Mr ADAMSON - 1995-08-15
The opposition spokesperson on housing was quoted this morning as saying that the reason Housing Commission rents are increasing is that the Northern Territory government has been unable to negotiate a good deal with the Commonwealth. Is this actually the case?
ANSWER
Mr Speaker, I heard that comment this morning and I was absolutely flabbergasted. At first, I thought that, because the member for Fannie Bay has not been a member for very long, perhaps she does not know, but then I realised that that was not the case.
Mr Stirling: How patronising.
Mr Bell: You have not been Minister for Housing for too long. I say that because you do not know too much about the Commonwealth State Housing Agreement, judging by your comments this morning.
Mr SPEAKER: Order!
Mr MANZIE: This is a situation where the Northern Territory branch of the Australian Labor Party is trying to make excuses for the abominable behaviour of the Australian Labor Party in federal government. All Territorians should be very clear about this. We negotiated - and I use that term very loosely, because the negotiation offer was really that we could take it or leave it. We moved from a position where Territorians were being funded to
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the tune of $56m a year for housing to a position where we received $13m for housing and were required to transfer $11m of that immediately into the repayment of loan funds, which are a legacy of the previous Commonwealth administration of the Territory, leaving $2m for capital expenditure.
Mr Bell: Twenty years ago! Good grief, when will you accept responsibility for the money ...
Mr MANZIE: I will demonstrate just how interested the Northern Territory branch of the Australian Labor Party was in this particular renegotiation, which took place in 1989. We all remember very well how the Labor Party's housing spokesman, at that time the Leader of the Opposition, Terry Smith, pooh-poohed the loan scheme that we had operating. It was one of the best loan schemes in the country. He ran down to Canberra and tried to get the federal government to stop it because it was too successful. Territorians were achieving home ownership, and that was contrary to the opposition's policies because it wanted to keep people in begging mode. Terry Smith was told that it was a legal loan scheme under the terms of the CSHA. What did he do? He put pressure on his masters to change the rules. Thus, as well as losing about $35m, we lost the ability to be flexible with the most successful loan scheme in the country because the federal government changed the rules to eliminate it. That was the sort of contribution that was made.
Another point is very important to remember. Changes were forced upon us. Everyone has to be means tested to be able to go into a Housing Commission house. That sounds pretty good because public housing should be for those who need it. However, again, that requirement ignores the situation we inherited at self-government whereby almost all housing was publicly owned. A person could not even buy a block of land. There was no freehold land tenure. The form of tenure was a 99-year lease. People could not obtain land. A government auction would be held every 12 months, and a few rich people could afford to buy a block of land. Ordinary Territorians could not get a leg in.
A member: There was no title.
Mr MANZIE: There was no title at all.
Changes were made, and the Commonwealth disregarded the historical situation as a consequence of which we had been trying desperately to reduce the very high percentage of public housing ownership in the Territory ...
Mr Bell interjecting.
Mr MANZIE: ... because the Labor Party tries to treat the Territory as it treats the rest of Australia regardless of our historical situation.
Mr Bell: Good grief! How short a memory you have, Daryl!
Mr SPEAKER: Order!
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Mr MANZIE: The member for MacDonnell makes a great deal of noise. He is embarrassed by the utterances of his party's spokesperson on housing ...
Mr Bell: No.
Mr MANZIE: ... and he is trying to prevent the community from being reminded of Labor's abysmal performance in the housing area.
We had to cop means testing. As a result, at the present time, 20% of housing is still publicly owned. That is a disgraceful situation. In other parts of the country, about 5% of housing is owned publicly. We have a situation in which many Territorians live in publicly-owned housing, yet these people encourage the situation which requires that we move to full market rentals. In the Territory - again, because of these historical reasons - market rentals continue to be very high. At present, we have problems turning off land for residential development because of the native title requirements. We warned the federal government that those requirements would slow down the release of land. The mechanisms put in place prohibit movement of land and increase the costs. Did members opposite examine that? Did they support changes to the administrative processes in relation to native title to enable land to continue to be turned off? They certainly did not.
Historically, we have massive public ownership of housing. At that time, the Labor leader went to Canberra to ensure that the federal government changed the loan scheme. The Labor Party supported a process that saw housing funding to the Territory drop from $56m to $13m. We had to move to market rentals. Since Hon Warren Snowdon has been the federal member for the Northern Territory, we have seen an abysmal performance by the federal Labor government in regard to housing. That was the icing on the cake.
The Northern Territory was the last state or territory to sign the Commonwealth State Housing Agreement. Why did we sign it? Because we were told that, if we did not sign it, we would receive nothing - not a brass razoo. What a way to negotiate! The Commonwealth said that, if we did not sign, we would miss out altogether. Therefore, rather than miss out even on the miserly $2m, we signed. At present, we are renegotiating the agreement. Would members believe that the Commonwealth's first offer meant that we would have to write a cheque to it for $6.5m? Do members reckon that we will cop that? No way!
What do we hear from the opposition? They say that we are not negotiating a very good deal. The member for Fannie Bay has a great deal to learn. I ask her to be very careful about what she says publicly because some of her public announcements have caused a great deal of heartache to Territorians. I remind her of the claims she made about pensioner rents. She went on radio and said that pensioner rents would rise by $60-odd a week. Many pensioners were shattered to hear that. It caused them a great deal of heartache. She has to be careful. She has a job to do now, and she has to do some research and be a little honest.
Mr Bell: You have never done any of that. You are the laziest minister this government has ever seen!
Mr Bailey: That is why you are in the back row.
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Mr SPEAKER: Order!
Mr MANZIE: If she intends to be an apologist for the behaviour of the Australian Labor Party in the federal government and for the federal member, Warren Snowdon, she will be attacked for it. I deplore those comments and I ask her to do a little research.
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ANSWER
Mr Speaker, I heard that comment this morning and I was absolutely flabbergasted. At first, I thought that, because the member for Fannie Bay has not been a member for very long, perhaps she does not know, but then I realised that that was not the case.
Mr Stirling: How patronising.
Mr Bell: You have not been Minister for Housing for too long. I say that because you do not know too much about the Commonwealth State Housing Agreement, judging by your comments this morning.
Mr SPEAKER: Order!
Mr MANZIE: This is a situation where the Northern Territory branch of the Australian Labor Party is trying to make excuses for the abominable behaviour of the Australian Labor Party in federal government. All Territorians should be very clear about this. We negotiated - and I use that term very loosely, because the negotiation offer was really that we could take it or leave it. We moved from a position where Territorians were being funded to
Page 687
the tune of $56m a year for housing to a position where we received $13m for housing and were required to transfer $11m of that immediately into the repayment of loan funds, which are a legacy of the previous Commonwealth administration of the Territory, leaving $2m for capital expenditure.
Mr Bell: Twenty years ago! Good grief, when will you accept responsibility for the money ...
Mr MANZIE: I will demonstrate just how interested the Northern Territory branch of the Australian Labor Party was in this particular renegotiation, which took place in 1989. We all remember very well how the Labor Party's housing spokesman, at that time the Leader of the Opposition, Terry Smith, pooh-poohed the loan scheme that we had operating. It was one of the best loan schemes in the country. He ran down to Canberra and tried to get the federal government to stop it because it was too successful. Territorians were achieving home ownership, and that was contrary to the opposition's policies because it wanted to keep people in begging mode. Terry Smith was told that it was a legal loan scheme under the terms of the CSHA. What did he do? He put pressure on his masters to change the rules. Thus, as well as losing about $35m, we lost the ability to be flexible with the most successful loan scheme in the country because the federal government changed the rules to eliminate it. That was the sort of contribution that was made.
Another point is very important to remember. Changes were forced upon us. Everyone has to be means tested to be able to go into a Housing Commission house. That sounds pretty good because public housing should be for those who need it. However, again, that requirement ignores the situation we inherited at self-government whereby almost all housing was publicly owned. A person could not even buy a block of land. There was no freehold land tenure. The form of tenure was a 99-year lease. People could not obtain land. A government auction would be held every 12 months, and a few rich people could afford to buy a block of land. Ordinary Territorians could not get a leg in.
A member: There was no title.
Mr MANZIE: There was no title at all.
Changes were made, and the Commonwealth disregarded the historical situation as a consequence of which we had been trying desperately to reduce the very high percentage of public housing ownership in the Territory ...
Mr Bell interjecting.
Mr MANZIE: ... because the Labor Party tries to treat the Territory as it treats the rest of Australia regardless of our historical situation.
Mr Bell: Good grief! How short a memory you have, Daryl!
Mr SPEAKER: Order!
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Mr MANZIE: The member for MacDonnell makes a great deal of noise. He is embarrassed by the utterances of his party's spokesperson on housing ...
Mr Bell: No.
Mr MANZIE: ... and he is trying to prevent the community from being reminded of Labor's abysmal performance in the housing area.
We had to cop means testing. As a result, at the present time, 20% of housing is still publicly owned. That is a disgraceful situation. In other parts of the country, about 5% of housing is owned publicly. We have a situation in which many Territorians live in publicly-owned housing, yet these people encourage the situation which requires that we move to full market rentals. In the Territory - again, because of these historical reasons - market rentals continue to be very high. At present, we have problems turning off land for residential development because of the native title requirements. We warned the federal government that those requirements would slow down the release of land. The mechanisms put in place prohibit movement of land and increase the costs. Did members opposite examine that? Did they support changes to the administrative processes in relation to native title to enable land to continue to be turned off? They certainly did not.
Historically, we have massive public ownership of housing. At that time, the Labor leader went to Canberra to ensure that the federal government changed the loan scheme. The Labor Party supported a process that saw housing funding to the Territory drop from $56m to $13m. We had to move to market rentals. Since Hon Warren Snowdon has been the federal member for the Northern Territory, we have seen an abysmal performance by the federal Labor government in regard to housing. That was the icing on the cake.
The Northern Territory was the last state or territory to sign the Commonwealth State Housing Agreement. Why did we sign it? Because we were told that, if we did not sign it, we would receive nothing - not a brass razoo. What a way to negotiate! The Commonwealth said that, if we did not sign, we would miss out altogether. Therefore, rather than miss out even on the miserly $2m, we signed. At present, we are renegotiating the agreement. Would members believe that the Commonwealth's first offer meant that we would have to write a cheque to it for $6.5m? Do members reckon that we will cop that? No way!
What do we hear from the opposition? They say that we are not negotiating a very good deal. The member for Fannie Bay has a great deal to learn. I ask her to be very careful about what she says publicly because some of her public announcements have caused a great deal of heartache to Territorians. I remind her of the claims she made about pensioner rents. She went on radio and said that pensioner rents would rise by $60-odd a week. Many pensioners were shattered to hear that. It caused them a great deal of heartache. She has to be careful. She has a job to do now, and she has to do some research and be a little honest.
Mr Bell: You have never done any of that. You are the laziest minister this government has ever seen!
Mr Bailey: That is why you are in the back row.
Page 689
Mr SPEAKER: Order!
Mr MANZIE: If she intends to be an apologist for the behaviour of the Australian Labor Party in the federal government and for the federal member, Warren Snowdon, she will be attacked for it. I deplore those comments and I ask her to do a little research.
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Last updated: 09 Aug 2016