Mrs MILLER - 2007-05-02
Twice this week you have been caught out denying public statements that you made. On the first occasion, you were caught deceiving the Chamber of Commerce over public service numbers and, again yesterday, when you did not tell the truth in this House about comments you made to the ABC about the McArthur River Mine debacle ...
Mr HENDERSON: A point of order; Madam Speaker! The member for Katherine well knows that she cannot accuse any member of this House of not telling the truth or lying in this House unless she does so by way of substantive motion. I ask her to withdraw the comments that my colleague has not told the truth in this House.
Mrs MILLER: Madam Speaker, I did not call him a liar.
Madam SPEAKER: I ask you to withdraw the comments about deceit and the other comments, member for Katherine, and reword the question.
Mrs MILLER: Certainly, Madam Speaker. Treasurer, twice this week you have been caught out denying public statements you have made. On the first occasion, you were publicly castigated for making misleading promises to the Chamber of Commerce over public service numbers and, again yesterday, when in this House, you denied making comments that you had made to the ABC about the McArthur River Mine debacle. If you cannot tell the truth to the Chamber of Commerce and you cannot be straight with this parliament, what hope does your credibility have when you are trying to sell your budget?
ANSWER
Madam Speaker, I thank the member for Katherine for her question. If she saw the NT News today: ‘Business says it’s a Stirling effort’. Some days after calling for the Treasurer’s resignation, they commended the budget and say it is a ‘stirling’ budget.
Let us have a look at these staffing numbers. This quote I made at the luncheon last year to the Chamber of Commerce that ‘I will go he’, was read by one Chris Young as a commitment or a promise to resign if numbers did not come down. He is the only person I have heard, apart from the member for Katherine, who thinks the statement ‘I will go he’ means ‘I will resign’. In fact, the journalists of the Northern Territory, being of a somewhat younger generation than I, profess to having never heard the term let alone understanding it to mean ‘I will resign’. They were totally unfamiliar with the term.
When another business person was asked by Channel 9 what they thought, and were they at the lunch last year, they said yes. When asked if they heard the Treasurer make this statement, they said yes. They were then asked if they thought it would mean I would resign. The comment from that business person was: ‘I am not Chris Young’. My case rests on that example. Did I lie? Did I misrepresent the facts to the Chamber of Commerce? Did I break a commitment in the sense that I would resign if numbers did not come down? No, on all those counts.
In fact, we are now tracking, as acknowledged by the Chamber of Commerce, along that very commitment. The number of public servants increased by approximately 89 between March 2006 and March 2007; that is, across the board in the public sector of some 15 000 public servants. If we look at the nature or the make-up of the increase there were: 62 police, four Aboriginal Community Police Officers, so 66 police; 21 or 23 doctors; and in the order of 54 or 55 nurses.
Is there anyone sitting on the opposition benches who does not think we should have extra police? No, they agree with that. That we should not have extra doctors? No, they agree with that. That we should not have extra nurses? No, they agree with that. Yet, with those 140 people extra in absolute key service delivery areas, the public sector has gone up by 89 across the board. What does it tell you? It tells you that the public sector has shed 51 jobs, somewhere, across the board in the other areas which means, as the Chamber of Commerce agreed in the paper today, that government is tracking along that commitment. We do not back away from increasing service delivery numbers. We do not back away from the commitment to put 100 young Territorians into the public sector over the next 12 months, to give them skills to then release them into the private sector. Rather than just riding the private sector to produce skilled young Territorians job ready into the workforce, the government is joining that commitment as well. Of course, that will drive up numbers. They will be in there for 12 months while they get those necessary skills, and then they will be out into the private sector.
In relation to the comment on McArthur River, the comment was made at a press conference within an hour of the decision being handed down. At that stage, I had not even seen a brief, let alone had a briefing from Justice. In fact, senior lawyers from Justice were still analysing the decision to pick up exactly what the bottom line was, what it meant, before it came to me by way a brief. I was asked for a comment and I said, along the lines - and we can get the transcript, I do not have it with me but I am happy …
Mrs Miller: I have it here.
Mr STIRLING: Yes, you have the transcript of what was said on the news. I want the transcript of what was actually said.
The comment was along the lines of the court may have found, and may believe, that the government has not followed proper process. It was not an opinion from me that government did not follow proper process; it was expressing a view that that may be what the decision contained. We will get the transcript down here and I will table it, because we have the full transcript of what was said. If you chop off a couple of words at the start of the sentence you get an entirely different meaning.
That is why there was no misleading here. I never expressed a view that government had made an error in this at all. Government followed its processes and, even now - notwithstanding Justice Angel and the Supreme Court’s decision that this government and everyone has to live with - we respect the court’s decision. However, we do believe, and we maintain that, notwithstanding Justice Angel’s interpretation of the act - and he is a Supreme Court judge who has delivered a ruling in this - all proper process was followed in relation to every aspect of the authorisation of the McArthur River Mine conversion.
Madam Speaker, in relation to the first one, apparently there are two people in the Northern Territory now who believe ‘I will go he’ means I will resign – that is Chris Young, and the second person is the member for Katherine. Even the Chamber understands what we are doing regarding numbers in the public sector. They understand that we will be operating and working over the next three years to drive down, in a very modest way, reductions in back office staff, administrative areas, where we can find - and we will be challenging chief executive officers and their senior management to find - smarter ways of carrying out those sorts of activities but, at the same time, continuing to drive police, doctors, nurses and teachers where required into the system.
Mr HENDERSON: A point of order; Madam Speaker! The member for Katherine well knows that she cannot accuse any member of this House of not telling the truth or lying in this House unless she does so by way of substantive motion. I ask her to withdraw the comments that my colleague has not told the truth in this House.
Mrs MILLER: Madam Speaker, I did not call him a liar.
Madam SPEAKER: I ask you to withdraw the comments about deceit and the other comments, member for Katherine, and reword the question.
Mrs MILLER: Certainly, Madam Speaker. Treasurer, twice this week you have been caught out denying public statements you have made. On the first occasion, you were publicly castigated for making misleading promises to the Chamber of Commerce over public service numbers and, again yesterday, when in this House, you denied making comments that you had made to the ABC about the McArthur River Mine debacle. If you cannot tell the truth to the Chamber of Commerce and you cannot be straight with this parliament, what hope does your credibility have when you are trying to sell your budget?
ANSWER
Madam Speaker, I thank the member for Katherine for her question. If she saw the NT News today: ‘Business says it’s a Stirling effort’. Some days after calling for the Treasurer’s resignation, they commended the budget and say it is a ‘stirling’ budget.
Let us have a look at these staffing numbers. This quote I made at the luncheon last year to the Chamber of Commerce that ‘I will go he’, was read by one Chris Young as a commitment or a promise to resign if numbers did not come down. He is the only person I have heard, apart from the member for Katherine, who thinks the statement ‘I will go he’ means ‘I will resign’. In fact, the journalists of the Northern Territory, being of a somewhat younger generation than I, profess to having never heard the term let alone understanding it to mean ‘I will resign’. They were totally unfamiliar with the term.
When another business person was asked by Channel 9 what they thought, and were they at the lunch last year, they said yes. When asked if they heard the Treasurer make this statement, they said yes. They were then asked if they thought it would mean I would resign. The comment from that business person was: ‘I am not Chris Young’. My case rests on that example. Did I lie? Did I misrepresent the facts to the Chamber of Commerce? Did I break a commitment in the sense that I would resign if numbers did not come down? No, on all those counts.
In fact, we are now tracking, as acknowledged by the Chamber of Commerce, along that very commitment. The number of public servants increased by approximately 89 between March 2006 and March 2007; that is, across the board in the public sector of some 15 000 public servants. If we look at the nature or the make-up of the increase there were: 62 police, four Aboriginal Community Police Officers, so 66 police; 21 or 23 doctors; and in the order of 54 or 55 nurses.
Is there anyone sitting on the opposition benches who does not think we should have extra police? No, they agree with that. That we should not have extra doctors? No, they agree with that. That we should not have extra nurses? No, they agree with that. Yet, with those 140 people extra in absolute key service delivery areas, the public sector has gone up by 89 across the board. What does it tell you? It tells you that the public sector has shed 51 jobs, somewhere, across the board in the other areas which means, as the Chamber of Commerce agreed in the paper today, that government is tracking along that commitment. We do not back away from increasing service delivery numbers. We do not back away from the commitment to put 100 young Territorians into the public sector over the next 12 months, to give them skills to then release them into the private sector. Rather than just riding the private sector to produce skilled young Territorians job ready into the workforce, the government is joining that commitment as well. Of course, that will drive up numbers. They will be in there for 12 months while they get those necessary skills, and then they will be out into the private sector.
In relation to the comment on McArthur River, the comment was made at a press conference within an hour of the decision being handed down. At that stage, I had not even seen a brief, let alone had a briefing from Justice. In fact, senior lawyers from Justice were still analysing the decision to pick up exactly what the bottom line was, what it meant, before it came to me by way a brief. I was asked for a comment and I said, along the lines - and we can get the transcript, I do not have it with me but I am happy …
Mrs Miller: I have it here.
Mr STIRLING: Yes, you have the transcript of what was said on the news. I want the transcript of what was actually said.
The comment was along the lines of the court may have found, and may believe, that the government has not followed proper process. It was not an opinion from me that government did not follow proper process; it was expressing a view that that may be what the decision contained. We will get the transcript down here and I will table it, because we have the full transcript of what was said. If you chop off a couple of words at the start of the sentence you get an entirely different meaning.
That is why there was no misleading here. I never expressed a view that government had made an error in this at all. Government followed its processes and, even now - notwithstanding Justice Angel and the Supreme Court’s decision that this government and everyone has to live with - we respect the court’s decision. However, we do believe, and we maintain that, notwithstanding Justice Angel’s interpretation of the act - and he is a Supreme Court judge who has delivered a ruling in this - all proper process was followed in relation to every aspect of the authorisation of the McArthur River Mine conversion.
Madam Speaker, in relation to the first one, apparently there are two people in the Northern Territory now who believe ‘I will go he’ means I will resign – that is Chris Young, and the second person is the member for Katherine. Even the Chamber understands what we are doing regarding numbers in the public sector. They understand that we will be operating and working over the next three years to drive down, in a very modest way, reductions in back office staff, administrative areas, where we can find - and we will be challenging chief executive officers and their senior management to find - smarter ways of carrying out those sorts of activities but, at the same time, continuing to drive police, doctors, nurses and teachers where required into the system.
Last updated: 09 Aug 2016