Ms MARTIN - 1995-11-23
I refer to the new industrial regime set in place in the Department of Correctional Services. This new regime has included locking out workers in Alice Springs for the sin of demanding safety in the workplace, and forcing the overcrowding of Darwin Prison because workers at Gunn Point are seeking an extra 36 an hour. Can the minister explain to the House whether this is the new direction that the Chief Minister wanted introduced in the Department of Correctional Services when he sacked the previous chief executive officer? If so, does this mean that we can expect more industrial trouble in our prison system?
ANSWER
Mr Speaker, before I answer the question, I will correct 2 totally incorrect statements made by the member. She needs to be chided either for not taking the time to check out the facts that she has presented or for trying deliberately to mislead the community. Firstly, no officer was locked out of Alice Springs Prison.
Ms Martin: They simply could not get in.
Mr MANZIE: If the member wants to answer her own question, that is fine, but I thought she asked the question of me because she wanted an answer from me. I am simply
Page 1045
telling her that no prison officer was locked out of Alice Springs Prison. In fact, they all went to work the following day without any change in any of the processes. They decided that they would not enter the prison while they had to follow the processes and instructions of the Superintendent of the prison. They made that choice. No one except fools would advocate that people can work in a disciplined service on the basis that they do not do what they are told and refuse to follow instructions. That is not sensible.
Members interjecting.
Mr MANZIE: Simply understand that they were not locked out. Any claim that they were is a lie. If the member wants to perpetuate lies, that is fine, but I think she should establish what the truth is. The matter will be settled at an Arbitration Tribunal hearing.
Mr BELL: A point of order, Mr Speaker! The minister does this all the time. He cannot talk about members of this Assembly perpetuating lies except by way of a substantive motion.
Mr SPEAKER: I ask the minister to withdraw the inference.
Mr MANZIE: Mr Speaker, I withdraw the allegation that the honourable member for Fannie Bay perpetuates lies. I will say that she continues to ...
Mr Bell: Mr Speaker!
Mr SPEAKER: I asked the minister to withdraw the inference.
Mr MANZIE: I withdrew initially, Mr Speaker. I do not understand why the member for MacDonnell is on his feet ...
Mr Bell: Unreservedly!
Mr MANZIE: ... except that he is trying to protect the member for Fannie Bay, who has made a fool of herself by following a story-line which ...
Mr BELL: A point of order, Mr Speaker! He is refusing to withdraw it and ...
Mr SPEAKER: Order! The minister has withdrawn.
Members interjecting.
Mr MANZIE: He makes so much noise that he does not know what is going on around him. If he had another brain, his head would rattle. I digress.
The other allegation, that Darwin Prison is being overloaded deliberately as a result of an industrial regime again has no basis in truth. What has occurred at Darwin Prison and what occurred with Gunn Point occurred as a result of prison officers deciding that they wished to have a further allowance when they are required to remain at the Gunn Point facility overnight. There is a regime in place whereby officers at Gunn Point are at that facility for a certain
Page 1046
period of time. They work a shift and then remain at the centre in airconditioned accommodation that is provided for that purpose. They are provided with 3 excellent meals each day, and they receive an allowance and an additional 35% salary loading whilst they are working there. When they decided that they wished the allowance to be increased, they made the threat that they would not stay at the Gunn Point facility overnight, and the officers who were rostered to work that night said that they would refuse to man the prison while other officers were not staying there on emergency call.
Under those circumstances, management was required to make a decision. There were 35 prisoners in the Gunn Point facility and the 2 officers on duty said they would not work if no other officers were there. As a result, a number of prisoners were removed from Gunn Point. I think the number there was reduced to 19 or that 19 were moved to Darwin Prison, leaving a number of prisoners that could be guarded satisfactorily by the 2 officers who were on duty. As a consequence, there is movement of prisoners every day from Darwin Prison to Gunn Point. The only reason that those prisoners were removed from Gunn Point was because the officers refused to guard them. It had nothing to do with an industrial regime. If officers refuse to guard prisoners, it would be unreasonable to leave unguarded prisoners at Gunn Point. Obviously, the member for Fannie Bay agrees that that is the case.
One has to realise that the member for Fannie Bay is following the union line, probably because it is mixed up with her bread and butter, the costs of her election and the obedience that members of the ALP owe to follow blindly where the unions lead. However, the government has a responsibility to ensure ...
Mr Bailey interjecting.
Mr MANZIE: Mr Speaker, that was a brilliant contribution from the member for Wanguri. `Throw in the methadone program', he says. That is the level of intelligence he brings to debate. The man is not really fit to hold office. Unfortunately, he does, but a growing number of people in the community are starting to question whether or not he should.
In terms of operating a prison service, the first priority is the safety of the community.
Members interjecting.
Mr MANZIE: The safety of the community is a joke for members opposite. They have a bit of a laugh when it is mentioned. However, the safety of the community is a priority. The safety and wellbeing of the prisoners themselves is the second priority. The third priority is the wellbeing and safety of the officers involved. There is no intention to resile from any of those levels. However, the management of the Department of Correctional Services will not be told how to operate on a daily basis by some members of a union.
The new management regime has requested consistently that the union participate in a formalised consultation process to try to work out the changes which will occur over the next few months with the development of the new Alice Springs Prison. Numerous letters have been written to the union requesting it to participate in a consultation process, but it has refused consistently to answer those letters. I do not think the members of the union, the ordinary officers, know what is happening. Obviously, their delegates are not telling them. I
Page 1047
request all prison officers to find out what is happening and what their union delegates are not telling them. They should instruct their delegates to stop being pedantic about matters which are long past. Instead, they should look at what will happen in the future, particularly the changes that will have to occur over the next 6 months in relation to what is occurring with the development of the new prison at Alice Springs; and the changes that will be required in relation to operating low security prisons in the Top End. They should become involved in discussions about the industrial processes that will be required, including the processes of change in relation to operating prisons, training levels and a move to professionalism. The prison officers should become involved in all those matters because their delegates are not being fair dinkum. If the rubbish that the member for Fannie Bay came up with is indicative of the information that is being given to other people, they may have a problem. They should become involved because this is a pretty important area.
We have a responsibility to ensure the safety of the community in relation to our prisons but, by the same token, we will not roll over and have those prisons operate in a way which is not best practice. We have a responsibility to the community to ensure that our prison system operates by best practice. In fact, there is no reason why our prison system cannot be a model for the rest of the country. We will try to ensure that it becomes that.
I ask the officers to cooperate. Certain of them are cooperating, but a number are not aware of what is occurring. I ask the union members to stop playing games and to become involved in the process of change, not only by cooperating but by leading the way into the future. We must involve everyone. We have a responsibility to the community to proceed in a way which will maximise the benefits to the community in the operation of our prisons.
Page 1048
ANSWER
Mr Speaker, before I answer the question, I will correct 2 totally incorrect statements made by the member. She needs to be chided either for not taking the time to check out the facts that she has presented or for trying deliberately to mislead the community. Firstly, no officer was locked out of Alice Springs Prison.
Ms Martin: They simply could not get in.
Mr MANZIE: If the member wants to answer her own question, that is fine, but I thought she asked the question of me because she wanted an answer from me. I am simply
Page 1045
telling her that no prison officer was locked out of Alice Springs Prison. In fact, they all went to work the following day without any change in any of the processes. They decided that they would not enter the prison while they had to follow the processes and instructions of the Superintendent of the prison. They made that choice. No one except fools would advocate that people can work in a disciplined service on the basis that they do not do what they are told and refuse to follow instructions. That is not sensible.
Members interjecting.
Mr MANZIE: Simply understand that they were not locked out. Any claim that they were is a lie. If the member wants to perpetuate lies, that is fine, but I think she should establish what the truth is. The matter will be settled at an Arbitration Tribunal hearing.
Mr BELL: A point of order, Mr Speaker! The minister does this all the time. He cannot talk about members of this Assembly perpetuating lies except by way of a substantive motion.
Mr SPEAKER: I ask the minister to withdraw the inference.
Mr MANZIE: Mr Speaker, I withdraw the allegation that the honourable member for Fannie Bay perpetuates lies. I will say that she continues to ...
Mr Bell: Mr Speaker!
Mr SPEAKER: I asked the minister to withdraw the inference.
Mr MANZIE: I withdrew initially, Mr Speaker. I do not understand why the member for MacDonnell is on his feet ...
Mr Bell: Unreservedly!
Mr MANZIE: ... except that he is trying to protect the member for Fannie Bay, who has made a fool of herself by following a story-line which ...
Mr BELL: A point of order, Mr Speaker! He is refusing to withdraw it and ...
Mr SPEAKER: Order! The minister has withdrawn.
Members interjecting.
Mr MANZIE: He makes so much noise that he does not know what is going on around him. If he had another brain, his head would rattle. I digress.
The other allegation, that Darwin Prison is being overloaded deliberately as a result of an industrial regime again has no basis in truth. What has occurred at Darwin Prison and what occurred with Gunn Point occurred as a result of prison officers deciding that they wished to have a further allowance when they are required to remain at the Gunn Point facility overnight. There is a regime in place whereby officers at Gunn Point are at that facility for a certain
Page 1046
period of time. They work a shift and then remain at the centre in airconditioned accommodation that is provided for that purpose. They are provided with 3 excellent meals each day, and they receive an allowance and an additional 35% salary loading whilst they are working there. When they decided that they wished the allowance to be increased, they made the threat that they would not stay at the Gunn Point facility overnight, and the officers who were rostered to work that night said that they would refuse to man the prison while other officers were not staying there on emergency call.
Under those circumstances, management was required to make a decision. There were 35 prisoners in the Gunn Point facility and the 2 officers on duty said they would not work if no other officers were there. As a result, a number of prisoners were removed from Gunn Point. I think the number there was reduced to 19 or that 19 were moved to Darwin Prison, leaving a number of prisoners that could be guarded satisfactorily by the 2 officers who were on duty. As a consequence, there is movement of prisoners every day from Darwin Prison to Gunn Point. The only reason that those prisoners were removed from Gunn Point was because the officers refused to guard them. It had nothing to do with an industrial regime. If officers refuse to guard prisoners, it would be unreasonable to leave unguarded prisoners at Gunn Point. Obviously, the member for Fannie Bay agrees that that is the case.
One has to realise that the member for Fannie Bay is following the union line, probably because it is mixed up with her bread and butter, the costs of her election and the obedience that members of the ALP owe to follow blindly where the unions lead. However, the government has a responsibility to ensure ...
Mr Bailey interjecting.
Mr MANZIE: Mr Speaker, that was a brilliant contribution from the member for Wanguri. `Throw in the methadone program', he says. That is the level of intelligence he brings to debate. The man is not really fit to hold office. Unfortunately, he does, but a growing number of people in the community are starting to question whether or not he should.
In terms of operating a prison service, the first priority is the safety of the community.
Members interjecting.
Mr MANZIE: The safety of the community is a joke for members opposite. They have a bit of a laugh when it is mentioned. However, the safety of the community is a priority. The safety and wellbeing of the prisoners themselves is the second priority. The third priority is the wellbeing and safety of the officers involved. There is no intention to resile from any of those levels. However, the management of the Department of Correctional Services will not be told how to operate on a daily basis by some members of a union.
The new management regime has requested consistently that the union participate in a formalised consultation process to try to work out the changes which will occur over the next few months with the development of the new Alice Springs Prison. Numerous letters have been written to the union requesting it to participate in a consultation process, but it has refused consistently to answer those letters. I do not think the members of the union, the ordinary officers, know what is happening. Obviously, their delegates are not telling them. I
Page 1047
request all prison officers to find out what is happening and what their union delegates are not telling them. They should instruct their delegates to stop being pedantic about matters which are long past. Instead, they should look at what will happen in the future, particularly the changes that will have to occur over the next 6 months in relation to what is occurring with the development of the new prison at Alice Springs; and the changes that will be required in relation to operating low security prisons in the Top End. They should become involved in discussions about the industrial processes that will be required, including the processes of change in relation to operating prisons, training levels and a move to professionalism. The prison officers should become involved in all those matters because their delegates are not being fair dinkum. If the rubbish that the member for Fannie Bay came up with is indicative of the information that is being given to other people, they may have a problem. They should become involved because this is a pretty important area.
We have a responsibility to ensure the safety of the community in relation to our prisons but, by the same token, we will not roll over and have those prisons operate in a way which is not best practice. We have a responsibility to the community to ensure that our prison system operates by best practice. In fact, there is no reason why our prison system cannot be a model for the rest of the country. We will try to ensure that it becomes that.
I ask the officers to cooperate. Certain of them are cooperating, but a number are not aware of what is occurring. I ask the union members to stop playing games and to become involved in the process of change, not only by cooperating but by leading the way into the future. We must involve everyone. We have a responsibility to the community to proceed in a way which will maximise the benefits to the community in the operation of our prisons.
Page 1048
Last updated: 09 Aug 2016