Mr MILLS - 2000-06-13
Last week the Chief Minister visited East Timor and met with a number of key figures. I am particularly interested in your meetings with Sergio De Mello, the Special Representative to the Secretary General UNTAET and the NT Government/UNTAET Joint Committee Meeting. What were the outcomes of these meetings, and based on what you saw can you inform members of this House the tasks that lay ahead for the people of East Timor?
ANSWER
Mr Speaker, I thank the honourable member for his question. As members would be aware, the visit last week to East Timor was my first visit as Chief Minister. I had put off visiting that area until such time it had become stabilised because I believe you can get in the way on these sorts of visits. I was quite dismayed that I was assigned something like three bodyguards which I thought was unnecessary, but it exemplifies the problems and the disruption it causes to these people when VIPs visit.
However, it was a visit that was rescheduled after my return from China after meeting the Prime Minister. I took the opportunity of going on that visit for four reasons. Firstly, to view the progress in East Timor from my own perspective and speak with key officials. Secondly, to visit NT businesses and gauge their concerns and talk to them about issues that are affecting their businesses. Thirdly, to open the Northern Territory government office in Dili and fourthly, to attend the Northern Territory government UNTAET second consultation conference.
I was very pleased to be able to be briefed by Major General Mike Smith, the Deputy Commander of the Peacekeeping force. I had discussions with Xanana Gusmao, Sergio De Mello, the Secretary-General’s special representative, Bishop Belo and also John Christian Katey who was the Deputy Secretary-General’s special representative and who also chaired the NT government UNTAET consultative meeting.
In terms of NT businesses, I was able to visit Parmalat, which is named by Paul’s parent company but staffed by Paul’s staff from the Darwin office of Paul’s, who are producing milk products and soft drink products and also fresh water in Dili; Jape Holdings; and Harvey Norman which is establishing a store there in a building that is owned by the Lay family from Darwin; Cenat Construction, who are a consortium of local businesses; and Perkins and Rooney’s Shipping. These were the main businesses I spoke to.
In general terms, as far as doing business is concerned in East Timor, I would have to say to honourable members that I was quite dismayed by the lack of progress in Dili. I certainly expected far more progress to have been made. I am not pointing the finger at anyone. I understand from talking to Sergio De Mello the many problems the UN authorities have in Dili and East Timor in general. But when one goes to the main port, a port that has seen heavy work right from the outset of the miliary involvement and today, with coastal traders and Perkins and Rooney’s shipping using that port, large containers being off-loaded there, there is not even any improvement on the hard stand. I would have thought that would have been one of the first tasks that would have been done.
There is no high pressure water connected to the port and that creates major problems for the shippers who are sending containers back to Darwin, for example, because they have additional costs with quarantine requirements as they cannot adequately wash down and clean those containers in Dili.
But that sort of example of the port, where up until a couple of months ago those containers were being moved around in very muddy and dangerous conditions, I would have thought would have been one of the first priorities that the UN would have put into that area. It was very disconcerting to me to see that that effort had not been made. To my mind it exemplifies the problems that are there and the lack of progress in Dili in particular. Thousands of people queuing up each day to try and get jobs, problems with the lack of employment being available in Dili as opposed to the large amount of optimism that was there, less and less so I think from the East Timorese, with regards to the opportunities that the UN would provide. Certainly there were law and order concerns at the port and at other areas where people who are unemployed are having all kinds of problems.
The population of Dili has essentially doubled, and that in itself is causing a large problem for the authorities to deal with. They have to find ways of encouraging the people to go back to their own areas.
For Territory businesses that are working there, I take my hat off to those I visited. They are working under very trying conditions. The accommodation of the workers is extremely sparse and hard. Some of them are accompanied by their spouses, which is again laudable but difficult for those involved there. All of them are working with a sense of optimism, but all of them are quite frustrated by the lack of progress that they are seeing from the UN authorities, particularly when it comes to land tenure.
The major issue, to my mind, is to get more employment into Dili in particular, and that employment alone would come through the efforts of the United Nations authorities and what they can essentially provide in setting up a civil service, and also the encouragement of the businesses who are setting up there, so that they get a sense of security and tenure, and therefore will be encouraged to see their own involvement in the longer term, and therefore employ more locals.
That will never happen whilst the land tenure system is so tentative at the moment. I raised that issue with Sergio De Mello, and the UN recognises that issue and are doing their very best to deal with it.
The other problem that concerned me was the fact that the UN budget is very small. I received briefings on their budget. It was quoted incorrectly in yesterday’s paper. The budget was about $43m for the UN’s recurrent expenditure, $15m for capital expenditure and an additional $68m from the World Bank. That to my mind is pretty small beer in comparison to the issues that have to be dealt with and also the expectations of the people that far more money would be coming from the donor countries. But that is the budget that has been set down and I believe that with the Lisbon Conference occurring shortly, where donors will commit for supporting that budget and in other areas, it remains to be seen whether or not that budget is increased, but certainly it is a very tight budget for all of the work that needs to be done.
In terms of the NT government effort, I was very pleased to see Owen Peake and the Power and Water Authority people who are working to set up the power infrastructure in Dili. They have done a tremendous job in bringing many, many power stations on line right throughout the country. There was an issue with regards to their own security of contract but that issue, I am pleased to say, was resolved whilst I was there.
Xanana Gusmao is frustrated that he is not involved in many of the UN decision making processes as much as he would like but certainly Mr De Mello has set up a consultative committee which includes the CNRT people and attempts to involve them as far as possible. But there are problems within the CNRT and I understand some of the militia groups are already moving out of their camp to ones up in the hills, so there are problems there in terms of stability.
Bishop Belo, as always, is a lovely and inspirational gentleman to speak to. His main issue was with regards to education in Dili and East Timor and getting the children to school. There is a separate issue with regard to higher education and the university in Dili and I will be talking to our Vice-Chancellor to see what we are doing and what additional we can do to assist getting higher education facilities in place. At the grass roots level Bishop Belo told me simple things like desks for children to sit at are in extremely short supply and I have asked the minister for education to write to all state education ministers to see if there are surplus desks available throughout Australia that we could gather up and send there.
It is those small things that seem to me to be most needed. It is frustrating from my point of view to see the enormous support that is provided to UN personnel and other ex-patriot personnel working in East Timor but, sadly, simple things like basic tools, hammers, shovels, picks, saws, wheelbarrows, those items that people need to carry out essential work on their own houses, etc, and in plying the fields are almost non-existent. There is much Territorians and Australians can do in a small way to assist the effort in East Timor.
Overall a very interesting visit, but to my mind I was disillusioned in many respects with the slow progress in East Timor and whilst I have been impressed by the Territory business effort, I would say that investment in East Timor needs to be approached very cautiously. That is what the office we have established in East Timor is designed to do, to provide advice, assistance and liaison with Territory businesses before they commit themselves to efforts in East Timor.
ANSWER
Mr Speaker, I thank the honourable member for his question. As members would be aware, the visit last week to East Timor was my first visit as Chief Minister. I had put off visiting that area until such time it had become stabilised because I believe you can get in the way on these sorts of visits. I was quite dismayed that I was assigned something like three bodyguards which I thought was unnecessary, but it exemplifies the problems and the disruption it causes to these people when VIPs visit.
However, it was a visit that was rescheduled after my return from China after meeting the Prime Minister. I took the opportunity of going on that visit for four reasons. Firstly, to view the progress in East Timor from my own perspective and speak with key officials. Secondly, to visit NT businesses and gauge their concerns and talk to them about issues that are affecting their businesses. Thirdly, to open the Northern Territory government office in Dili and fourthly, to attend the Northern Territory government UNTAET second consultation conference.
I was very pleased to be able to be briefed by Major General Mike Smith, the Deputy Commander of the Peacekeeping force. I had discussions with Xanana Gusmao, Sergio De Mello, the Secretary-General’s special representative, Bishop Belo and also John Christian Katey who was the Deputy Secretary-General’s special representative and who also chaired the NT government UNTAET consultative meeting.
In terms of NT businesses, I was able to visit Parmalat, which is named by Paul’s parent company but staffed by Paul’s staff from the Darwin office of Paul’s, who are producing milk products and soft drink products and also fresh water in Dili; Jape Holdings; and Harvey Norman which is establishing a store there in a building that is owned by the Lay family from Darwin; Cenat Construction, who are a consortium of local businesses; and Perkins and Rooney’s Shipping. These were the main businesses I spoke to.
In general terms, as far as doing business is concerned in East Timor, I would have to say to honourable members that I was quite dismayed by the lack of progress in Dili. I certainly expected far more progress to have been made. I am not pointing the finger at anyone. I understand from talking to Sergio De Mello the many problems the UN authorities have in Dili and East Timor in general. But when one goes to the main port, a port that has seen heavy work right from the outset of the miliary involvement and today, with coastal traders and Perkins and Rooney’s shipping using that port, large containers being off-loaded there, there is not even any improvement on the hard stand. I would have thought that would have been one of the first tasks that would have been done.
There is no high pressure water connected to the port and that creates major problems for the shippers who are sending containers back to Darwin, for example, because they have additional costs with quarantine requirements as they cannot adequately wash down and clean those containers in Dili.
But that sort of example of the port, where up until a couple of months ago those containers were being moved around in very muddy and dangerous conditions, I would have thought would have been one of the first priorities that the UN would have put into that area. It was very disconcerting to me to see that that effort had not been made. To my mind it exemplifies the problems that are there and the lack of progress in Dili in particular. Thousands of people queuing up each day to try and get jobs, problems with the lack of employment being available in Dili as opposed to the large amount of optimism that was there, less and less so I think from the East Timorese, with regards to the opportunities that the UN would provide. Certainly there were law and order concerns at the port and at other areas where people who are unemployed are having all kinds of problems.
The population of Dili has essentially doubled, and that in itself is causing a large problem for the authorities to deal with. They have to find ways of encouraging the people to go back to their own areas.
For Territory businesses that are working there, I take my hat off to those I visited. They are working under very trying conditions. The accommodation of the workers is extremely sparse and hard. Some of them are accompanied by their spouses, which is again laudable but difficult for those involved there. All of them are working with a sense of optimism, but all of them are quite frustrated by the lack of progress that they are seeing from the UN authorities, particularly when it comes to land tenure.
The major issue, to my mind, is to get more employment into Dili in particular, and that employment alone would come through the efforts of the United Nations authorities and what they can essentially provide in setting up a civil service, and also the encouragement of the businesses who are setting up there, so that they get a sense of security and tenure, and therefore will be encouraged to see their own involvement in the longer term, and therefore employ more locals.
That will never happen whilst the land tenure system is so tentative at the moment. I raised that issue with Sergio De Mello, and the UN recognises that issue and are doing their very best to deal with it.
The other problem that concerned me was the fact that the UN budget is very small. I received briefings on their budget. It was quoted incorrectly in yesterday’s paper. The budget was about $43m for the UN’s recurrent expenditure, $15m for capital expenditure and an additional $68m from the World Bank. That to my mind is pretty small beer in comparison to the issues that have to be dealt with and also the expectations of the people that far more money would be coming from the donor countries. But that is the budget that has been set down and I believe that with the Lisbon Conference occurring shortly, where donors will commit for supporting that budget and in other areas, it remains to be seen whether or not that budget is increased, but certainly it is a very tight budget for all of the work that needs to be done.
In terms of the NT government effort, I was very pleased to see Owen Peake and the Power and Water Authority people who are working to set up the power infrastructure in Dili. They have done a tremendous job in bringing many, many power stations on line right throughout the country. There was an issue with regards to their own security of contract but that issue, I am pleased to say, was resolved whilst I was there.
Xanana Gusmao is frustrated that he is not involved in many of the UN decision making processes as much as he would like but certainly Mr De Mello has set up a consultative committee which includes the CNRT people and attempts to involve them as far as possible. But there are problems within the CNRT and I understand some of the militia groups are already moving out of their camp to ones up in the hills, so there are problems there in terms of stability.
Bishop Belo, as always, is a lovely and inspirational gentleman to speak to. His main issue was with regards to education in Dili and East Timor and getting the children to school. There is a separate issue with regard to higher education and the university in Dili and I will be talking to our Vice-Chancellor to see what we are doing and what additional we can do to assist getting higher education facilities in place. At the grass roots level Bishop Belo told me simple things like desks for children to sit at are in extremely short supply and I have asked the minister for education to write to all state education ministers to see if there are surplus desks available throughout Australia that we could gather up and send there.
It is those small things that seem to me to be most needed. It is frustrating from my point of view to see the enormous support that is provided to UN personnel and other ex-patriot personnel working in East Timor but, sadly, simple things like basic tools, hammers, shovels, picks, saws, wheelbarrows, those items that people need to carry out essential work on their own houses, etc, and in plying the fields are almost non-existent. There is much Territorians and Australians can do in a small way to assist the effort in East Timor.
Overall a very interesting visit, but to my mind I was disillusioned in many respects with the slow progress in East Timor and whilst I have been impressed by the Territory business effort, I would say that investment in East Timor needs to be approached very cautiously. That is what the office we have established in East Timor is designed to do, to provide advice, assistance and liaison with Territory businesses before they commit themselves to efforts in East Timor.
Last updated: 09 Aug 2016