Dr LIM - 1994-10-06
Yesterday, the member for Arafura raised questions regarding the funding of an independent health service at the Urapuntja community in central Australia. The minister has advised this Assembly previously about his negotiations with the federal Minister for Human Services and Health on funding for Aboriginal health in the Territory. Can the minister provide any additional information on these negotiations?
ANSWER
Mr Speaker, it was actually of some interest yesterday to hear the member for Arafura ask the question of the Chief Minister. I think it would be of further interest to Territorians if the member for Arafura released the paper bagging this government that he presented to the ALP National Conference in Hobart, if he has not done so already. I think Territorians would like the opportunity to scrutinise what he said. It is very comfortable for members to travel interstate and deliver a paper far from their constituency and hope that it is not recorded, that it will be overlooked by Territorians, and that the opportunity for them to scrutinise it will not be provided. I would like to see that paper and I ask the member for Arafura to tell Territorians precisely what he told the ALP machine in Hobart.
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In relation to comments in respect of the Urapuntja community, these are matters that I had taken up with the previous federal Minister for Health, the then Senator Richardson, and more recently with Dr Carmen Lawrence, the federal Minister for Human Services and Health. It is very interesting to look at what the response from the federal government has been and at the lack of support from the ALP machine in the Northern Territory for what we are trying to achieve to improve the delivery of health services to people in the Northern Territory, in particular to Aboriginal people.
I wrote to the federal minister on 22 December last year. As I have indicated previously in this House, that letter was not the only occasion on which I presented my concerns and what I consider to be ways that we can jointly overcome the problems with the delivery of services to Aboriginal people in remote communities. It will be of interest to members opposite to learn that the letter that I wrote on 22 December 1993 was responded to on 2 May this year by Hon Carmen Lawrence. That illustrates the political imperative that the federal government places on Aboriginal health rather than the imperative of addressing the particular issues involved with improving health services to remote Territorians.
More recently, in fact on 28 September, I received a letter from Dr Lawrence, and this should be considered in the context of letters that I have tabled previously, with accompanying documents, to spell out to Dr Lawrence precisely what I consider to be the difficulties that we face, not only in respect of Aboriginal health, but generally in the provision of infrastructure in Aboriginal communities to enable us to begin to address the issues cooperatively and overcome the difficulties with overlap and duplication of services provided by ATSIC, the Commonwealth and ourselves. The central part of my approaches to the federal government has been related to the need for us to work cooperatively, and I have suggested to the federal minister, not only in writing but directly at meetings and on other occasions that I have had to speak to her face to face, that we should get together to talk about how we may solve the problems and use the expertise that we have in the Northern Territory. It should be borne in mind that it is the professionals in the department, the people who deliver the services, who have the best experience, the best knowledge and the best information that can be provided to the government in relation to how we may solve some of the problems.
Dr Lawrence's letter to me of 28 September referred to additional funds available this year. That is the $500m that was previously the 'billion bucks' that Richardson promised to solve the health problems after he had visited Katherine. He installed a tap and a mobile dunny to solve the problem in what, in fact, was a non-existent community, and the billion dollars was reduced to $500m and was to be spread over a number of years. I quote from the minister's letter:
Additional funds available this year for primary health care services will be allocated on the basis of advice to Mr Tickner and myself from a joint planning committee.
The committee has membership drawn from relevant Commonwealth departments, Aboriginal health services and the National Health and Medical Research Council.
This further entrenches the very problem that we have faced all along with the provision of services to Aboriginal people - the advice is all from Canberra, far removed from where the problems are and far removed from the expertise and experience of the professionals who have
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the ability to inform government in a comprehensive way. The decisions have been made by Carmen Lawrence notwithstanding that, on a number of occasions, she has written to me saying that we should get together to discuss these matters and find cooperative arrangements to deal with the issues. Her letter continued:
It is important to ensure that initiatives taken by governments promote a more coherent and coordinated approach to planning and service delivery for health services.
That is despite the fact that, in the same letter, she stated that she had decided already where the funding will go and had attached a long list of what those priorities will be. On one page, we have sweetness and light and cooperation for the coordination of services. On the next page, the letter indicates that we should ignore the first page because the priorities are determined already. On page 3, she said: 'It will be useful for me to receive any general advice on the types of services and strategies that you believe would be successful in addressing particular problems'. That was provided in detail to Dr Lawrence in April. There was no response.
If the member for Arafura wants to go to the ALP National Conference in Hobart and hope that his approach is not exposed to Territorians, he should obtain the facts before he goes. There is little point in his going interstate and bleating about what he perceives the Territory government to be doing, even though he is uninformed on the matter, and then returning and, by way of a question to the Chief Minister yesterday, inferring that it is the Territory government that is wrong. He had the opportunity in Hobart to talk to Dr Lawrence. He had the information ...
Mr Bailey: You have been in government for 20 years. Go and look at the health, education and housing conditions in those communities.
Mr REED: You are on the nose with your boss. Why don't you take a little notice of what is being said. Because you do not have the ability to sit there quietly and listen to what is explained to you ...
Mr Bailey: I have sat here quietly listening to the garbage that you have been spouting for the last 10 minutes.
Mr REED: ... your mob go to Hobart to put that position.
The federal minister wrote me a letter that I received on 28 September. The letter stated: 'In view of the constraints of the 1994-95 budget cycle, I would appreciate a response by 23 September 1994'. The response was required 4 days before the letter was written. That is the type of problem that we have with Dr Lawrence and the federal government. I must say that the only person who has been cooperative of late is the Deputy Chairman of ATSIC, Mr Charlie Perkins, who came to see me last week with concerns that he had in relation to where the funding was spent. From that discussion, it appears that the money to be spent from the additional funds to be provided by the federal government this year is $25m of its $500m on a national basis. That will not hit the bottom of the bucket. It seems that only $1m of that will be made available to the Northern Territory.
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Mr Bell: Don't you have responsibility for health?
Mr Bailey: Don't you spend any money of your own out there?
Mr REED: $1m would not enable us to treat even 20 renal dialysis patients.
Mr Bailey: However, the $120m spent on this building would have gone a long way to helping remote communities, wouldn't it?
A member interjecting.
Mr REED: It is another $53 000 a year to provide the services for one patient. Effectively, what the Commonwealth government is doing this year is supplying an additional $1m for Aboriginal health. This is what is available of the former Senator Richardson's $1000m and of Carmen Lawrence's $500m. It is an absolute disgrace. That is the message that the member for Arafura should have taken to Hobart ...
Mr Bailey: What are you providing, Mike?
Mr REED: It is incumbent on him to provide his full statement to Territorians to enable them to see precisely what the Leader of the Opposition and the 6-pack that stands behind him really have in mind for Territorians.
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ANSWER
Mr Speaker, it was actually of some interest yesterday to hear the member for Arafura ask the question of the Chief Minister. I think it would be of further interest to Territorians if the member for Arafura released the paper bagging this government that he presented to the ALP National Conference in Hobart, if he has not done so already. I think Territorians would like the opportunity to scrutinise what he said. It is very comfortable for members to travel interstate and deliver a paper far from their constituency and hope that it is not recorded, that it will be overlooked by Territorians, and that the opportunity for them to scrutinise it will not be provided. I would like to see that paper and I ask the member for Arafura to tell Territorians precisely what he told the ALP machine in Hobart.
Page 189
In relation to comments in respect of the Urapuntja community, these are matters that I had taken up with the previous federal Minister for Health, the then Senator Richardson, and more recently with Dr Carmen Lawrence, the federal Minister for Human Services and Health. It is very interesting to look at what the response from the federal government has been and at the lack of support from the ALP machine in the Northern Territory for what we are trying to achieve to improve the delivery of health services to people in the Northern Territory, in particular to Aboriginal people.
I wrote to the federal minister on 22 December last year. As I have indicated previously in this House, that letter was not the only occasion on which I presented my concerns and what I consider to be ways that we can jointly overcome the problems with the delivery of services to Aboriginal people in remote communities. It will be of interest to members opposite to learn that the letter that I wrote on 22 December 1993 was responded to on 2 May this year by Hon Carmen Lawrence. That illustrates the political imperative that the federal government places on Aboriginal health rather than the imperative of addressing the particular issues involved with improving health services to remote Territorians.
More recently, in fact on 28 September, I received a letter from Dr Lawrence, and this should be considered in the context of letters that I have tabled previously, with accompanying documents, to spell out to Dr Lawrence precisely what I consider to be the difficulties that we face, not only in respect of Aboriginal health, but generally in the provision of infrastructure in Aboriginal communities to enable us to begin to address the issues cooperatively and overcome the difficulties with overlap and duplication of services provided by ATSIC, the Commonwealth and ourselves. The central part of my approaches to the federal government has been related to the need for us to work cooperatively, and I have suggested to the federal minister, not only in writing but directly at meetings and on other occasions that I have had to speak to her face to face, that we should get together to talk about how we may solve the problems and use the expertise that we have in the Northern Territory. It should be borne in mind that it is the professionals in the department, the people who deliver the services, who have the best experience, the best knowledge and the best information that can be provided to the government in relation to how we may solve some of the problems.
Dr Lawrence's letter to me of 28 September referred to additional funds available this year. That is the $500m that was previously the 'billion bucks' that Richardson promised to solve the health problems after he had visited Katherine. He installed a tap and a mobile dunny to solve the problem in what, in fact, was a non-existent community, and the billion dollars was reduced to $500m and was to be spread over a number of years. I quote from the minister's letter:
Additional funds available this year for primary health care services will be allocated on the basis of advice to Mr Tickner and myself from a joint planning committee.
The committee has membership drawn from relevant Commonwealth departments, Aboriginal health services and the National Health and Medical Research Council.
This further entrenches the very problem that we have faced all along with the provision of services to Aboriginal people - the advice is all from Canberra, far removed from where the problems are and far removed from the expertise and experience of the professionals who have
Page 190
the ability to inform government in a comprehensive way. The decisions have been made by Carmen Lawrence notwithstanding that, on a number of occasions, she has written to me saying that we should get together to discuss these matters and find cooperative arrangements to deal with the issues. Her letter continued:
It is important to ensure that initiatives taken by governments promote a more coherent and coordinated approach to planning and service delivery for health services.
That is despite the fact that, in the same letter, she stated that she had decided already where the funding will go and had attached a long list of what those priorities will be. On one page, we have sweetness and light and cooperation for the coordination of services. On the next page, the letter indicates that we should ignore the first page because the priorities are determined already. On page 3, she said: 'It will be useful for me to receive any general advice on the types of services and strategies that you believe would be successful in addressing particular problems'. That was provided in detail to Dr Lawrence in April. There was no response.
If the member for Arafura wants to go to the ALP National Conference in Hobart and hope that his approach is not exposed to Territorians, he should obtain the facts before he goes. There is little point in his going interstate and bleating about what he perceives the Territory government to be doing, even though he is uninformed on the matter, and then returning and, by way of a question to the Chief Minister yesterday, inferring that it is the Territory government that is wrong. He had the opportunity in Hobart to talk to Dr Lawrence. He had the information ...
Mr Bailey: You have been in government for 20 years. Go and look at the health, education and housing conditions in those communities.
Mr REED: You are on the nose with your boss. Why don't you take a little notice of what is being said. Because you do not have the ability to sit there quietly and listen to what is explained to you ...
Mr Bailey: I have sat here quietly listening to the garbage that you have been spouting for the last 10 minutes.
Mr REED: ... your mob go to Hobart to put that position.
The federal minister wrote me a letter that I received on 28 September. The letter stated: 'In view of the constraints of the 1994-95 budget cycle, I would appreciate a response by 23 September 1994'. The response was required 4 days before the letter was written. That is the type of problem that we have with Dr Lawrence and the federal government. I must say that the only person who has been cooperative of late is the Deputy Chairman of ATSIC, Mr Charlie Perkins, who came to see me last week with concerns that he had in relation to where the funding was spent. From that discussion, it appears that the money to be spent from the additional funds to be provided by the federal government this year is $25m of its $500m on a national basis. That will not hit the bottom of the bucket. It seems that only $1m of that will be made available to the Northern Territory.
Page 191
Mr Bell: Don't you have responsibility for health?
Mr Bailey: Don't you spend any money of your own out there?
Mr REED: $1m would not enable us to treat even 20 renal dialysis patients.
Mr Bailey: However, the $120m spent on this building would have gone a long way to helping remote communities, wouldn't it?
A member interjecting.
Mr REED: It is another $53 000 a year to provide the services for one patient. Effectively, what the Commonwealth government is doing this year is supplying an additional $1m for Aboriginal health. This is what is available of the former Senator Richardson's $1000m and of Carmen Lawrence's $500m. It is an absolute disgrace. That is the message that the member for Arafura should have taken to Hobart ...
Mr Bailey: What are you providing, Mike?
Mr REED: It is incumbent on him to provide his full statement to Territorians to enable them to see precisely what the Leader of the Opposition and the 6-pack that stands behind him really have in mind for Territorians.
Page 192
Last updated: 09 Aug 2016