caused the injured woman, who had broken her collarbone, immense pain. To sustain our own spirits during this long night, Clarry produced a bottle of rum from which we had a nip at each stop, generally while the woman was being sick. As we were making very good progress we suggested to the nurse that a sip of rum might supplement the morphine in alleviating the woman’s pain. When we hit Alice Springs Hospital I remember the sun was just coming up. We were all singing including the woman, but the hospital’s matron certainly wasn’t.
During these rescue expeditions we needed company on the all night drives and found ready volunteers at the hospital where the sisters could always arrange to swap shifts to join us. This soon led to a decree that no sister was allowed to embark on any kind of bush trip unless they were in the responsible hands of Clarry and me. It was on one of these occasions that Frances fatefully set foot in Clarry’s Land Rover for the first time. When the time came for Clarry and Frances to marry, the wedding suits were ordered from David Jones in Sydney. They required measurements to make up the suits. Clarry and I were as usual out bush in the absence of any other suitable device the universal measurement decided on was a Mintie packet - the only thing on hand. A telegram was duly dispatched by the Flying Doctor with our measurements in Mintie packets. We rolled back into town just before the wedding and picked up our suits. Clarry’s fitted perfectly but mine was one Mintie packet too long, which someone quickly rectified with some pins.
In those days, Miss Pink was considered quite cantankerous and did not have many friends especially amongst government workers. But Clarry and I were among the few. When she talked to one of us she always inquired about the other. We were regularly invited to her hut for tea. It must have been fate that Clarry ended up working in her garden. She had been so proud of the work he has done.
A better mate no one could wish for. His larrikin sense of fun and good humour, his ability to fix anything, extensive knowledge and spirit saw the pair of us through many tight spots out bush but also characterised the way he lived his life. He was a stand-in father for me to my only daughter. He was the liveliest and most generous of men. Clarry was happiest when seated by the fire with family and friends, with his pannikin of tea, are the days exploring the country he loved.
The Centralian Advocate wrote a very large article on Clarry including a photograph of him with his typical Clarry Smith smile. I seek leave to ask that the wording within the Centralian Advocate obituary on Clarry be incorporated into Hansard, but more importantly the eulogy delivered by Michael Smith, Clarry’s eldest son. I read through Michael’s eulogy. I feel I am not able to read it through because it will upset me too much. I would ask that …
Mr Acting DEPUTY SPEAKER: Are you seeking leave?
Dr LIM: I seek leave to have Michael Smith’s eulogy and the Centralian Advocate obituary on Clarry incorporated into Hansard. .
Leave granted.
- Michael Smith’s eulogy for Clarry:
First of all I would like to thank you all for coming here today to pay your respects and help as celebrate Clarry’s (Dad’s) full life.
Many people are here today that knew dad from different walks of life, some from his work as a mechanic, then supervisor with Transport and Works. Some knew him in association with sports such as tennis and pistol shooting, and others from their love of the bush and Central Australian plants, with his connection to Olive Pink Flora Reserve and the Society of Growing Australian Plants, and in all these areas he put in extraordinary effort and achieved a lot.
And then … there is his family. And that’s the side I knew and saw. It’s amazing that with all dad achieved he still managed to put so much time and effort into his family.
We were taught and shown to enjoy the simple things in life and to make the most of what you had. How to make your own fun. You didn’t need to spend huge amounts or have the most expensive toys to have a great time.
We spent quite a bit of time out camping and appreciated the outdoors. We had just as good time as anyone … climbing trees, making homemade kites or riding our bikes (well … we are still trying to grow out of that one).
One of my favourite memories was being given things like old radios or an old engine and we would pull them apart to see what was inside and how they worked. I guess, without realising it at the time … this was educational and fun.
I have many memories of us visiting our relatives in NSW and Qld. I am sure though however … that when we went to Brisbane we would leave Grandma’s (Dad’s Mum) place quite a few pounds heavier than we were when we got there … she fed us pretty well.
He did make sure we did the right things and made sure we didn’t get ourselves in too much trouble. I remember when one of us got our first car, dad would not let us drive it, until he was certain it was all fully covered and insured. He would even come down with us to make sure it was done correctly. That’s the way he was … helping others where possible … and he has hopefully passed that on to us.
And that’s the way it was, with Mum and Dad guiding us through our stages in life, through the school years, and … the not always easy teenage years. We then gave them a break for a couple of years … before bringing on the Grandkids.
And then Mum and Dad were transformed to Grandma and Grandad, a role they absolutely relished. Turning up to the grandchildren’s sports days, school concerts and any of their interests such as piano lessons or Tae Quon Do [sic], sporting events or getting them to help out at Olive Pink.
Mum and Dad would turn up to BMX almost every Friday, to watch Stephen, Andrew, Stef and Chris. Although … Mum did wonder if Dad just liked going there for the choc wedge ice-creams … that wasn’t really true … he really did love being there … but couldn’t resist his Friday ice-cream treat as well.
- After mum passed away three years ago, dad was determined to keep the family closeness going. I don’t know how many family get togethers we had at Olive Pink or at one of our places. Every time it was someone’s birthday, child or adult … or we had someone visiting, and if nothing seemed to be happening for a few weeks … well dad would call us … and arrange a get together … just out of the blue … we didn’t need a reason.
To Dad, the family together was so important, so when a huge family reunion was about to happen over in QLD (Big thanks to my Aunty Nancy) Dad went out of his way to encourage us to make sure it was possible for us to go. Well … I guess that’s what you call turning up on the doorstep with airline tickets for us, and saying … I’ll see you there.
Dad then found great friendship with Jo, and she got to join in with the madness and fun and mayhem of being part of our family. Jo has always been a great friend and support to family for many years. In more recent times, it’s difficult to imagine how much more difficult it would have been without this friendship and great support.
Then in September last year Dad fell ill … first having a hugely disabling stroke and then being diagnosed with a brain tumour. BUT!!! even with this up against him, somehow he still managed to keep the family and families bond even closer. Family came from all over the country, and the bonding was incredible from within the family and between families.
The time in Adelaide was a very difficult time, with a lot of uncertainty. But with family and friends visiting and the many phone calls, it all helped us to get through. There were some very precious times, like going next door to the botanic gardens and sitting peacefully with Dad amongst the trees, ponds and birdlife.
I do remember on one occasion however … Thea and Jo going for a walk together and let time get away a bit, staying a bit too long and when they went to leave, they found the garden gates were closed and had to climb over the tall spiky gate, to find out later, the fence just a little further on was a lot lower and they could have almost stepped over to get out. It did give us a giggle ... in what were pretty difficult times.
- When Dad knew that he wouldn’t be getting better, all he wanted to do was to get back home to his family and he did that, in time to be with the family for Christmas. This was such a precious day filled with both sadness and very treasured moments.
After this we would be around visiting Dad every night for tea, and Dad would make a huge effort for us, although exhausted he would stay up with us as long as he could. This got more difficult for Dad as time went on. We would go for family drives when we could, which at times could be quite an ordeal and very tiring for dad. BUT he never complained, not once! He was just happy to be there for us.
Us (his children) visiting was one of the highlight of Dad’s day, but nothing compared to the grandkids visiting and telling him their latest news.
He would absolutely light up when the granddaughters, Lauren and Stef would come to visit. They would come up and give him a kiss on the cheek … and you got to see a bit of the ol’ Clarry smile we all know so well;
Or Bradley would climb on his lap and give him one of his ‘MAGIC’ hugs ( and they were … believe me … I saw the results);
Or Stephen – telling Grandad about him getting his black belt in Tae Quon Do [sic];
Or Andrew – bringing his car over he bought with his own money … with the L-plates he had just got, to show grandad;
Or Chris – telling Grandad he had just got an apprentice job that he really wanted.
And that’s the way Dad was, doing the best he could to keep us close. Even up until his last breath, with his family by his side. That is what he was doing … keeping us together.
Thanks Dad for all you have done for us … at all stages in your life.
We know you are still watching out for us.
We love you always.
Obituary from Centralian Advocate:
Generous man with big heart
Clarry Smith (1936-2006) was curator of Olive Pink Botanic Gardens from 1990 to 2005.
Clarry’s enthusiasm, organising ability, dedication and hard work are reflected in the beauty and integrity of the gardens today.
Clarry came to Central Australia in 1957 as a diesel mechanic employed by the Commonwealth government.
He married nurse Frances Thomas in 1962.
Frances was a part-time employee and volunteer at the garden from 1983 until her death in 2003.
They have three children, all born in Alice.
Clarry became the Olive Pink curator in 1990, and remarried Jo Scheppingen in July 2005.
Passions
He suffered a stroke in September and was unable to return to work.
He was a generous, no nonsense, likeable bloke, well known and widely respected not only in Alice Springs but in the wider network of regional botanic gardens.
Clarry’s passions included pistol shooting, old Landrovers [sic], going bush and the plants of Central Australia.
Clarry worked for Transport and Works in Alice Springs for 35 years as a mechanic, then a plant inspector and as workshop inspector.
This gave him plenty of time out bush under the stars and in places that not many people go, so he could enjoy his love of the bush and the flora and fauna.
He was much respect by the people he worked with, he had a big voice, a big laugh and a big heart.
When Clarry wasn’t out bush, he made a significant contribution to the Alice Springs Pistol Club, Pistol NT and Pistol Australia.
He was an active member right form the inauguration of the Alice Springs Pistol Club in 1959 and seems to have held every available position in the committee.
Clarry’s contribution was recognised by the club when it named the new international standard and the indoor air pistol range after him earlier this year.
Having worked for the government long enough, in 1989 Clarry decided to retire and follow his interest in native plants at the Olive Pink Botanic Garden.
Clarry seems to have become synonymous with both the garden and the Australian Plant Society.
Those who were privileged to be there remember the day that ‘hawk eye’ Smith found the lone seed pod of the acacia picardii at Numery.
Clarry organised, pegged, recorded and maintained plants at the garden until he became ill last September.
Bush trips with Clarry always involved lots of cups of tea, and any stop that looked like it would be more than 10 minutes was an excuse to light a fire and put the bill on.
He was a font of knowledge on flora, fauna, machinery, local history and building all the things we expected our fathers to know.
Clarry has been a big part of the lives of the many people of Alice Springs and will be sadly missed.
Dr LIM: Thank you, Mr Acting Deputy Speaker. Having asked for the papers to be incorporated, I would like to say something from the Centralian Advocate. The headline is, ‘Generous man with a big heart’. I have known Clarence Smith for many years, all the time while he was the curator of the Olive Pink Botanic Gardens. I remember him being very enthusiastic and very keen to make sure that the Olive Pink Botanic Gardens flourish. He worked many long hours trying to get not only the plants together, but also the administration of the organisation. I remember him showing me the plants around the place and he seemed to know a lot of the place, obviously, being the curator there.
His first wife, Frances, passed away. The community, with the blessing of Clarry, sought for the Place Names Committee to name the park behind Clarry’s house at Burke Street that extends from there right through to Kurrajong Drive, the Frances Smith Memorial Park. It is a very large park that people in Kurrajong Drive frequent and enjoy. It has continued to be kept in pristine condition by volunteers, people who have known the Smith family for a long time.
After Frances passed away, a family friend, Jo Scheppingen, kept the association going and, over time, became the next Mrs Clarry Smith. They married in July of last year. Unfortunately, soon after, Clarry suffered a stroke and was later diagnosed to have a fairly aggressive tumour in his brain.
Clarry’s activities in Alice Springs included being involved in the Pistol Shooting Club and also in four-wheel drives and going out bush collecting plants around Central Australia to be then grown in the Olive Pink Botanical Gardens. After having started this work in Alice Springs in 1959, I think I said, he then retired from working for the government eventually in 1989 or thereabouts. When he retired he had the time to then fully devote his life to the flora of Central Australia through his connection with Olive Pink Botanic Gardens. As Dave Fietz said, he was one of the very few people that got on with Miss Pink. I never had the chance to meet Miss Pink, of course. From all the stories I hear, she must have been a fairly severe, intensive, cantankerous old lady. Why, I do not know. Apart from that, she appeared to be a very lovely lady who embraced the environment, the Central Australian aspects of life there. It is amazing that a woman like that could, on the one hand, be such a great leader in the ecology and environment of Alice Springs and, yet, on the other hand, be such a scary person to many kids and senior public servants.
For Clarry, who devoted his remaining years to the Olive Pink Botanic Gardens; he did a fantastic job and will be forever gratefully appreciated by all those people who have known him in Alice Springs, and be sadly missed. I extend my condolences to his family, particularly to Jo Scheppingen, whom I have known for many years.
Mr WOOD (Nelson): Mr Acting Deputy Speaker, I want to talk about a visit to the Darwin prison which I took part in two weeks ago. No, I did not stay in there, member for Daly. With permission from the minister and, with two of his staff, I visited the prison. I wanted to learn about how a prison operated and physically see what the prison looked like. I had visited Wildman River and Alice Springs prison previously and, I must admit, I was a bit remiss in not following that up sooner with a trip to the Darwin prison.
When I was there, the Darwin prison had 405 prisoners, made up of 383 males and 22 females, including 84 on remand. About 80% of those people are indigenous and about 40% of the prisoners have some form of employment.
My initial thoughts when I arrived at the prison on a rainy day was that it was old and dingy. You might ask: so what, it is a prison? However, it is a prison that, to some extent, needs some upgrading. It was built in 1979 and there are certain parts which need to be looked at, and either upgraded, or demolished and rebuilt.
These comments I make are, by no means, fulsome comments. I would like to follow up some of these issues when I have more time. Perhaps I can raise some of these issues as a motion in parliament on General Business Day.
When I entered the prison, I entered the reception area and was met by a number of prison officers who had some viewpoints they wished to put forward, and which I was quite happy to listen to. It was explained to me - and it is fairly obvious when you look at it - that the reception area is far too small and too old. It certainly does not allow any privacy and it is an area which needs an upgrade. It reflects the time it was built and things have to be looked at in that area.
I went over to the remand area. It is strange that, when looking at the prison review that the government presented recently, it said in relation to remand:
- Recommendation 65 … we recommend the construction of a new remand centre be deferred and the funds used to support more urgent needs.
From what I was told, you could not get a more urgent need than building a new remand centre. There are 84 people in remand in a relatively small area, who can be there from one day to two years. They do not have contact with the other prisoners and they do not have access to education facilities, or at least not like the other prisoners do. It seemed to me that it really is a facility that urgently needs to be built with educational facilities attached so that these people who have not yet been found guilty or not guilty of the crime that they are on remand for, actually can have something to do.
We then visited the medical area. That area is where every prisoner who comes in is seen in the first 24 hours. They are checked for heart problems and diabetes and all sorts of ailments that you might expect people to have. They have an annual check up, a dentist visits once a week, an optician, a physio once a week, they can get chest check ups, a nutritionist pops in, mental health every Friday, and a podiatrist once a week. They certainly keep an eye on the medical health of prisoners.
We were taken over to the officers’ recreation room. If you are looking after the welfare of the people you employ to look after our prisoners, then you have to give them facilities which are worthy of that support, and their recreation room, to be honest, was just a smelly dump. The furniture looked like it had been there since 1979, it had a terrible odour and certainly was not the place, if you were a prison officer, in which you would enjoy sitting to have your lunch. It certainly needs a total refit, to be made far more homely and a place where prison officers can enjoy their lunch and have a break from their work.
We also visited the education facilities. We were given a fairly good understanding of the funding that is used to run the education program, and there are some issues that need to be looked at there. There appears to be only one full-time staff and the rest are on contract, which seems to be a problem, because people do not know how long they will be working there. There certainly was a problem with the amount of room that is available; rooms were too small. Those rooms were also used for interviews and for programs. There is very little room to store books. The area, overall, is fairly limiting, because it actually used to be a hall at one stage. One would think that, if education is one of those priorities in a prison, especially when you have 80% indigenous people, that the government should be looking at a purpose-built education facility at Darwin prison. There are some different points of view on where the education program should head; whether they should be promoting the attainment of certificates, or just concentrating on the basics and trying to enable people to have some basic numeracy and literacy skills. Again, it is an area which I believe needs to be looked at more closely.
I then walked to the classifications area. This is the area where prisoners are classified into whether they are maximum, medium, minimum or low security, and I found the staff in that area very friendly. It surprised me that any prisoner can knock on the door and walk into that office, have a discussion with the staff there and talk about various issues that concern them. The classification people, I suppose, are very important from the prisoners’ point of view because, if you can get down to minimum security, or open security, you have a chance of working outside, which a lot of them would like to do instead of being stuck around in a prison.
I visited the kitchen. It is certainly a very big kitchen. Quite a few of the prisoners work there. I would say they enjoy working there because, on occasions, there are some perks in working in a kitchen because, if there is a bit of food left over, I imagine that is one of the good perks about it. From what I saw, they enjoy that kind of work. It is quite a modern kitchen. I was of the understanding that it had been upgraded to some extent since the prison first opened.
We visited the dormitories. I hope my figures are right here, but there were about 10 prisoners in each dormitory, and about 70 prisoners in each block. Those blocks have recreation areas, and prisoners are allowed out between about 8 am and 3 pm. It is low security. Because of the weather - it was pouring rain most the time we were there - we did not look at every block that was there. However, low security people do get out between 8 am and have the advantage of going to bed or going back in their cells a bit later, I think about 11 pm. We had a look at the single cells; they are quite small. We had a concern about some of them having overhead fans and, of course, there has been concern about deaths in custody. However, we found out that if someone tries to attach anything to the fans, they just fall straight off the ceiling. They have been designed so that nothing can be attached to them with any weight. That was interesting to see as well.
There had been a concern that some of the cells did not have fans at all, so on very hot nights it was a fairly difficult place to sleep. They had force-fed air through those cells and, as one of the prison officers said to me, if there was problem with mosquitoes, prisoners can buy mosquito coils from the shop in the prison.
I visited the women’s section and that is one area that certainly needs to be looked at closely. Women prisoners are in the Darwin prison from all parts of the Territory. All classifications get together: that is the maximum, minimum, medium and remand. That is not what happens in the male section of the prison but, for some reason, it is allowed in the female section. The building that the female prisoners are housed in was actually designed as a pre-release facility and not as a gaol. They only get about one class of education a week because they cannot go over to the education buildings that are in the male section. To do that, they have to close their little recreation area down because there are no proper facilities for education. There is very little protection from the weather. Again, it is because the building itself or the main part of the building was not designed for what it is being used for today.
It was a very strange feeling when some of the women prisoners asked the prison officer in charge if they could speak to me. It was an interesting meeting. I had never done anything like that before. These women, obviously, had some issues they wished to raise and they were allowed to do so; and they could say what they liked about their conditions. They had a number of issues. To give you an example, unfortunately, those prisoners who are minimum security are not allowed out in the work gangs. One of the problems is that they are not allowed out with a male driver any more and there is no female driver to take these work gangs out. It is a rule that has just been changed recently. There are women there who should be entitled to go out in the work gangs who cannot go. That is something that needs to be addressed because again, you do not want people bored. You want people to be able to get out and do some work if they are of the category that allows that.
They were concerned there was no policy for women in prison. They were concerned about no incentives to behaving yourself, like automatic remissions. They were concerned about the need for a halfway house; they believe there needed to be a lot more support after leaving prison. They are some of the concerns they had. They also mentioned they never seemed to see anyone from the Department of Justice visiting the place. One of the prison officers told me that they really wonder whether they know of the conditions in Darwin prison.
They are just my broad feelings from my visit there. I was there for four hours and I realise that is not really long enough to get a handle on many of the difficult issues that we have with our prisons. You do not want bored prisoners in gaol. That is the last thing you want. How do you overcome that? You make sure the prison has good education facilities. As I said, many of the people in prison are indigenous. If you can educate them with basic literacy and numeracy, you are helping them be able to fill in forms for themselves and to read books, newspapers and, when they go back to their local communities, they have some basic skills.
There are work gangs that go out from the prison. However, there is not enough work there for everybody. You can work in the kitchen or laundry, but the industries do not appear to be working. There is a small garden, which I could not look at because of the rain.
I have thought about it for a while. One of the concerns when prisons start to do things is that the private industry says: ‘Oh well, you cannot compete with us’. That has happened in Alice Springs where there was a truss factory in the Alice Springs gaol and a company that built trusses in Alice Springs said they could not do that, and they closed it down. There might be an opportunity for private companies to work within the prison. I will be putting forward some of these ideas later. Perhaps government can provide secure areas within the prison, a shed, and they can get companies to do some of their work within that area. A tyre changing company is nearby; perhaps that company could set up a smaller version of what it is doing elsewhere employing prisoners, paying them the full wage, half of which goes to their board and lodging and the other half into a trust account for them when the leave.
There are lots of opportunities for perhaps more sporting facilities and opportunities. Maybe outside football teams could come and play teams at the prison.
Mr Acting Deputy Speaker, I want to talk more on these issues at another time. They are just my initial thoughts on my visit to the prison and I thank all those people who helped me with the visitation.
Mr KNIGHT (Daly): Mr Acting Deputy Speaker, I speak about a fine lady who passed away last week, who spent a lot of her time in my electorate; Mayse Young. She died at age 92 in her home at Pine Creek with her family, for whom it was a very sad time, and for the community and those who knew her.
Mayse was born in Queensland in 1913. This young woman, at 14 years old, arrived in the Northern Territory from Mt Isa with her family and spent years travelling around with her family establishing various businesses throughout her life. A lot has been written about Mayse, and there was an article yesterday in the Northern Territory News by Peter and Sheila Forrest. They summed up most of her life, where she worked and what she did. I will not go over that ground again; I want to talk a bit more about the person and reflections that her family have passed on to me about her.
In her last few days, she did not see her life as a struggle, although it has been reported that way. She saw it as life; it was normal, exciting sometimes, but she saw it as part of things that just happened and got on with her business. She accepted that for her children as well as they grew up in the Northern Territory and, sometimes, in South Australia. They just accepted that the hardships they faced were normal and they did not get upset about them but got on with business.
She was very much a person who loved to have a little joke and spending time with her family. She had seven children and there are a great many grandchildren and great-grandchildren. She enjoyed that big family and was very proud of it. She, obviously, lived by a code and certainly instilled that into her children. Even right to the end she was talking about her children, grandchildren and what they were doing and how they had been a success in their lives.
She returned to Pine Creek after spending time backwards and forwards from Adelaide. She had enough of Adelaide. She had been looking over the ocean and wanted to come back to Pine Creek for the last time and spend the last stage of her life in Pine Creek, around her children and the place where she spent a great deal of her time.
There are a great many stories about here life, and these stories keep are told to her family, since her death, by people the children did not even know. The stories sum up the type of person that Mayse was.
An Aboriginal man from Katherine who would be in his 50s now remembers being brought in from Manbulloo Station as a child. Mayse was running the Katherine Hotel at that time and, for some reason, they were forced to eat rhubarb. The kids objected quite a lot to that. So Mayse mixed in red jelly to encourage the kids to eat rhubarb. This person reflected on that 30 or 40 years after it happened. The memories of Mayse, at that time, were warm.
There are other stories of her in Darwin in her younger years. At that time, she was a keen golfer and got around the town in an old Chevy belonging to a friend of hers. Apparently, there was a few of these Chevies in Darwin at that time and one of them belonged to a minister of the Legislative Council, I believe. They were not very good drivers, apparently, but the police were reluctant to pull up this car because they were not too sure whether it was the minister’s wife driving the car or not. They had a great time.
Mayse was also a keen horse rider and had quite an affinity with the bush. When she came here in the early years - and I will quote from the newspaper; it sums up her feeling for the bush. It says:
- Mayse marvelled at her new environment in the Northern Territory. She said, ‘I spent hours lying in the grass watching the clouds build up and, when the Wet came, we loved playing in the rain’.
I did not miss the company of other children. My life was filled with the bush; it was my entertainment and my teacher.
That sums up how she felt - not of the hardship of the Northern Territory bush, but for the love of it.
Some other stories about Mayse are of her generosity and the way she made people feel. In the early days of Katherine when the Tindal Base was being developed, the workers used to come to Pine Creek, a distance of 90 km, to help her out in the Pine Creek Hotel and play music to the early hours. That is certainly something that they remember.
There is another example of her generosity. Whilst running the Pine Creek Hotel, station hands would come in and hand over their pay cheque to Mayse to allow her to hold it and run it out. One of these guys had been staying there for almost two weeks. He was complaining that she kept on saying he had money left because she never took out board, she would always make sure he was fed, and she would only take out for any drinks that he may have had. She had a huge generosity and it was remembered. That is the key thing with Mayse, and something that, obviously, her children, grandchildren and great-grandchildren have in them.
I pay my respects to Mayse tonight. I do not think that I can do her justice. I met her several times but do not feel that I truly knew her. I know her children and they are fine people. That is a credit to Mayse. Her service will be on Thursday and I will be going to pay my respects to her and honour her memory, and pay my respects to her family.
Motion agreed to; the Assembly adjourned.
Last updated: 04 Aug 2016